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Post by sid on Jul 15, 2019 6:08:59 GMT
The same thing was done in Berlin where open boarding was abolished for the same reason and prominent no entry stickers on the rear and centre door have done the trick. Anyway a lot of people pass the driver without paying, invalid oyster or just walk straight past and the driver says nothing. I sometimes use a paper ODTC on buses and many drivers don't even look at it.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 21, 2019 18:59:41 GMT
I can't confirm 100% but my family relative who is a driver at Bow has told me that all 8 drivers are going to be trained on a new way of boarding and alighting of passengers. He said passengers will be let off first before drivers open the front door, he also suggested the rear door will not be used at all, It was suggested initially here the rear door would be taken out of use so not sure?
Some of this could just be drivers getting things mixed up.
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Post by redbus on Jul 21, 2019 20:00:20 GMT
I can't confirm 100% but my family relative who is a driver at Bow has told me that all 8 drivers are going to be trained on a new way of boarding and alighting of passengers. He said passengers will be let off first before drivers open the front door, he also suggested the rear door will not be used at all, It was suggested initially here the rear door would be taken out of use so not sure? Some of this could just be drivers getting things mixed up. Well if you are going to let everyone alight first and then open the front doors to allow boarding, you may as well have a provincial bus with only one sets of doors! This will make LTs slower than ordinary buses.
Dwell times will go up significantly, longer journey times will result, maybe even a higher pvr will be needed to maintain the same level of service. Then there will be unintended consequences, longer journey times and greater dwell times may put off passengers from using buses, lead to lower patronage which in turn will lead to frequency cuts. Then what happens about 'regulating the service', holding back a bus will require a longer wait as the bus in front has longer dwell times.
Let's hope this is just 'canteen gossip'
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Post by wirewiper on Jul 22, 2019 7:50:20 GMT
I don't know why people are getting this idea that the rear door on LTs will no longer be used. It will continue to open for passengers to alight.
Current procedure: driver opens all doors for passengers to board and alight.
Noew procedure: driver opens front door if there are passengers waiting to board, and the middle and rear doors if there are passengers wishing to alight.
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Post by paulsw2 on Jul 22, 2019 9:59:29 GMT
It can be changed and as I mentioned it has been in Berlin. On the other hand if open boarding is a good idea, and I don't think it is, why not extend it to two door buses? All it needs is oyster readers at the rear doors, you don't to have three doors for open boarding. Revenue inspectors have very little power without police back up and in reality fare dodgers will refuse to give their details and just get off and get on another bus. As for fare evasion in general I just think it's the culture that has developed in London with free travel for kids and people with invalid oysters expecting to be allowed to travel to the station to top up etc. The fare evasion culture had started long before free travel for children was introduced and long before oyster was even introduced - growing up in the 90's and using the 159 a lot, many people would specifically wait for that route so they could get a free fare and the fare back then was 40p for kids and 70p for adults. I worked the 159 out of BN in the 90's I collected fares regardless even kicking people of at the end of their travel cards validity (Z1 Z2 Z3) and was pretty good at spotting the dodgy passes many a time I would pull up at a stop and the fare dodger(s) saw me they would not bother even trying to board.
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Post by southlondonbus on Jul 22, 2019 10:27:26 GMT
So with passengers able to get off the middle and rear doors alighting should still be quicker then a conventional bus. Hopefully people want alight from the front door and block boarding passengers.
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Post by rif153 on Jul 22, 2019 14:12:21 GMT
I had a trip on LT798 today. The oyster reader by the driver's cab wasn't working so he told passengers to board through the middle/rear doors. I'm sure some passengers took this as an opportunity to pay but how ironic that the other three oyster readers on the bus helped to generate some revenue rather than lose it. When the boarding changes come in, in situations like this, it'll just be take a revenue hit with passengers unable to pay for their travel
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Post by rif153 on Jul 23, 2019 20:30:55 GMT
On the 148 I boarded at Elephant and Castle today several fare dodgers barged past me as I tapped my oyster card on the reader at the rear door. On Victoria Street, revenue inspectors got on the bus. I was pretty frustrated they'd gotten on at Victoria Street because they caught few fare dodgers compared if they had gotten on at Elephant and Castle, the bus would have been half empty!
I presume someone at TfL has decided to target the 148 for fare dodgers as today was the second time in a month I'd encountered revnue inspectors on the 148
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Post by capitalomnibus on Jul 23, 2019 22:10:41 GMT
On the 148 I boarded at Elephant and Castle today several fare dodgers barged past me as I tapped my oyster card on the reader at the rear door. On Victoria Street, revenue inspectors got on the bus. I was pretty frustrated they'd gotten on at Victoria Street because they caught few fare dodgers compared if they had gotten on at Elephant and Castle, the bus would have been half empty!
I presume someone at TfL has decided to target the 148 for fare dodgers as today was the second time in a month I'd encountered revnue inspectors on the 148
They have been working in that area a lot recently, its not just the 148, other LT (New Routemaster) bus routes are being checked.
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Post by snowman on Aug 1, 2019 5:41:28 GMT
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Post by M1104 on Aug 1, 2019 13:14:08 GMT
Can buggies still used the centre doors with drivers discretion?
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Post by enviroPB on Aug 1, 2019 13:41:12 GMT
I saw that tripe message on a N8 in Bishopsgate early this morning. Utterly useless to create, design and commission a bus for open boarding to only row back on the capabilities of the new Routemasters. Might as well do a Boris and pull them all off the roads if fare evasion is that big a problem, but I suspect this isn't the main issue behind it. Most of my observations see very minimal fare dodgers, no higher than 5-10% of all boardees with it being next to nil at night on certain routes. Ironically this 'trial method' has happened to me on a N8 sometime in early summer last year. Driver forced everyone to board through the front. At first I thought I was being discriminated and typecast by opting to go for the rear door, but this driver seemed determined to catch fare dodgers out. I had no problem with his noble efforts, what I was worried about was missing my connecting bus home at Stratford and sure enough; when the N8 driver restricted open boarding that made the bus later than originally scheduled. TfL should be prepared for operators asking for amended timetables left, right & centre if this gets a blanket rollout; regardless if it's a day or night route.
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Post by wirewiper on Aug 1, 2019 15:56:42 GMT
Can buggies still used the centre doors with drivers discretion? Yes - just the same as with any other TfL bus.
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Post by richard on Aug 8, 2019 15:26:17 GMT
Let the chaos begin 😁
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Post by george on Aug 8, 2019 15:34:51 GMT
I can't help but think that the worst route to start to test on is the 8. I would have said the 267 route would be better as there's no other LT routes along the route apart from Hammersmith bus station.
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