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Post by LVF_Admin on Feb 14, 2019 18:56:04 GMT
Or perhaps an Edgware route could instead be extended to Barnet? Maybe reroute the 288 to operate between Barnet and Queensbury, then extend the 303 from Edgware to Broadfields? I am sure there is a reason but logically the 389 and 399 should be one route.
The 383 I feel could be the underused link, maybe I'm wrong? It is a short route an there is potential there.
I quite like the idea of putting the 303 at Broadfields, however the 288 at every 10mins is not in the right form to be extended to Barnet.
Basically a new direct Barnet - Edgware link would be good however I'm not sure any local route in its current form works, 614 excluded. Nothing wrong with the 107 between Barnet & Edgware, lovely scenic route, last time I was on it before today it ran with Metrobuses!!
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Post by busaholic on Feb 14, 2019 19:04:02 GMT
I am sure there is a reason but logically the 389 and 399 should be one route.
The 383 I feel could be the underused link, maybe I'm wrong? It is a short route an there is potential there.
I quite like the idea of putting the 303 at Broadfields, however the 288 at every 10mins is not in the right form to be extended to Barnet.
Basically a new direct Barnet - Edgware link would be good however I'm not sure any local route in its current form works, 614 excluded. Nothing wrong with the 107 between Barnet & Edgware, lovely scenic route, last time I was on it before today it ran with Metrobuses!! Last time I was on it was on an ex-Red Arrow AEC Merlin.
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Post by VMH2452 on Feb 14, 2019 21:05:21 GMT
I am sure there is a reason but logically the 389 and 399 should be one route.
The 383 I feel could be the underused link, maybe I'm wrong? It is a short route an there is potential there.
I quite like the idea of putting the 303 at Broadfields, however the 288 at every 10mins is not in the right form to be extended to Barnet.
Basically a new direct Barnet - Edgware link would be good however I'm not sure any local route in its current form works, 614 excluded. Nothing wrong with the 107 between Barnet & Edgware, lovely scenic route, last time I was on it before today it ran with Metrobuses!! There is nothing wrong other than the length of time it takes, how prone it is to traffic in Borehamwood and more that I can't think of. The 614 probably takes away a lot of revenue away from TfL on this route.
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Post by kmkcheng on Feb 14, 2019 22:20:14 GMT
Nothing wrong with the 107 between Barnet & Edgware, lovely scenic route, last time I was on it before today it ran with Metrobuses!! There is nothing wrong other than the length of time it takes, how prone it is to traffic in Borehamwood and more that I can't think of. The 614 probably takes away a lot of revenue away from TfL on this route. You would be surprised how many people will take the cheaper, more longer option. There is also the option of changing at Stirling Corner between the 107 and 292 which avoids Borehamwood altogether. Looking at the fares, it’s £1.50 on the 107 (with or without 292 as well) one way or £3 return. On the 614, it would cost £4 for a London day ticket but there isn’t a London only single ticket listed on Uno’s website but I presume it’s not cheaper.
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Post by VMH2452 on Feb 14, 2019 22:27:06 GMT
There is nothing wrong other than the length of time it takes, how prone it is to traffic in Borehamwood and more that I can't think of. The 614 probably takes away a lot of revenue away from TfL on this route. You would be surprised how many people will take the cheaper, more longer option. There is also the option of changing at Stirling Corner between the 107 and 292 which avoids Borehamwood altogether. Looking at the fares, it’s £1.50 on the 107 (with or without 292 as well) one way or £3 return. On the 614, it would cost £4 for a London day ticket but there isn’t a London only single ticket listed on Uno’s website but I presume it’s not cheaper. I'm not saying it is any cheaper than the TfL option. My point is that the route that it takes is a long time.
