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Post by Paul on Sept 11, 2019 20:03:33 GMT
I don’t know the area but are TfL proposing to have large numbers of school children congregating on the side of the North Circular Road? Sounds like a recipe for disaster to me!
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Post by rif153 on Sept 11, 2019 20:07:58 GMT
I don’t know the area but are TfL proposing to have large numbers of school children congregating on the side of the North Circular Road? Sounds like a recipe for disaster to me! Pretty ironic when Sadiq Khan always says that he's determined to stop young children breathing in toxic air.
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Post by foxhat on Sept 11, 2019 20:17:14 GMT
The penny drops at last. As others have said, the 112 needs a conversion to double deckers to help cope with demand, the route is very well used. Certainly at school times, I hope DD journeys are timetabled to help cope with the immense demand, as the 112 will not be able to cope with the school loadings if the 611 is withdrawn. The passengers displaced from the double deck 611 swamping the already packed single deckers on the 112 seems like a recipe for disaster. I hope the route at least gets a frequency increase during the peaks, ideally to every 8 minutes. The frequency increase is already needed, but will be needed more if the route is to remain with single deckers, and pick up the slack from the loss of the 611. If the route were to be decked, then the every 10 minute frequency should be sufficient. The issue with increasing the 112's frequency is that it makes TfL looks silly, if they were to withdraw the 460, then why replace it with a more frequent route. If TfL were serious about this viable alternative to cars on the North Circular, they should put their money where their mouth is. Bus lanes along the North Circular would make using the 112 more appealing, it would be going faster than the cars, and consequently, it should encourage people to get out of their cars, and on to buses. Meanwhile, the reduced volume of traffic on the North Circular would be people making necesarry journeys, however, driving along the North Circular would be made even more unappealing. I accept that this idea is flawed in practice, but I see it as a viable solution to reliability issues which may plague the extended 112. Now for the elephant in the room, the 460. I can see it getting withdrawn now, but why wasn't it included in this consultation? I think Henly's Corner to Golders Green is grossly overbussed, so the removal of the 460 from there should help reduce bus services to a more suitable level. Others are better qualified than me to talk about buses on that section, but if the 13 and 102 will struggle without the 460, then some peak extras on the 13 should help to alleviate this. Henly's Corner to North Finchley should be alright, but the single deckers on the 112, plus the fact the 112 dosen't offer a connection to the Northern Line at Golders Green as the 460 does may be problematic. My guess for why it wasn't included in the consultation, mayoral elections next year, so TfL will save it until 2020. It would be quite nice if there were to be a transition period where people could get used to the new 112 before the loss of the 460. Remember though that on a good day only a handful of 13s actually make it beyond Golders Green (slight exaggeration but still...)
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Post by kmkcheng on Sept 11, 2019 20:17:18 GMT
I don’t know the area but are TfL proposing to have large numbers of school children congregating on the side of the North Circular Road? Sounds like a recipe for disaster to me! I suppose if they don’t want to have children congregating on the side of the NCR, they could have a special afternoon school journey to start at the first 611 stop although that would probably defeat the purpose of withdrawing it in the first place
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2019 21:48:56 GMT
So I'm guessing the proposed last stop on the 112 would be Stop T where the 626 and 683 stop and would also stand at stop T with the first stop being Stop E
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Post by Green Kitten on Sept 12, 2019 4:57:38 GMT
The 82 ran at the same frequency as the 13 does now between Golders Green and North Finchley in the peaks. There are loads of people waiting at Golders Green station trying to go north. Don’t agree with the fact that section’s overbussed (especially with the unreliability of the 13!)
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Post by VMH2452 on Sept 12, 2019 5:33:16 GMT
Now for the elephant in the room, the 460. I can see it getting withdrawn now, but why wasn't it included in this consultation? I think Henly's Corner to Golders Green is grossly overbussed, so the removal of the 460 from there should help reduce bus services to a more suitable level. Others are better qualified than me to talk about buses on that section, but if the 13 and 102 will struggle without the 460, then some peak extras on the 13 should help to alleviate this. Henly's Corner to North Finchley should be alright, but the single deckers on the 112, plus the fact the 112 dosen't offer a connection to the Northern Line at Golders Green as the 460 does may be problematic. My guess for why it wasn't included in the consultation, mayoral elections next year, so TfL will save it until 2020. It would be quite nice if there were to be a transition period where people could get used to the new 112 before the loss of the 460. Maybe because the majority of people don’t want to go to North Finchley, they want to go to places between and 112 doesn’t serve any places that 460/13 serve - the unreliability of the 13 could be another factor and that there is demand for two routes, especially in the peaks.
