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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2017 17:20:15 GMT
Server King wants to get a decent night's sleep and not have his windows shake out during the day! He also loves a bit of speculation. I don't think the word "hate" is appropriate. I've said plenty about the route which doesn't require repeating. I don't go round "hating" bus companies as that's as irrational as "loving" them. I'm more concerned about the service that's provided when I want to use a route. Let's be honest the bus companies try to do a decent job in difficult circumstances. As with everything in life there is variation between routes, drivers and garages. You just have to hope you get the better end of things rather than the worse end. @eddiebus as much as you "hate" Stagecoach and certain allocations out of Leyton or other garages, I hate the busted exhaust on VLA104 and the noisy fans on the majority of the VLAs. Arriva is one of my favourite companies, but it is my opinion that these buses would be lucky to see the end of their contract seeing how the fans / silencers etc are on them at the minute, plus performance. Seeing as there is due to be a glut of HV's for the 341 / 243, more than likely DWs will move across (even some here "hate" the DWs, but although they lack the character of their DB250 forebears, I think they're OK ) I doubt CT Plus would have the space for the 123, and if anything I'd like Stagecach to get it next, just for a little variety but I have little clout on what happens next but I will voice my opinion I hate Stagecoach? Are you ok or mixed me with someone else? I love Stagecoach ok fine not as much as I used too but still do. Stagey have really slim chance of gaining the 123. I doubt theyll even bid for it.
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Jul 31, 2017 17:23:06 GMT
@eddiebus as much as you "hate" Stagecoach and certain allocations out of Leyton or other garages, I hate the busted exhaust on VLA104 and the noisy fans on the majority of the VLAs. Arriva is one of my favourite companies, but it is my opinion that these buses would be lucky to see the end of their contract seeing how the fans / silencers etc are on them at the minute, plus performance. Seeing as there is due to be a glut of HV's for the 341 / 243, more than likely DWs will move across (even some here "hate" the DWs, but although they lack the character of their DB250 forebears, I think they're OK ) I doubt CT Plus would have the space for the 123, and if anything I'd like Stagecach to get it next, just for a little variety but I have little clout on what happens next but I will voice my opinion I hate Stagecoach? Are you ok or mixed me with someone else? I love Stagecoach ok fine not as much as I used too but still do. Stagey have really slim chance of gaining the 123. I doubt theyll even bid for it. Wouldn't say "slim" chance, both T and BK are positioned in order to be able to operate the route. Go Ahead are in a similar position with RR and NP, we have CT Plus and incumbent Arriva. Even Tower Transit can have a quite fair shot at it from LI, it'll be quite competitive I'm sure. But we have ages and unless you're a time traveller it'll be impossible to state how market conditions will be then.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2017 17:26:14 GMT
I hate Stagecoach? Are you ok or mixed me with someone else? I love Stagecoach ok fine not as much as I used too but still do. Stagey have really slim chance of gaining the 123. I doubt theyll even bid for it. Wouldn't say "slim" chance, both T and BK are positioned in order to be able to operate the route. Go Ahead are in a similar position with RR and NP, we have CT Plus and incumbent Arriva. Even Tower Transit can have a quite fair shot at it from LI, it'll be quite competitive I'm sure. But we have ages and unless you're a time traveller it'll be impossible to state how market conditions will be then. I understand your point, but trust me Stagey won't go for it but as you say its too far away to speculate. Thanks
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Post by mondraker275 on Jul 31, 2017 17:29:08 GMT
Server King wants to get a decent night's sleep and not have his windows shake out during the day! He also loves a bit of speculation. I don't think the word "hate" is appropriate. I've said plenty about the route which doesn't require repeating. I don't go round "hating" bus companies as that's as irrational as "loving" them. I'm more concerned about the service that's provided when I want to use a route. Let's be honest the bus companies try to do a decent job in difficult circumstances. As with everything in life there is variation between routes, drivers and garages. You just have to hope you get the better end of things rather than the worse end. @eddiebus as much as you "hate" Stagecoach and certain allocations out of Leyton or other garages, I hate the busted exhaust on VLA104 and the noisy fans on the majority of the VLAs. Arriva is one of my favourite companies, but it is my opinion that these buses would be lucky to see the end of their contract seeing how the fans / silencers etc are on them at the minute, plus performance. Seeing as there is due to be a glut of HV's for the 341 / 243, more than likely DWs will move across (even some here "hate" the DWs, but although they lack the character of their DB250 forebears, I think they're OK ) I doubt CT Plus would have the space for the 123, and if anything I'd like Stagecach to get it next, just for a little variety but I have little clout on what happens next but I will voice my opinion For me its about what company would order the best bus for the fast section on the A406. I have said before the Gemini 3 on the 34's suit that route very well. I would take similar buses on the 123. It has to be new hybrids whoever wins it at least. I dont want to get into the who is the better company as scenario and situations are different and most of the time there is little difference between them. However, the 275 under Stagecoach and Arriva are incomparable. That left me with a bad impression of Arriva. They do other things well like run very high frequency routes, but routes that are underbused they dont seem to know how to cope with them or ask TfL for help, more reactive than proactive with struggling routes IMOAE.
