Manchester Tram System

[Deleted]

Proposed Manachester Tram system has been canned as costs have escaleted out of control. Current last costs showed it would cost £270,000,000 and costs were still increasing.

Tram systems are very very expensive to build and operate and are also inflexible. Every new tram system built in the UK is operating at a massive loss.

[Steve80]

I heard that trams are operating with huge losses but with the croydon tramlink it is very popular and there are plans to extend it. If there is a demand then they have to build it shouldn't they. Surely they can make their money back?

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steve80 said:

I heard that trams are operating with huge losses but with the croydon tramlink it is very popular and there are plans to extend it. If there is a demand then they have to build it shouldn't they. Surely they can make their money back?

I know of no new UK tram system that is anywhere near covering theirs costs most are making huge losses. It's highly unlikely they will ever reach breakeven point

[Deleted]

but what sector of public transport makes a profit, if at all?

[Deleted]

rob said:

but what sector of public transport makes a profit, if at all?

You have to balance costs against benefits and Trams offer little to nothing in benefits and have a lot of disadvantages which is why trams were axed in the first place.

[londonunited]

I swear there is trams in Manchester

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londonunited said:

I swear there is trams in Manchester

He probably means an extension to the existing tram network.

[Deleted]

And up here in Edinburgh we are just starting 3 uears of roadwors chaos to put our trams in, maybe a new job coming my way??

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expressliner2 said:

And up here in Edinburgh we are just starting 3 uears of roadwors chaos to put our trams in, maybe a new job coming my way??

I really don't understand the politicians obscession with trams (I differentiat here beten trams & light railways) Trams are very very expensive & very inflexible and subject to curtailment at the slightest traffic accident. Mixing fixed track trams with other traffic and pedestrians is a lethal cocktail they also tend to be noisy.

Trollybuses offer a much better lower cost more flexible option. They can steer round minor accidents and in the case of more major road closures can divert and operate on their batteries. If changes need to be made to routes the cost of extending & changing the overhead track is quite low and can be done reasonably quickly. Extending a tram route is a major operation that taking into account planning and approvals could take 5 to 10 years.

[Deleted]

To be fair, most of the so-called 'tram' systems in this country are really light rail. Any on-street running that occurs would either be on quiet-ish suburban roads or small restricted/segregated city centre roads.

[Deleted]

NCT, go to Sheffield and try the trams there. It's a 3 route system with a lot of street running and reserved track. Conductors and conductresses are used and since Stagecoach took it over, it has made a steady profit. There has been talk of extensions, but none are confirmed yet. Go and try it: you'll be impressed!

Mal

[Deleted]

Nov 23, 2008 23:53:01 GMT @malc said:

NCT, go to Sheffield and try the trams there. It's a 3 route system with a lot of street running and reserved track. Conductors and conductresses are used and since Stagecoach took it over, it has made a steady profit. There has been talk of extensions, but none are confirmed yet. Go and try it: you'll be impressed!

Mal

The Sheffield System makes massive losses. It just that the losses are hidden.

Yes Stagecoach makes a profit. It would not operate the service otherwise. That profit though is after huge subsidies are paid to Stagecoach

[snowman]

It appears that the £1,400,000,000 (1.4 billion) extensions to Manchesters tram system have been approved

www.transportxtra.com/magazines/local_transport_today/news/?ID=15962

[snowman]

The first of Manchester's new trams has been delivered, they are based on a design used in Cologne

www.railwaygazette.com/news_view/article/2009/07/9780/first_m5000_car_delivered.html