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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2013 3:57:00 GMT
I drive the route every single day. I'm telling you it's used regardless of what you've seen. The reason we get worked up is because we're the people out there doing the job and some of the comments and opinions really do grate because there's no real facts or experiences behind it. Just deluded opinions. I've seen the EL2 on many occasions and never seen any passengers go to or from Dagenham Dock. Obviously if it were withdrawn and combined with the EL1 the overall PVR would be reduced. I've no idea why some people get so worked up, this is just about opinions, nobody has to be right or wrong and why on earth people are talking about job losses, redundancies etc is beyond me.
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Post by DT 11 on Mar 13, 2013 5:13:57 GMT
Only because the 197 is pretty infrequent, it need a PVR increase regardless of whether the 312 is axed. And I don't think the 312 demand/usage is as high as you say outside of peak hours, which is why it's operated by single deckers a lot of the time. Increase the 197 to x10mins, extend it to TC, axe the 312, job done. You can easily say get rid of the 312 and extend the 197 to TC, but have you actually thought about the reliability of the 197 and what it would do to the locals? The 312 performs better than the 197 and is a service to full back on, plus people actually have a choice ! By withdrawing the 312 passengers may have to put up with a diabolical service. Example when the 320 was extended to Catford Bridge. TFL and Metrobus Facebook got flood loads of complaints! It became the most under performing route operated by Metrobus. I remember reading on an article "the 320 was a service to be proud of you could almost set your watch to it". The residents of Biggin Hill had to put up with Curtailments to Biggin Hill Airport every day and this is still their main trunk Route. I remember seeing how unreliable the service was curtailments to Downham and Biggin Hill Airport were more common than the actual destinations! I remember observing 11 320s curtailed to Downham in a row not one of them made it to Catford, that's how much time the route was loosing and the driver changeovers at Keston Church took so long. It was then decided to increase the PVR to 12 this has made things better. The 312 I have been on with a full healthy loading and along with a 197 behind with a healthy loading, mostly every passenger coming out of Norwood Junction station. The 197 is not as reliable as the 312 hence why IT SHOULD not be withdrawn. Just because the 312 follows the 197, it is not a reason to withdraw it! I could easily say the 436 should get withdrawn because it follows the 36. The 436 in the peaks is ram packed I think it would be a good idea to extend the 312 to Crystal Palace.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2013 6:16:04 GMT
One last comment on the 197/312.....the 197 goes to TC now out of service, livening it up will add barely a few minutes and will not result in a diabolical service. The 320 and 36/436are totally different. The 130 could be extended to Crystal Palace.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2013 6:22:57 GMT
Which route do you do every day? Why is an opion that differs to yours 'deluded'? I think people need to lighten up a bit. I drive the route every single day. I'm telling you it's used regardless of what you've seen. The reason we get worked up is because we're the people out there doing the job and some of the comments and opinions really do grate because there's no real facts or experiences behind it. Just deluded opinions. I've seen the EL2 on many occasions and never seen any passengers go to or from Dagenham Dock. Obviously if it were withdrawn and combined with the EL1 the overall PVR would be reduced. I've no idea why some people get so worked up, this is just about opinions, nobody has to be right or wrong and why on earth people are talking about job losses, redundancies etc is beyond me.
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Post by DT 11 on Mar 13, 2013 6:49:05 GMT
One last comment on the 197/312.....the 197 goes to TC now out of service, livening it up will add barely a few minutes and will not result in a diabolical service. The 320 and 36/436are totally different. The 130 could be extended to Crystal Palace. How exactly do you know that? Barely add a few minutes could be up to 10-15 in the peaks. I've taken buses between South Croydon Bus Garage - The Town Centre and traffic does seen to build up there at times. Did it ever occur to you that the 312 may be so short to actually cope with the whole section that it actually does? Plus it will limit the locals to 1 service. You clearly have not given this any thought at all. Makes me wonder how you came to this conclusion in the first place, because you think the reason it should be withdrawn is because it duplicates the 197 then I suggest you take some trips on the 312 in the peaks and see how busy it is as well as the 197. You think it is a pointless route and others have stated reasons why It should not be withdrawn and you clearly ignore them. If the route was underused it would have already been withdrawn. The 36/436 are no different as they overlap just link the 197/312. The 130 should not be extended to Crystal Palace because it is due to be extended to Thornton Heath, Clock Tower.