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Post by busoccultation on Jul 31, 2017 17:29:36 GMT
I thought the 123 was decent under arriva ? The next time I go in I'll have a look at the performance board if I remember The TfL stats for the 123 are decent. Arriva must be pulling in consistent bonuses from the route but remember there's a more generous "temporary timetable" in use and the performance target on EWT is not as tough as on some other routes. Given we will soon get more swathes of road works in E17 due to more Mini Holland and they will all be along the 123's route it'll be interesting to see how Arriva cope with that. In a beautiful twist of fate the works are likely to straddle the contract change date in 2019 so if there's a new operator in 17 months time they'll have a nice baptism of fire. I believe the main reason why 123 still has a 11 minute headway is purely so Arriva can get lot of performance related bonuses from TFL.
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Post by ServerKing on Jul 31, 2017 17:44:06 GMT
@eddiebus as much as you "hate" Stagecoach and certain allocations out of Leyton or other garages, I hate the busted exhaust on VLA104 and the noisy fans on the majority of the VLAs. Arriva is one of my favourite companies, but it is my opinion that these buses would be lucky to see the end of their contract seeing how the fans / silencers etc are on them at the minute, plus performance. Seeing as there is due to be a glut of HV's for the 341 / 243, more than likely DWs will move across (even some here "hate" the DWs, but although they lack the character of their DB250 forebears, I think they're OK ) I doubt CT Plus would have the space for the 123, and if anything I'd like Stagecach to get it next, just for a little variety but I have little clout on what happens next but I will voice my opinion I hate Stagecoach? Are you ok or mixed me with someone else? I love Stagecoach ok fine not as much as I used too but still do. Stagey have really slim chance of gaining the 123. I doubt theyll even bid for it. Perhaps this It's such a shame when there are people who know so much about Stagecoach and London Buses, but aren't given any say if decisions. Really not liking Stagecoach anymore and as a loyal enthusiast need to disclose that my love ended for them in ending 2014. I can't wait to leave East London and move on. Does anyone ever wish they had a time machine? I do, and I'd immediately return to 2013 July and carry on doing things differently. I am really a fan of T and admire the way they manage and organise there buses. Funny how yesterday a driver from T asked me my favourite route in the garage, my answer was none at all at present. I live in Leyton and this may sound silly but I feel sick at the way the routes have changed, I hope enthusiasts can understand. This is not SLN's fault but I hate those sh*tmasters on the 55 as mentioned before. After 230 going to Arriva, the 55 was my favourite route with operated by Tridents, then the 56 operated by Scanias followed by the 48 with Scanias. If anyone noticed till the very end of 2014, the Tridents wing mirrors were yellow instead of black, that looked cool. It also shames me how they are messing up the roads in Waltham Forest and East London, the new bus stop on Lea Bridge Road by Rigg Approach is terrible, it is so hard for the buses to get back onto the road. Whoever comes on with these stupid cycle lane ideas needs a good lecture in their face. It's a shame that it has come this far for me to post my feelings but no one understands me and I hope the forum users will. The changes are effecting my daily life and making me want to leave the East London area. was posted by someone else and I got my wires crossed. sorry We all can switch from liking to hating things, no harm meant. 123 back in the day was great for DLA thrash, DW's too before all the Econospeed stuff slowed them down. The original 54 reg VLA's had fan mod's then mysteriously disappeared up to Arriva NorthEast which made no sense, to be replaced by older, noiser versions. In that sense, I "hate" the 123. Factor in roadworks, and the stupid 20 zones lots of boroughs are introducing have personally made the route suck IMHO. I've always found Stagecoach buses well presented (love the chome on the rear wheels ) and miss the fact they no longer have the 230 and 67. I think a lot of operators are cagey about bidding for these routes as they don't know what eco rabbit TfL will pull out of the hat next, and they don't want to be stuck with nearly new 'non compliant' stock if TfL suddenly decided everything had to be electric or something else etc. More than likely Arriva will retain, but perhaps TT might have a go, we'll just have to wait and see. I think Ct Plus are OK, but they've got plenty to be getting on with in Walthamstow as it is