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Post by vjaska on Feb 15, 2019 0:35:55 GMT
You would be surprised how many people will take the cheaper, more longer option. There is also the option of changing at Stirling Corner between the 107 and 292 which avoids Borehamwood altogether. Looking at the fares, it’s £1.50 on the 107 (with or without 292 as well) one way or £3 return. On the 614, it would cost £4 for a London day ticket but there isn’t a London only single ticket listed on Uno’s website but I presume it’s not cheaper. I'm not saying it is any cheaper than the TfL option. My point is that the route that it takes is a long time. It's not exactly running around with fresh air so even with the longer routing, it's clearly valued. The fact most of the route is actually along relatively flowing roads means it's not badly affected when it hits traffic in Barnet, Edgware & Borehamwood.
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Post by uakari on Feb 15, 2019 0:48:25 GMT
I'd say the local campaigning has at least made TfL take pause and go back to the drawing board. In that sense it's a small but significant victory. I wouldn't like to predict the conclusion but my guess is that TfL are going back to see if they can flex the budget somehow to perhaps keep the 384 intact *and* extend it to Edgware. I don't see the cut to the 292 being reversed as that's depdendent on HCC and there's no money coming from there to keep the 292 at current frequencies in the longer term. I don't know Barnet well enough to work out if there is some other combination that is feasible - such as taking part of the 384 route and adding it to another route and using the rump of the 384 as the basis for a new route through to Edgware. There aren't any obvious candidates that match up on frequency - the 383/9/99 are all the wrong frequency or too limited in scope to provide a suitable alternative to the 384. Sending on the 326 to Edgware would make it very long, prone to delays and it's overly frequent. In a sense, and it won't happen, the best thing to do would be to restructure the local Barnet network completely. Call me cynical, but there’s an election next year. Barnet swung massively to the Conservatives in the local government elections last year and it wouldn’t surprise me if we see TfL adopt a less aggressive approach to consultation responses overall in the run up. Finchley, Golders Green and Hendon swung to the Conservatives in the national and local elections, but Chipping Barnet, which would be the area detrimentally affected by the consulted proposals, swung to Labour (at least nationally) to the extent that the Conservative MP almost lost her seat. So in terms of the mayoral election, the area is also likely to be very marginal, which might itself be a reason to tread softly. It seems TfL are determined to 'make better use of the 384' somehow - could they perhaps be reconsidering the idea of keeping it running on all of its roads in Barnet but extending it to Edgware - perhaps via Barnet Gate Lane, Hendon Wood Lane and Marsh Lane (extending the 184 slightly to cover the section to Quinta Drive) to be more reliable? Although I don't really think the 384 is the best candidate for an extension (I would choose the 240 or 340), this would still be preferable to seeing the frequency even further reduced further down the line or even 'withdrawing the route altogether', as is an implied threat in the report.
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frank
Conductor
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Post by frank on Feb 15, 2019 9:10:46 GMT
The consultation report has been published but the decision deferred until 'spring', with TfL apparently needing more time to 'consider alternative proposals' - what should be read into this? Interesting that there is no mention of the bus stop part of the proposals and that they still think the 384 is underused since they reduced it to 3 buses per hour (do they not see how reducing frequency actually leads to reduced usage?): Dear Stakeholder Between 10 September and 9 November 2018, we consulted on proposals for changes to bus routes 384, 292 and 606. We received 1,378 responses (including 18 stakeholder responses). Thank you to all those you provided their views – we appreciate your patience in waiting for our reply. Of the 1,378 public responses, we identified the following key themes of support and opposition to the proposed changes Supportive themes · Proposals would provide a quicker connection from New Barnet to Edgware via public transport Opposing issues Concern about older people and less mobile people being able to walk 450+ metres to access the 384 or alternatives Concern that the backroads of New Barnet would be left unserved by local bus routes Concern about the appropriateness of roads that would be used by an extended and more direct 384 Victoria Road Salisbury Road Park Road Station Road Concern that a reduced 292 service would result in a longer journey time and Borehamwood being disadvantaged We received rich and varied feedback from many local people and key stakeholders throughout the consultation. Views expressed included concerns with our current proposals for the routes as well as a number of alternative suggestions that would still allow for an extension to Edgware. We are considering and reviewing the proposals again in light of this feedback and we will conclude our findings this Spring. If we develop alternative proposals, these may be subject to further consultation. For more details including a full consultation report, please go to: consultations.tfl.gov.uk/buses/route-384/. Yours faithfully Zoe Murphy Local Communities & Partnerships Transport for London Isn’t it interesting, that where routes are long established in residential areas, locals can fight like wild animals to keep them. However when a new route is proposed for local roads the NIMBYS come out in force, and all of a sudden those same buses are evil child killing, planet destroying, noise emitting machines.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2019 10:24:23 GMT
The 384 extension costs does seem to be based on only using one extra 384 bus, especially after the 384 realigning, however it would need an additional two based on original plans so an extra cost. To extend the 384 to Edgware whilst keeping its existing route would be at least three additional buses, all at TfL's cost. This may then negate all their savings from the 292 and 606 reductions resulting in no net bus cost saving.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2019 21:57:41 GMT
Extending the 240 from Mill Hill Broadway via Deansbrook Road, up through Edgware, the A1 and Arkley through to Barnet is a seemingly viable option. With its current frequency of every 15 minutes, and being a double decker route already, it's going to provide adequate relief for the 292 enabling it's frequency to be decreased.