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Post by DT 11 on Mar 13, 2013 7:03:09 GMT
Which route do you do every day? Why is an opion that differs to yours 'deluded'? I think people need to lighten up a bit. I drive the route every single day. I'm telling you it's used regardless of what you've seen. The reason we get worked up is because we're the people out there doing the job and some of the comments and opinions really do grate because there's no real facts or experiences behind it. Just deluded opinions. Chazaroo stated: In my opinion this topic is useless as most replies are based on shady observations. The whole point is to get people out of their cars and on to buses so if even 1 person uses that bus then its purpose has been fulfilled. No Issac Hunt, people don't need to lighten up you need to actually think before you post plus you need to show some respect for Chazroo. Chazroo actually drives the EL1 & EL2 so he will actually know the route better than you and everyone else on this forum! You cannot go against a drivers word because in fact they actually spend more time driving the actual bus route than you actually use them, one other thing they drive them end to end so they know! Your deluded opinions actually make you look silly.Chazaroo has stated: I'm telling you it's used regardless of what you've seen.Which you have clearly ignored. . So therefore you have achieved & learned nothing ;D
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2013 7:25:10 GMT
Calm down eh? I will be making no further comment on the 197/312, you are just bringing up points that have already been covered. I'm sure Chazeroo can speak for himself. And look at the row about the 13/139, I've not even commented on that one. It seems that some people will not be happy until this thread is locked.
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Post by VPL630 on Mar 13, 2013 7:27:12 GMT
Which route do you do every day? Why is an opion that differs to yours 'deluded'? I think people need to lighten up a bit. I drive the route every single day. I'm telling you it's used regardless of what you've seen. The reason we get worked up is because we're the people out there doing the job and some of the comments and opinions really do grate because there's no real facts or experiences behind it. Just deluded opinions. If you had actually read his post you wouldn't be asking that question, it's even in his Footer
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Post by DT 11 on Mar 13, 2013 7:38:43 GMT
Calm down eh? I will be making no further comment on the 197/312, you are just bringing up points that have already been covered. I'm sure Chazeroo can speak for himself. And look at the row about the 13/139, I've not even commented on that one. It seems that some people will not be happy until this thread is locked. Lol, who said I was annoyed? That's probably the best thing for you to do because people have already explained things to you, but you decide to completely ignore them. Lol, Chazaroo has already spoken for himself but you have also ignored him and yet still he actually drives the EL1 & EL2 so will effectively know much more than you! Lol, this thread IMO just brings up silly opinions to withdraw services which people have no given any thought about the possible outcomes it may cause and may result in the drivers paying for the Consequences. Really IMO there are not may Useless Routes in London.
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Post by DT 11 on Mar 13, 2013 7:39:51 GMT
Which route do you do every day? Why is an opion that differs to yours 'deluded'? I think people need to lighten up a bit. If you had actually read his post you wouldn't be asking that question, it's even in his Footer ^^^^^^^^^^^^^
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2013 7:43:51 GMT
Chazaroo stated: In my opinion this topic is useless as most replies are based on shady observations. The whole point is to get people out of their cars and on to buses so if even 1 person uses that bus then its purpose has been fulfilled.That opinion is complete tosh. If a single person used a bus then its purpose is pointless. They would be better off in a car. Less pollution, less delays, and no unnecessary financial burden to TfL
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Post by romfordbuses on Mar 13, 2013 7:51:15 GMT
Come on....We all know the opinion of an Enthusiast is more gospel than someone who actually drives the route day in, day out I don't think there is many (If any) routes what you could call useless in London or they wouldn't exist would they?
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Post by DT 11 on Mar 13, 2013 7:51:20 GMT
Chazaroo stated: In my opinion this topic is useless as most replies are based on shady observations. The whole point is to get people out of their cars and on to buses so if even 1 person uses that bus then its purpose has been fulfilled.That opinion is complete tosh. If a single person used a bus then its purpose is pointless. They would be better off in a car. Less pollution, less delays, and no unnecessary financial burden to TfL If everyone used public transport there would be less traffic on the road, less pollution and more money to fund Hybrid Technology to reduce pollution even more.
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Post by DLA 365 on Mar 13, 2013 7:51:30 GMT
Isaac Hunt - stop irritating people with sarcasting and antagonising comments.
As for the rest of the members, let it go. It is not worth it....
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2013 7:56:33 GMT
Oh its all my fault is it?
You know what, I really can't be bothered to argue about it, its like being back at school
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