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Post by towerman on Apr 26, 2019 10:53:45 GMT
Abellio have stated new trains when they take over MML.More ICE bi-modes?Also what will happen to the Cl222s?Maybe they'll replace the 125s on the ECML.
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Post by snoggle on Apr 26, 2019 12:01:57 GMT
Abellio have stated new trains when they take over MML.More ICE bi-modes?Also what will happen to the Cl222s?Maybe they'll replace the 125s on the ECML. Err no one knows for certain. Once the contract "standstill" period is expired then Abellio should make an announcement about rolling stock orders. That should be imminent. Hitachi have to be a strong contender for bi-modes but Bombardier apparently have a design. There are also swirling rumours that Class 180s may be used to remove some but not all HSTs from the MML to partly meet the DDA deadline. However the class 180s are notoriously unreliable so this may be a very poor choice on Abellio's part. There is no need for class 222s to go to the ECML as the entire East Coast fleet will be replaced by Hitachi Azumas. They come into service in May on Leeds services. There has been a load of speculation about what happens with the DMU fleet for East Midlands as it is supposed to be largely replaced but probably not with new trains just old ones from other franchises - more 158s, 156s and 170s. There is also the question of what will work on the split Liverpool - Norwich service and who gets the western half of the service.
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Post by snowman on Apr 26, 2019 12:23:20 GMT
Abellio have stated new trains when they take over MML.More ICE bi-modes?Also what will happen to the Cl222s?Maybe they'll replace the 125s on the ECML. Err no one knows for certain. Once the contract "standstill" period is expired then Abellio should make an announcement about rolling stock orders. That should be imminent. Hitachi have to be a strong contender for bi-modes but Bombardier apparently have a design. There are also swirling rumours that Class 180s may be used to remove some but not all HSTs from the MML to partly meet the DDA deadline. However the class 180s are notoriously unreliable so this may be a very poor choice on Abellio's part. There is no need for class 222s to go to the ECML as the entire East Coast fleet will be replaced by Hitachi Azumas. They come into service in May on Leeds services. There has been a load of speculation about what happens with the DMU fleet for East Midlands as it is supposed to be largely replaced but probably not with new trains just old ones from other franchises - more 158s, 156s and 170s. There is also the question of what will work on the split Liverpool - Norwich service and who gets the western half of the service. Another contender is Talgo. They have a bi-mode called Talgo Dual 250 (although the 250km/h would be excessive, until parts of the Northern powerhouse High speed line open, if it ever gets built) Talgo are building a train factory in Fife (on site of decommissioned Longannet power station, near Kincardine), and an Innovation centre in Chesterfield (right in heart of East Midlands territory). Possibly Innovation centre is just a name masking a new maintenance facility pending announcement. Proposed Chesterfield site is former Hartington colliery (between Staveley and Barrow Hill). Obviously Coal power stations and collieries have (or had) rail links and site is roughly where Staveley depot would be on phase 2B of HS2
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Post by MetrolineGA1511 on Apr 27, 2019 5:14:25 GMT
Abellio have stated new trains when they take over MML.More ICE bi-modes?Also what will happen to the Cl222s?Maybe they'll replace the 125s on the ECML. Err no one knows for certain. Once the contract "standstill" period is expired then Abellio should make an announcement about rolling stock orders. That should be imminent. Hitachi have to be a strong contender for bi-modes but Bombardier apparently have a design. There are also swirling rumours that Class 180s may be used to remove some but not all HSTs from the MML to partly meet the DDA deadline. However the class 180s are notoriously unreliable so this may be a very poor choice on Abellio's part. There is no need for class 222s to go to the ECML as the entire East Coast fleet will be replaced by Hitachi Azumas. They come into service in May on Leeds services. There has been a load of speculation about what happens with the DMU fleet for East Midlands as it is supposed to be largely replaced but probably not with new trains just old ones from other franchises - more 158s, 156s and 170s. There is also the question of what will work on the split Liverpool - Norwich service and who gets the western half of the service. I think the Liverpool - Nottingham service will be run by TPE. They run the other Manchester - Stockport - Sheffield trains and will soon have spare class 185s when new trains take over the north Trans Pennine route.
