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Post by cl54 on Jan 31, 2024 20:44:13 GMT
TfL need to provide school routes for St Mary's. Travelling on the 486 from North Greenwich in the afternoon is a nightmare. Looking at this on map the 422 passes by however using John Harrison Way. What should be done is School buses introduced to replace the lost links. Overall the entire area starting from Blackwall Lane has a very high demand for bus usage. Plenty of buses coming into North Greenwich from the East but very few from the West. If a Route ran from for example Deptford Church Street to Charlton Station via North Greenwich there would be some very high demand. 1600 pupils creates vey big demand for buses as they leave school. All the routes that serve the nearby roads are leaving pupils behind.
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Post by DT 11 on Jan 31, 2024 20:48:17 GMT
Looking at this on map the 422 passes by however using John Harrison Way. What should be done is School buses introduced to replace the lost links. Overall the entire area starting from Blackwall Lane has a very high demand for bus usage. Plenty of buses coming into North Greenwich from the East but very few from the West. If a Route ran from for example Deptford Church Street to Charlton Station via North Greenwich there would be some very high demand. 1600 pupils creates vey big demand for buses as they leave school. All the routes that serve the nearby roads are leaving pupils behind. Then clearly there is a need for some School buses then or a new route in the area. If every bus in the area is filling up why is the 188 being flagged up as the saviour service. Overall I believe TFL are aware of this and removing the route deliberately to force people to use the Bus Stops at Oval Square as the 188 is generally much quicker than the 129. This just sounds like a general problem with pretty much all Schools where buses generally just fill up and leave people behind.
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Post by busman on Jan 31, 2024 20:49:48 GMT
Don’t like it one bit, for the reasons everyone else has stated. Given that this change is linked to the Silvertown tunnel opening, why not have one of the new Silvertown routes serve Tunnel Avenue in both directions?
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Post by twobellstogo on Feb 1, 2024 9:01:05 GMT
Don’t like it one bit, for the reasons everyone else has stated. Given that this change is linked to the Silvertown tunnel opening, why not have one of the new Silvertown routes serve Tunnel Avenue in both directions? I wonder if it’s worth considering splitting the 188 into two services - half going via current route as 188, and resurrecting the 168 number for the half going via Tunnel Avenue?
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Post by busman on Feb 1, 2024 10:47:33 GMT
Don’t like it one bit, for the reasons everyone else has stated. Given that this change is linked to the Silvertown tunnel opening, why not have one of the new Silvertown routes serve Tunnel Avenue in both directions? I wonder if it’s worth considering splitting the 188 into two services - half going via current route as 188, and resurrecting the 168 number for the half going via Tunnel Avenue? Unless there was data to support splitting the 188, it is fine as it is. In fact the new route to Tottenham Court Road is actually a handier terminus from this area than Russell Square. If there was no possibility of introducing a new route through the new tunnel (as TfL seemed to have forgotten about earlier plans which had more buses and more routes), I would look at diverting the 161 down the whole stretch of Tunnel Avenue from East Greenwich library all the way into North Greenwich station. At the southern end, buses can access Tunnel Avenue via Dunham Street as buses curtailed at East Greenwich currently do anyway. I think it is definitely an option. The 161 pretty much empties out at Woolwich and is almost like two routes, plus the 180 and 472 still provides links to the IKEA area and beyond. Most of the stops (2 out of 3) in Charlton where the 161 is the only link to and from IKEA are within easy reach of the 180, 472 or 486. The stop with the biggest inconvenience would be the Rainton Road stops. Passengers using the 161 between Rainton Road and stops before North Greenwich Station would have journeys broken - but - there would be a common interchange stop (Tunnel Avenue) in both directions with the 108, 188 and 422 on Blackwall Lane. For short hop journeys to the IKEA area, passengers can take a bus one stop to East Greenwich (Kemsing Road) and change for the 129. Obviously this is just a suggestion based on my observations as a local, but TfL will have data to quantify how many people would be negatively impacted by such a change vs. how many people would benefit from such a change. It at least gets people from Woolwich to Meantime brewery quicker than a 422 ;-)
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Post by Mokujin on Feb 1, 2024 11:02:37 GMT
TfL need to provide school routes for St Mary's. Travelling on the 486 from North Greenwich in the afternoon is a nightmare. Looking at this on map the 422 passes by however using John Harrison Way. What should be done is School buses introduced to replace the lost links. Overall the entire area starting from Blackwall Lane has a very high demand for bus usage. Plenty of buses coming into North Greenwich from the East but very few from the West. If a Route ran from for example Deptford Church Street to Charlton Station via North Greenwich there would be some very high demand. A slight problem here - unless you're referring to a school route, there is no stand space within Deptford other than the overflow stand at Deptford Bridge (which is pretty much for the 453). Even the DCS turns for 47, 188, 199 and N199 don't use a stand, they just loop around the roundabout at the junction of Creekside and Reginald Road before starting the next trip at either the Deptford High Street, Macmillan Students Village or Wavelengths stops. A bus stand *could* be placed along Prince Street by Convoys Wharf but some parking spaces would have to be taken out along the road itself being resurfaced. I do feel that a school route from Surrey Quays to North Greenwich via the school would be the best compromise. Other than the school, there isn't anything else yet along Millennium Way other than one or two offices to warrant a replacement service. As mentioned already, perhaps another route being extended from across the river via Silvertown tunnel could run via Millennium Way.