Essentially it would be killing multiple birds with one stone: regaining direct links to Edgware from Deansbrook Road (lost through 303/305 changes), providing extra capacity between High Street Edgware and Stirling Corner, allowing route 384 to remain unchanged, alleviating the problem of elderly residents not being able to access a bus route, and lastly creating much more useful links not only between Barnet and Edgware Station, but Edgware Community/Barnet Hospitals and Thameslink at Mill Hill Broadway Station, but also for the many residents throughout Mill Hill Village/Hendon who I'm sure would appreciate such a service.
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Post by jordzjohn123 on Apr 8, 2019 13:32:05 GMT
If the 384 extention to Edgware does go ahead, perhaps the route could transfer to EW as there should be space left by the 204 transferring to ON
EW can accommodate SDs right? because I don't see why they can't
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Post by VMH2452 on Apr 8, 2019 13:45:11 GMT
If the 384 extention to Edgware does go ahead, perhaps the route could transfer to EW as there should be space left by the 204 transferring to ON EW can accommodate SDs right? because I don't see why they can't That space was filled by the 292.
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Post by kmkcheng on Apr 8, 2019 13:47:32 GMT
If the 384 extention to Edgware does go ahead, perhaps the route could transfer to EW as there should be space left by the 204 transferring to ON EW can accommodate SDs right? because I don't see why they can't Don’t think EW has any room, as although the 204, 186 and N5 moved out, the 32 and 292 moved in
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Post by VWH1414 on Apr 8, 2019 15:26:08 GMT
If the 384 extention to Edgware does go ahead, perhaps the route could transfer to EW as there should be space left by the 204 transferring to ON EW can accommodate SDs right? because I don't see why they can't As others have just said, EW has no room, the swaps that happened were 186 to HT to replace H12, also allowing the 32 to move in (Similar PVRs) and then the 204 to ON to replace the 223/224, meanwhile allowing the newly gained 292 to be slotted into EW in the 204s space - meaning that all space made was then filled. Also why would it move to EW when it is part of a common pool of SD routes at PB? It makes sense to have it run from PB as there is other DEMs/DEs* there, whereas PB is a fully DD garage. * - I know it does not currently use DEs, but I wonder if the plans go ahead and the route is changed whether it will be able to accommodate DEs.
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Post by uakari on Apr 22, 2019 2:18:43 GMT
Things seem to have gone quiet on this, after TfL promised to 'conclude their findings in the spring'.
I was thinking of emailing the contact at TfL to ask for an update and ask some questions in light of the February report, but if they've kicked it into the long grass, could doing so be counterproductive in terms of reawakening the issue / keeping the 384 serving all the roads in Barnet that it does now?
The report didn't mention anything about the northbound bus stop on Barnet Hill part of the proposals, which I would quite like an update on as I think better access from the tube is important, but I don't want to rock the boat if TfL have climbed down on changing the 384 and quietly intend to keep the status quo.
Any advice appreciated.
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