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Post by southlondonbus on Sept 12, 2019 6:17:31 GMT
I thought the 13 was more frequent then the 82 was at all times.
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Post by Volvo on Sept 12, 2019 6:30:35 GMT
Yeaa extending the 112 further down the NC, imo isn't a good idea.
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Post by RandomBusesGirl on Sept 12, 2019 7:54:26 GMT
I thought the 13 was more frequent then the 82 was at all times. Yes but there is no old 13 anymore! 😶 ---- I also really don't like that there is no reference to double-decking whatsoever in the proposal. What sort of reality do TfL live in? A sardine tin crammed single-decker on a dual carriageway, very safe that!
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Post by enviroPB on Sept 12, 2019 13:46:14 GMT
I thought the 13 was more frequent then the 82 was at all times. Yes the new 13 is more frequent, particularly in the evenings past 9/10 when the 82 went down to 3pbh till the end of service. This extension of the 112 hasn't conned me by thinking North Finchley is a nice place to terminate a bus route. Services north of Golders Green has been very unreliable for quite a few years now, and the problem still continues with the 13 even with its 5bph during the evenings. Dare I say the 82 was more reliable when it ran with its infrequent service than the 13 is now between Golders Green & North Finchley.
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Sept 12, 2019 13:49:46 GMT
I thought the 13 was more frequent then the 82 was at all times. Yes the new 13 is more frequent, particularly in the evenings past 9/10 when the 82 went down to 3pbh till the end of service. This extension of the 112 hasn't conned me by thinking North Finchley is a nice place to terminate a bus route. Services north of Golders Green has been very unreliable for quite a few years now, and the problem still continues with the 13 even with its 5bph during the evenings. Dare I say the 82 was more reliable when it ran with its infrequent service than the 13 is now between Golders Green & North Finchley. The 82 was certainly more reliable, the 13 at the moment is just a laughing stock in terms of reliability. I always see it running in groups of 2 and 3, maybe even 4 then you'll have no bus for ages. The whole Finchley Road corridor has just been an example of what happens when you try to fix something that isn't broken.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2019 13:58:51 GMT
Yes the new 13 is more frequent, particularly in the evenings past 9/10 when the 82 went down to 3pbh till the end of service. This extension of the 112 hasn't conned me by thinking North Finchley is a nice place to terminate a bus route. Services north of Golders Green has been very unreliable for quite a few years now, and the problem still continues with the 13 even with its 5bph during the evenings. Dare I say the 82 was more reliable when it ran with its infrequent service than the 13 is now between Golders Green & North Finchley. The 82 was certainly more reliable, the 13 at the moment is just a laughing stock in terms of reliability. I always see it running in groups of 2 and 3, maybe even 4 then you'll have no bus for ages. The whole Finchley Road corridor has just been an example of what happens when you try to fix something that isn't broken. TfL clearly felt it was broken, ie over bussed. The current 13 is the same route as the old 82 and the poor service can only be down to the operator.
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Post by vjaska on Sept 12, 2019 14:23:49 GMT
The 82 was certainly more reliable, the 13 at the moment is just a laughing stock in terms of reliability. I always see it running in groups of 2 and 3, maybe even 4 then you'll have no bus for ages. The whole Finchley Road corridor has just been an example of what happens when you try to fix something that isn't broken. TfL clearly felt it was broken, ie over bussed. The current 13 is the same route as the old 82 and the poor service can only be down to the operator. TfL have shown on several occasions that just because they feel something is 'broken', doesn't mean it actually is.
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Post by rj131 on Sept 14, 2019 14:44:42 GMT
With this 112 extension this potentially gives Metroline somewhere to use some of their wrongly ordered 393 DELs!
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