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Post by MoEnviro on May 3, 2019 18:07:44 GMT
Once the contract "standstill" period is expired then Abellio should make an announcement about rolling stock orders. Queue 'de-rail' headlines, as the standstill period has been extended by a week following fresh information over the "leak of information on a bid tabled by Stagecoach, the existing franchise-holder, to Abellio, the Dutch-owned operator that won the new contract. " Meanwhile Stagecoach have outlined there objections to the DfT’s pension terms. See
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Post by YY13VKP on May 8, 2019 17:28:35 GMT
Abellio have stated new trains when they take over MML.More ICE bi-modes?Also what will happen to the Cl222s?Maybe they'll replace the 125s on the ECML. Err no one knows for certain. Once the contract "standstill" period is expired then Abellio should make an announcement about rolling stock orders. That should be imminent. Certainly won't be now as Stagecoach have launched a legal challenge against the DfT right at the end of the standstill period. www.theguardian.com/business/2019/may/08/stagecoach-launches-legal-action-over-rail-franchise-competition-ban
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Post by snoggle on May 8, 2019 17:40:14 GMT
And with South Eastern and West Coast Partnership challenges also due so that's a nice set of hand grenades lobbed into the DfT!
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Post by snowman on May 8, 2019 18:23:32 GMT
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Post by snoggle on May 8, 2019 18:36:11 GMT
I was being "under-stated". I have no idea what the respective merits of each side's case would be. I can understand Stagecoach being aggrieved but one must assume that they took professional advice on the pensions issue. I'd also assume that they sought, and hopefully obtained, clarification from the DfT about the meaning of the provisions and the DfT's intent. *If* the DfT were evasive or beligerant or something else then Stagecoach may feel they've not been treated fairly but only they and DfT can know that. I've seen DfT's initial response which, unsurprisingly, refers to Stagecoach having deliberately chosen to submit non compliant bids for all three competitions. On the pure basics of how a competitive procurement works you can't expect to stay in the game if your only submission is non compliant. Stagecoach must feel they have *very* compelling evidence about a major failure of process that could outweigh their non compliant bid submission. We see in due course what the courts think. Meanwhile Abellio are left twiddling their thumbs in respect of East Midlands until a judge takes a decision as to whether the award can proceed or not. Shades of a repeat of what happened with Siemens and the Picc Line rolling stock contract.
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Post by snowman on May 8, 2019 18:59:21 GMT
I was being "under-stated". I have no idea what the respective merits of each side's case would be. I can understand Stagecoach being aggrieved but one must assume that they took professional advice on the pensions issue. I'd also assume that they sought, and hopefully obtained, clarification from the DfT about the meaning of the provisions and the DfT's intent. *If* the DfT were evasive or beligerant or something else then Stagecoach may feel they've not been treated fairly but only they and DfT can know that. I've seen DfT's initial response which, unsurprisingly, refers to Stagecoach having deliberately chosen to submit non compliant bids for all three competitions. On the pure basics of how a competitive procurement works you can't expect to stay in the game if your only submission is non compliant. Stagecoach must feel they have *very* compelling evidence about a major failure of process that could outweigh their non compliant bid submission. We see in due course what the courts think. Meanwhile Abellio are left twiddling their thumbs in respect of East Midlands until a judge takes a decision as to whether the award can proceed or not. Shades of a repeat of what happened with Siemens and the Picc Line rolling stock contract. Apparently the Rail Minister, Andrew Jones has since admitted (yesterday) that all of the bidders (including Abellio) were also not compliant (but DfT decided that Abellio was non material). Having made a big thing of Stagecoach bid being not compliant, DfT is on a rather sticky wicket if it is determining in an opaque way what level of non compliance it accepts. www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2019-05-07a.453.5
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Post by snoggle on May 8, 2019 19:37:06 GMT
Apparently the Rail Minister, Andrew Jones has since admitted (yesterday) that all of the bidders (including Abellio) were also not compliant (but DfT decided that Abellio was non material). Having made a big thing of Stagecoach bid being not compliant, DfT is on a rather sticky wicket if it is determining in an opaque way what level of non compliance it accepts. www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2019-05-07a.453.5 Oh dear that doesn't sound terribly good. Only wriggle room they'll have is the "non materiality" was made clear in the evaluation criteria up front. If it's a minor scoring issue then perhaps not too bad but as you say you can't make this stuff up as you go along! You'd think the DfT would have learnt by now. (rolls eyes)
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2019 8:33:37 GMT
There is a very interesting article on the whole process on the Abellio website. It would seem Abellio is determined to press ahead with plans but will not reveal until the stand still is over. I am assuming the stand still is extended indefinetly until the court case is over. www.abellio.com/news/abellio-statement-east-midlands-franchise-award
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2019 8:39:18 GMT
I was being "under-stated". I have no idea what the respective merits of each side's case would be. I can understand Stagecoach being aggrieved but one must assume that they took professional advice on the pensions issue. I'd also assume that they sought, and hopefully obtained, clarification from the DfT about the meaning of the provisions and the DfT's intent. *If* the DfT were evasive or beligerant or something else then Stagecoach may feel they've not been treated fairly but only they and DfT can know that. I've seen DfT's initial response which, unsurprisingly, refers to Stagecoach having deliberately chosen to submit non compliant bids for all three competitions. On the pure basics of how a competitive procurement works you can't expect to stay in the game if your only submission is non compliant. Stagecoach must feel they have *very* compelling evidence about a major failure of process that could outweigh their non compliant bid submission. We see in due course what the courts think. Meanwhile Abellio are left twiddling their thumbs in respect of East Midlands until a judge takes a decision as to whether the award can proceed or not. Shades of a repeat of what happened with Siemens and the Picc Line rolling stock contract. Apparently the Rail Minister, Andrew Jones has since admitted (yesterday) that all of the bidders (including Abellio) were also not compliant (but DfT decided that Abellio was non material). Having made a big thing of Stagecoach bid being not compliant, DfT is on a rather sticky wicket if it is determining in an opaque way what level of non compliance it accepts. www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2019-05-07a.453.5Indeed . And also, this allegation ..”. Stagecoach is also angered that information on Stagecoach’s bid for the East Midlands franchise was leaked to Abellio before the Dutch company won the contract.” Now, if I were in charge of Abellio’s bid, and information on other bids was received, the only honest thing to do would be to report it. If they didn’t, or worse, sanctioned it then Abellio are in serious trouble indeed. Edit..just read the Abellio statement above. Obviously denying wrong doing and had reported it, and apparently no one read the documents sent “by mistake”.