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2017 17:54:10 GMT
I hate Stagecoach? Are you ok or mixed me with someone else? I love Stagecoach ok fine not as much as I used too but still do. Stagey have really slim chance of gaining the 123. I doubt theyll even bid for it. Perhaps this It's such a shame when there are people who know so much about Stagecoach and London Buses, but aren't given any say if decisions. Really not liking Stagecoach anymore and as a loyal enthusiast need to disclose that my love ended for them in ending 2014. I can't wait to leave East London and move on. Does anyone ever wish they had a time machine? I do, and I'd immediately return to 2013 July and carry on doing things differently. I am really a fan of T and admire the way they manage and organise there buses. Funny how yesterday a driver from T asked me my favourite route in the garage, my answer was none at all at present. I live in Leyton and this may sound silly but I feel sick at the way the routes have changed, I hope enthusiasts can understand. This is not SLN's fault but I hate those sh*tmasters on the 55 as mentioned before. After 230 going to Arriva, the 55 was my favourite route with operated by Tridents, then the 56 operated by Scanias followed by the 48 with Scanias. If anyone noticed till the very end of 2014, the Tridents wing mirrors were yellow instead of black, that looked cool. It also shames me how they are messing up the roads in Waltham Forest and East London, the new bus stop on Lea Bridge Road by Rigg Approach is terrible, it is so hard for the buses to get back onto the road. Whoever comes on with these stupid cycle lane ideas needs a good lecture in their face. It's a shame that it has come this far for me to post my feelings but no one understands me and I hope the forum users will. The changes are effecting my daily life and making me want to leave the East London area. was posted by someone else and I got my wires crossed. sorry We all can switch from liking to hating things, no harm meant. 123 back in the day was great for DLA thrash, DW's too before all the Econospeed stuff slowed them down. The original 54 reg VLA's had fan mod's then mysteriously disappeared up to Arriva NorthEast which made no sense, to be replaced by older, noiser versions. In that sense, I "hate" the 123. Factor in roadworks, and the stupid 20 zones lots of boroughs are introducing have personally made the route suck IMHO. I've always found Stagecoach buses well presented (love the chome on the rear wheels ) and miss the fact they no longer have the 230 and 67. I think a lot of operators are cagey about bidding for these routes as they don't know what eco rabbit TfL will pull out of the hat next, and they don't want to be stuck with nearly new 'non compliant' stock if TfL suddenly decided everything had to be electric or something else etc. More than likely Arriva will retain, but perhaps TT might have a go, we'll just have to wait and see. I think CT Plus are OK, but they've got plenty to be getting on with in Walthamstow as it is Alright mate you win! I am trying to understand your opinions as I dont like the buses on the 123. When ever I use the route I would browse LVF to see if a DW is sneaking on it. HAHA
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Post by ServerKing on Jul 31, 2017 18:03:24 GMT
