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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Jan 10, 2020 20:25:01 GMT
Seeing as the N55 uses the exact same buses it's probably safe to say that too will go front door boarding only. I wonder if they seem to be going by operator, the 55 seems a bit out of the blue compared to the 267 but its change will allow all of the Stagecoach routes to be put out of the way. Naturally following the 267 I wouldn't be surprised to see the rest of Abellio's routes done - especially considering there were really early reports of WL's LTs having the modified controls for the doors.
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Post by george on Jan 10, 2020 20:47:17 GMT
The new way of fare dodging on the LTs 😁
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Post by enviroPB on Jan 10, 2020 21:47:06 GMT
I have a problem or two with this article: its ambiguity suggests that Sadiq Khan got rid of the conductors and having the rear door open whilst driving, which is all Boris's doing. Naughty Mr Osbourne, showing predilections in your newspaper article when journalism should be impartial! It's the beginning of the end for LTs, that much is certain. What's the point in having 3 door buses when they aren't fully utilised? They will be withdrawn en masse should Khan win another mayoral term, pending some molehill issue in the media that he will capitalise on respond to. And as for this "successful trial" on the 8; I believe the route was successfully pulled back from TCR, saw a lower patronage than normal and TfL successfully stretched data which is not like-for-like.
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Post by greenboy on Jan 10, 2020 21:55:33 GMT
I have a problem or two with this article: its ambiguity suggests that Sadiq Khan got rid of the conductors and having the rear door open whilst driving, which is all Boris's doing. Naughty Mr Osbourne, showing predilections in your newspaper article when journalism should be impartial! It's the beginning of the end for LTs, that much is certain. What's the point in having 3 door buses when they aren't fully utilised? They will be withdrawn en masse should Khan win another mayoral term, pending some molehill issue in the media that he will capitalise on respond to. And as for this "successful trial" on the 8; I believe the route was successfully pulled back from TCR, saw a lower patronage than normal and TfL successfully stretched data which is not like-for-like. It was Sadiq Khan that got rid of conductors and consequently the open platform. I don't think three door buses have been a success regardless of the type of bus, ie bendybus as well, but I think the LT will be with us for some time yet.
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Post by rj131 on Jan 10, 2020 21:56:20 GMT
I have a problem or two with this article: its ambiguity suggests that Sadiq Khan got rid of the conductors and having the rear door open whilst driving, which is all Boris's doing. Naughty Mr Osbourne, showing predilections in your newspaper article when journalism should be impartial! It's the beginning of the end for LTs, that much is certain. What's the point in having 3 door buses when they aren't fully utilised? They will be withdrawn en masse should Khan win another mayoral term, pending some molehill issue in the media that he will capitalise on respond to. And as for this "successful trial" on the 8; I believe the route was successfully pulled back from TCR, saw a lower patronage than normal and TfL successfully stretched data which is not like-for-like. The problem is that where will they go? Literally no one wants them, they wouldn’t even be able to give them away
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Post by enviroPB on Jan 10, 2020 22:35:58 GMT
I have a problem or two with this article: its ambiguity suggests that Sadiq Khan got rid of the conductors and having the rear door open whilst driving, which is all Boris's doing. Naughty Mr Osbourne, showing predilections in your newspaper article when journalism should be impartial! It's the beginning of the end for LTs, that much is certain. What's the point in having 3 door buses when they aren't fully utilised? They will be withdrawn en masse should Khan win another mayoral term, pending some molehill issue in the media that he will capitalise on respond to. And as for this "successful trial" on the 8; I believe the route was successfully pulled back from TCR, saw a lower patronage than normal and TfL successfully stretched data which is not like-for-like. It was Sadiq Khan that got rid of conductors and consequently the open platform. I don't think three door buses have been a success regardless of the type of bus, ie bendybus as well, but I think the LT will be with us for some time yet. Gosh, 2016 seems like an eon away! I disagree, in terms of passenger flow and reducing dwell times, open boarding has been a success. Where TfL want to be stringent in having open boarding but not enforcing revenue protection is where the downfall lies. It's pointless to have LTs or bendies and not have a strong deterrent like inspector checks every other day to fend the fare evaders off, cause the vast majority of [fare paying] customers will be appreciative of open boarding and the benefits it brings.
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Post by goldenarrow on Jan 10, 2020 23:08:18 GMT
And so all of the NRMs “unique” features have succumbed to the reality of bus operation in the capital. A thousand strong vanity project that contributed naff all to the evolution of bus design in London.