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Post by snowman on May 9, 2019 8:53:10 GMT
There is a very interesting article on the whole process on the Abellio website. It would seem Abellio is determined to press ahead with plans but will not reveal until the stand still is over. I am assuming the stand still is extended indefinetly until the court case is over. www.abellio.com/news/abellio-statement-east-midlands-franchise-awardThe plans are on DfT website (although doesn't define what a modern train is, could cover a 30 year old diesel 158) Lots of sections per line, but these are ones affecting London services Sheffield - Derby - Londonfrom May 2020, modern diesel trains will begin to replace aging HSTs. Timetable changes will enable faster journey times from December 2020 earlier and later train service each day to East Midlands Parkway enabling better airport connectivity earlier and later trains to and from London, with a more regular evening service between London and Sheffield brand-new 125mph trains will be introduced into service from April 2022 with: more reliable service improved comfort passenger information system free on-board Wi-Fi at-seat power sockets USB points air conditioning tables at all seats increased luggage space on-board cycle storage Nottingham - Londonfrom May 2020, modern diesel trains will replace some aging HSTs. Timetable changes will enable faster journey times from December 2020 an additional train to Kettering will increase services to 2 per hour earlier and later train service each day to East Midlands Parkway enabling better airport connectivity brand-new 125mph trains will be introduced into service from April 2022 with: more reliable service improved comfort passenger information system free on-board Wi-Fi at-seat power sockets USB points air conditioning tables at all seats increased luggage space on-board cycle storage London - Corbydedicated Corby - St Pancras express service will be introduced from December 2020 with 12-car trains in the peaks Corby - London service doubled to 2 trains per hour all day Kettering, Luton and Luton Airport Parkway services provided with 2 trains per hour for most of the day enhanced Sunday service throughout the route with regular direct Sunday services between London and Corby refurbished modern express trains from December 2020, with: increased capacity more reliable service improved comfort passenger information system free on-board Wi-Fi at-seat power sockets USB points air conditioning tables at all seats increased luggage space on-board cycle storage London - Oakham - Melton Mowbrayafter electrification of the Corby route there will continue to be direct service each way between London and Oakham and Melton Mowbray once each weekday, via Corby this will be operated with brand new 125mph trains when these are introduced from April 2022 with: more reliable service improved comfort passenger information system free on-board Wi-Fi at-seat power sockets USB points air conditioning tables at all seats increased luggage space on-board cycle storage
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Post by SILENCED on May 9, 2019 8:59:10 GMT
Apparently the Rail Minister, Andrew Jones has since admitted (yesterday) that all of the bidders (including Abellio) were also not compliant (but DfT decided that Abellio was non material). Having made a big thing of Stagecoach bid being not compliant, DfT is on a rather sticky wicket if it is determining in an opaque way what level of non compliance it accepts. www.theyworkforyou.com/debates/?id=2019-05-07a.453.5Indeed . And also, this allegation ..”. Stagecoach is also angered that information on Stagecoach’s bid for the East Midlands franchise was leaked to Abellio before the Dutch company won the contract.” Now, if I were in charge of Abellio’s bid, and information on other bids was received, the only honest thing to do would be to report it. If they didn’t, or worse, sanctioned it then Abellio are in serious trouble indeed. Edit..just read the Abellio statement above. Obviously denying wrong doing and had reported it, and apparently no one read the documents sent “by mistake”. Abellio have past form for this in their native Netherlands!
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