Perhaps this was posted by someone else and I got my wires crossed. sorry We all can switch from liking to hating things, no harm meant. 123 back in the day was great for DLA thrash, DW's too before all the Econospeed stuff slowed them down. The original 54 reg VLA's had fan mod's then mysteriously disappeared up to Arriva NorthEast which made no sense, to be replaced by older, noiser versions. In that sense, I "hate" the 123. Factor in roadworks, and the stupid 20 zones lots of boroughs are introducing have personally made the route suck IMHO. I've always found Stagecoach buses well presented (love the chome on the rear wheels ) and miss the fact they no longer have the 230 and 67. I think a lot of operators are cagey about bidding for these routes as they don't know what eco rabbit TfL will pull out of the hat next, and they don't want to be stuck with nearly new 'non compliant' stock if TfL suddenly decided everything had to be electric or something else etc. More than likely Arriva will retain, but perhaps TT might have a go, we'll just have to wait and see. I think CT Plus are OK, but they've got plenty to be getting on with in Walthamstow as it is Alright mate you win! I am trying to understand your opinions as I dont like the buses on the 123. When ever I use the route I would browse LVF to see if a DW is sneaking on it. HAHA No hard feeling mate, all banter I too check LVF for a DW if I need the 123, or if a short run from Turnpike Lane, or down to Bruce Grove, put up with the din As regarding the din on the 123's VLAs, I try to tune out and ignore it, a bit like when a politician opens his or her mouth ... my favourite bus riding times was back in 2002 when the Scania RM's were on the 8 when I lived in Bow, and the Euro3 3-speed Voith TA's (the LY02*** ones) Anyway to stay on topic, is the sole 1220 (classic E200) on the W5 Allison or Voith?
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Post by snoggle on Jul 31, 2017 18:49:41 GMT
The TfL stats for the 123 are decent. Arriva must be pulling in consistent bonuses from the route but remember there's a more generous "temporary timetable" in use and the performance target on EWT is not as tough as on some other routes. Given we will soon get more swathes of road works in E17 due to more Mini Holland and they will all be along the 123's route it'll be interesting to see how Arriva cope with that. In a beautiful twist of fate the works are likely to straddle the contract change date in 2019 so if there's a new operator in 17 months time they'll have a nice baptism of fire. I believe the main reason why 123 still has a 11 minute headway is purely so Arriva can get lot of performance related bonuses from TFL. It's not the real reason. I agree Arriva will be in no hurry to revert to the old timetable. TfL (and the Mayor via a MQ) have both said the timetable has remained in place to cope with a planned series of highway works including the T Hale gyratory (obviously now complete), Mini Holland works (clearly running behind schedule) and the Charlie Brown Roundabout crossing work. Once the next major phase of Mini Holland works kick in at the Bell and Blackhorse junctions then I expect things will be pretty horrible as temporary light phasings and lane restrictions will screw up the approaches to both junctions. The kerb adjustment works on Forest Road have so far been not too disruptive but there has been more space than there is on some of the forthcoming sections to be worked on.
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HCT Group
Jul 31, 2017 20:45:07 GMT
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Post by Volvo on Jul 31, 2017 20:45:07 GMT
I thought the 123 was decent under arriva ? The next time I go in I'll have a look at the performance board if I remember The TfL stats for the 123 are decent. Arriva must be pulling in consistent bonuses from the route but remember there's a more generous "temporary timetable" in use and the performance target on EWT is not as tough as on some other routes. Given we will soon get more swathes of road works in E17 due to more Mini Holland and they will all be along the 123's route it'll be interesting to see how Arriva cope with that. In a beautiful twist of fate the works are likely to straddle the contract change date in 2019 so if there's a new operator in 17 months time they'll have a nice baptism of fire. Glad I won't be doing the 123 then. Dealing with cyclists in the city is bad enough.