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Post by twobellstogo on Feb 1, 2024 12:02:37 GMT
I wonder if it’s worth considering splitting the 188 into two services - half going via current route as 188, and resurrecting the 168 number for the half going via Tunnel Avenue? Unless there was data to support splitting the 188, it is fine as it is. In fact the new route to Tottenham Court Road is actually a handier terminus from this area than Russell Square. If there was no possibility of introducing a new route through the new tunnel (as TfL seemed to have forgotten about earlier plans which had more buses and more routes), I would look at diverting the 161 down the whole stretch of Tunnel Avenue from East Greenwich library all the way into North Greenwich station. At the southern end, buses can access Tunnel Avenue via Dunham Street as buses curtailed at East Greenwich currently do anyway. I think it is definitely an option. The 161 pretty much empties out at Woolwich and is almost like two routes, plus the 180 and 472 still provides links to the IKEA area and beyond. Most of the stops (2 out of 3) in Charlton where the 161 is the only link to and from IKEA are within easy reach of the 180, 472 or 486. The stop with the biggest inconvenience would be the Rainton Road stops. Passengers using the 161 between Rainton Road and stops before North Greenwich Station would have journeys broken - but - there would be a common interchange stop (Tunnel Avenue) in both directions with the 108, 188 and 422 on Blackwall Lane. For short hop journeys to the IKEA area, passengers can take a bus one stop to East Greenwich (Kemsing Road) and change for the 129. Obviously this is just a suggestion based on my observations as a local, but TfL will have data to quantify how many people would be negatively impacted by such a change vs. how many people would benefit from such a change. It at least gets people from Woolwich to Meantime brewery quicker than a 422 ;-) I think you slightly misunderstood: literally the only difference between 188 and proposed 168 would be Tunnel Avenue. Re. 161 - seems a decent compromise, indeed, were it me and there was terminal space, I’d split the 161 in two - Woolwich to Chislehurst as 161 and North Greenwich - Queen Elizabeth Hospital as, say, 361.
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Post by danorak on Feb 2, 2024 9:28:58 GMT
Looking at this on map the 422 passes by however using John Harrison Way. What should be done is School buses introduced to replace the lost links. Overall the entire area starting from Blackwall Lane has a very high demand for bus usage. Plenty of buses coming into North Greenwich from the East but very few from the West. If a Route ran from for example Deptford Church Street to Charlton Station via North Greenwich there would be some very high demand. A slight problem here - unless you're referring to a school route, there is no stand space within Deptford other than the overflow stand at Deptford Bridge (which is pretty much for the 453). Even the DCS turns for 47, 188, 199 and N199 don't use a stand, they just loop around the roundabout at the junction of Creekside and Reginald Road before starting the next trip at either the Deptford High Street, Macmillan Students Village or Wavelengths stops. A bus stand *could* be placed along Prince Street by Convoys Wharf but some parking spaces would have to be taken out along the road itself being resurfaced. I do feel that a school route from Surrey Quays to North Greenwich via the school would be the best compromise. Other than the school, there isn't anything else yet along Millennium Way other than one or two offices to warrant a replacement service. As mentioned already, perhaps another route being extended from across the river via Silvertown tunnel could run via Millennium Way. Back when buses used to serve Deptford High Street, they used Hatton Street, Vanguard Street and Tanners Hill heading north. You might be able to create a stand on that loop for buses coming from the east.
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Post by Mokujin on Feb 2, 2024 15:22:35 GMT
A slight problem here - unless you're referring to a school route, there is no stand space within Deptford other than the overflow stand at Deptford Bridge (which is pretty much for the 453). Even the DCS turns for 47, 188, 199 and N199 don't use a stand, they just loop around the roundabout at the junction of Creekside and Reginald Road before starting the next trip at either the Deptford High Street, Macmillan Students Village or Wavelengths stops. A bus stand *could* be placed along Prince Street by Convoys Wharf but some parking spaces would have to be taken out along the road itself being resurfaced. I do feel that a school route from Surrey Quays to North Greenwich via the school would be the best compromise. Other than the school, there isn't anything else yet along Millennium Way other than one or two offices to warrant a replacement service. As mentioned already, perhaps another route being extended from across the river via Silvertown tunnel could run via Millennium Way. Back when buses used to serve Deptford High Street, they used Hatton Street, Vanguard Street and Tanners Hill heading north. You might be able to create a stand on that loop for buses coming from the east. A stand could be created on Vanguard Street, however Harton Street would need some of its parking spaces removed so that buses could get through.
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Post by busboy17 on Feb 5, 2024 13:40:12 GMT
Back when buses used to serve Deptford High Street, they used Hatton Street, Vanguard Street and Tanners Hill heading north. You might be able to create a stand on that loop for buses coming from the east. A stand could be created on Vanguard Street, however Harton Street would need some of its parking spaces removed so that buses could get through. The 453 stand with some altering could hold another bus
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Post by Mokujin on Feb 5, 2024 18:10:12 GMT
A stand could be created on Vanguard Street, however Harton Street would need some of its parking spaces removed so that buses could get through. The 453 stand with some altering could hold another bus I don't think so. 453 is high-frequency and can have up to three buses on stand at times. There is little to no room for altering or expanding.
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