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Post by busaholic on Jan 11, 2020 0:38:59 GMT
I have a problem or two with this article: its ambiguity suggests that Sadiq Khan got rid of the conductors and having the rear door open whilst driving, which is all Boris's doing. Naughty Mr Osbourne, showing predilections in your newspaper article when journalism should be impartial! It's the beginning of the end for LTs, that much is certain. What's the point in having 3 door buses when they aren't fully utilised? They will be withdrawn en masse should Khan win another mayoral term, pending some molehill issue in the media that he will capitalise on respond to. And as for this "successful trial" on the 8; I believe the route was successfully pulled back from TCR, saw a lower patronage than normal and TfL successfully stretched data which is not like-for-like. It was Sadiq Khan that got rid of conductors and consequently the open platform. I don't think three door buses have been a success regardless of the type of bus, ie bendybus as well, but I think the LT will be with us for some time yet. The facts are these: all conversions of routes to LT up until the 148's in February 2014 incorporated a 'customer assistant' on the rear platform and the rear door consequently open for most of the day. The 148 was the first NOT to have these features, whereupon no further conversions had them either. TfL would not admit that the concept had come to an end, only that each route would be assessed on an individual basis, whatever that meant. That autumn in 2014, it was announced that BN would introduce the type on to the 159, complete with c.a.s, open door,etc, and Arriva even advertised the posts in local papers. In the meantime, TfL had a rethink and allocated the buses to the 137 instead, commencing the conversion in December. These operated as standard opo from the start, and no Customer Assistants were ever recruited at Brixton. TfL still allowed the pretence that there was a possibility of future buses/routes achieving their intended purpose, Boris Johnson being unusually quiet on the subject now his mayoralty was coming to an end, so, yes, it was Sadiq Khan after the mayoral election who was left to do the logical thing and get rid of the remaining C.A.s and confine open door operation to the genuine article, the so-called Heritage Routemasters.
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Post by greenboy on Jan 11, 2020 8:16:15 GMT
It was Sadiq Khan that got rid of conductors and consequently the open platform. I don't think three door buses have been a success regardless of the type of bus, ie bendybus as well, but I think the LT will be with us for some time yet. Gosh, 2016 seems like an eon away! I disagree, in terms of passenger flow and reducing dwell times, open boarding has been a success. Where TfL want to be stringent in having open boarding but not enforcing revenue protection is where the downfall lies. It's pointless to have LTs or bendies and not have a strong deterrent like inspector checks every other day to fend the fare evaders off, cause the vast majority of [fare paying] customers will be appreciative of open boarding and the benefits it brings. We can't have open boarding without a considerable loss of revenue and employing loads more revenue inspectors is just not viable. As for three doors, most LT routes see a few conventional buses and journey times are much the same. In the bendybus days there was a two door Citaro that was hired for the 436 following a vehicle fire and again journey times were much the same.
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Post by snowman on Jan 11, 2020 8:47:02 GMT
Gosh, 2016 seems like an eon away! I disagree, in terms of passenger flow and reducing dwell times, open boarding has been a success. Where TfL want to be stringent in having open boarding but not enforcing revenue protection is where the downfall lies. It's pointless to have LTs or bendies and not have a strong deterrent like inspector checks every other day to fend the fare evaders off, cause the vast majority of [fare paying] customers will be appreciative of open boarding and the benefits it brings. We can't have open boarding without a considerable loss of revenue and employing loads more revenue inspectors is just not viable. As for three doors, most LT routes see a few conventional buses and journey times are much the same. In the bendybus days there was a two door Citaro that was hired for the 436 following a vehicle fire and again journey times were much the same. The TfL Press release (notes to editors) says £100,000,000 is fare evasion Also says there are 450 revenue inspectors So by bit of simple maths, unless the average revenue inspector is paid more than £222,222 each, then makes sense to employ more. tfl.gov.uk/info-for/media/press-releases/2020/january/new-routemaster-buses-to-become-front-boarding-only
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Post by greenboy on Jan 11, 2020 9:18:48 GMT
We can't have open boarding without a considerable loss of revenue and employing loads more revenue inspectors is just not viable. As for three doors, most LT routes see a few conventional buses and journey times are much the same. In the bendybus days there was a two door Citaro that was hired for the 436 following a vehicle fire and again journey times were much the same. The TfL Press release (notes to editors) says £100,000,000 is fare evasion Also says there are 450 revenue inspectors So by bit of simple maths, unless the average revenue inspector is paid more than £222,222 each, then makes sense to employ more. tfl.gov.uk/info-for/media/press-releases/2020/january/new-routemaster-buses-to-become-front-boarding-onlyI take this with a pinch of salt especially the suggestion about fare evasion dropping by half since the changed boarding arrangements on the 8.
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Post by Lukeo on Jan 11, 2020 18:16:29 GMT
Open-boarding definitely has a positive impact on dwell times, but even with boarding now being restricted to the front doors lets not forget the benefit of two staircases and an extra door at the back for alighting. I commute on a route with conventional DDs and it gets packed up until the terminus, where it can take a good few minutes to exit the bus from the upper deck. NRMs definitely still have an advantage here.
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Post by greenboy on Jan 12, 2020 6:38:53 GMT
Open-boarding definitely has a positive impact on dwell times, but even with boarding now being restricted to the front doors lets not forget the benefit of two staircases and an extra door at the back for alighting. I commute on a route with conventional DDs and it gets packed up until the terminus, where it can take a good few minutes to exit the bus from the upper deck. NRMs definitely still have an advantage here. Yes routes like the 38 and 390 empty out much quicker at Victoria in the evening peak.
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Post by george on Jan 25, 2020 16:15:41 GMT
First day of front door only operation on the 55 and 267. So you can't hop on at the back.
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Post by george on Jan 27, 2020 14:36:51 GMT
Are all front door boarding LT routes starting with ones where the garage only has one LT route or is it just a coincidence so far? If this is true it certainly makes sense to do it this way.
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