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Post by ServerKing on Jul 31, 2017 21:14:31 GMT
The TfL stats for the 123 are decent. Arriva must be pulling in consistent bonuses from the route but remember there's a more generous "temporary timetable" in use and the performance target on EWT is not as tough as on some other routes. Given we will soon get more swathes of road works in E17 due to more Mini Holland and they will all be along the 123's route it'll be interesting to see how Arriva cope with that. In a beautiful twist of fate the works are likely to straddle the contract change date in 2019 so if there's a new operator in 17 months time they'll have a nice baptism of fire. Glad I won't be doing the 123 then. Dealing with cyclists in the city is bad enough. If Waltham Forest gets destroyed by roadworks for this vanity project the way Enfield and the 329 was when they messed up London Road all the way to Winchmore Hill then at least the teenage buses won't make so much noise while they are held up by dug up roads and temporary lights... these are just commuter cycle lanes, which will add to pollution due to stationary traffic but I am sure they have thought that through
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Post by Volvo on Jul 31, 2017 23:10:53 GMT
Glad I won't be doing the 123 then. Dealing with cyclists in the city is bad enough. If Waltham Forest gets destroyed by roadworks for this vanity project the way Enfield and the 329 was when they messed up London Road all the way to Winchmore Hill then at least the teenage buses won't make so much noise while they are held up by dug up roads and temporary lights... these are just commuter cycle lanes, which will add to pollution due to stationary traffic but I am sure they have thought that through Someone was saying this the other day about 20mph limits and speed humps that surely they add pollution as you spend more time going slowly and with speed humps your speed up slow down alot so each time.
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 1, 2017 0:23:53 GMT
Interesting to note that CT Plus have been varying their operating centres and the number of vehicles at them. Ash Grove is up to 120 vehicles plus an area in railway arches. There is also a centre at Fish Island - not sure if that is new or not. Walthamstow has been upped to 60 vehicles. A lot of minibuses have vanished from Walthamstow garage so I wonder of CT Plus have found a new centre for their welfare work. Anyone know for certain? Makes for some interesting prospects in the future if CT Plus have space for 20-30 vehicles at Walthamstow. Opens up possibilities for them to try for the 123, 158, 20, 179 and 357 (depending on QI extensions where these are possible). 123 please! Walthamstow Police Station or Town Hall could be used for driver changes It would more likely be the Walthamstow 'Bell' point where it used to be up until 1991 when sadly London Forest Walthamstow garage closed down. RIP [WW]
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 1, 2017 0:31:34 GMT
I don't understand why so many people hate the 123 with Arriva. Obviously when next tendered the buses will change to probably DWs or HVs. Also it's not even up for tender now for a long time so what is the point of even this! This I thought the 123 was decent under arriva ? The next time I go in I'll have a look at the performance board if I remember but the 123 needs at least HVs or fix the DWs so they can get upto speed as I have heard form many drivers stories of the buses can't go faster than 25/30 or take ages to get to 40 and on the A406 50mph sections that can't be fun. They are bad enough of the 341. It hasn't been bad over past few years. Yes it does get hit with delays from A406 road closures etc but many of these things are out of control. Just a certain Dr Snoggle seems to have pitchforks at anything on 123 performance. As much as I love fast vehicles, no need for every bus in the fleet to be a pocket rocket. Most of the route isn't even the A406 anyway its just a short section, so fast buses are not even required imo. If you wanted slow you would have cried if you rode on some Dennis Dominators on the 123 making odd workings, they struggled badly to get a decent speed. The Cummins engine Leyland Olympian with ZF gearbox and the Dennis Arrow gave some very nice rides on the 123 'fast rides'. I never forget I got my ass kicked with a S reg euro 2 Trident against a J reg Leyland Olympian that was near fully loaded and I had an empty bus!!!
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 1, 2017 0:33:40 GMT
@eddiebus as much as you "hate" Stagecoach and certain allocations out of Leyton or other garages, I hate the busted exhaust on VLA104 and the noisy fans on the majority of the VLAs. Arriva is one of my favourite companies, but it is my opinion that these buses would be lucky to see the end of their contract seeing how the fans / silencers etc are on them at the minute, plus performance. Seeing as there is due to be a glut of HV's for the 341 / 243, more than likely DWs will move across (even some here "hate" the DWs, but although they lack the character of their DB250 forebears, I think they're OK ) I doubt CT Plus would have the space for the 123, and if anything I'd like Stagecach to get it next, just for a little variety but I have little clout on what happens next but I will voice my opinion I hate Stagecoach? Are you ok or mixed me with someone else? I love Stagecoach ok fine not as much as I used too but still do. Stagey have really slim chance of gaining the 123. I doubt theyll even bid for it. Like CT Plus any operator stands a chance. More than likely Stagecoach would bid for the 123. In the past I know they did bid for the route on 2 occasions, but were not successful.
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