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Post by snoggle on Nov 19, 2013 12:41:53 GMT
A slightly involved question about what happens between I-Bus, the bus ETM and the data that is captured when people use an Oyster card on a bus. Hopefully someone will know what happens!
My question is whether I-Bus "talks" to the bus ETM so that the ETM "knows" where the bus is when it stops at a bus stop? I believe drivers no longer have to press fare stages as a bus moves along a route. The reason for asking is whether TfL get data from the ETM that shows where an Oyster Card holder boarded a bus. I know there is no recording of exit data but it would be interesting to know if there is some hidden data on boarding. The Oyster data shown in an individual Oyster Card history just shows the route and time of boarding but no stop location.
Any info gratefully received.
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Post by bigbaddom1981 on Nov 19, 2013 13:30:22 GMT
I get emails about changes or roadworks for my local routes, so they must know I use a route, not sure if it's location based!
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Post by M1104 on Nov 19, 2013 14:56:00 GMT
ibus does indeed talk to the ETM because when the bus comes to the end of its journey the machine automatically resets to the next journey. Also, loading locations are recorded as TfL and operators would need this info to compare loading volumes and times at each bus stops... which is helpful with schedule changes and contract bidding/rebidding.
Incidentally fare stages don't exist on the buses anymore, not since the flat rate was introduced. Even the old Central (1), inner (2) and outer zones (3/4/5/6) are no longer applicable on buses.
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Post by slr on Nov 19, 2013 15:13:38 GMT
As you move along the route the ETM displays the exact stop number you are stopped at/passing at any given time, so it is entirely plausible that said data would be available next to an Oyster tap in.
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Post by snoggle on Nov 19, 2013 15:53:13 GMT
Thanks for the replies so far - very interesting.
I now have a clue as to what the apparently random numbers are that show up on the ETM display. I've seen these when sat on the front seat of an Arriva DW. I shall have to cross check them with what my phone tells me if tracking the bus using the LVF.
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Post by slr on Nov 19, 2013 19:28:51 GMT
It's the top line, will display the stop codes as displayed on the bottom of the flag, not sure if the codes on LVF are the text codes - I should think they are actually as it feeds off data for the apps etc.
It will display the code for the previous stop until the next stop is reached, not necessarily the stop the bus is closest to at the time.
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Post by greeny253 on Nov 21, 2013 14:24:27 GMT
I'll get a picture later when I'm at work and try and put it up on my break for you.
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Post by Swadbus on Nov 23, 2013 23:02:07 GMT
A slightly involved question about what happens between I-Bus, the bus ETM and the data that is captured when people use an Oyster card on a bus. Hopefully someone will know what happens! My question is whether I-Bus "talks" to the bus ETM so that the ETM "knows" where the bus is when it stops at a bus stop? I believe drivers no longer have to press fare stages as a bus moves along a route. The reason for asking is whether TfL get data from the ETM that shows where an Oyster Card holder boarded a bus. I know there is no recording of exit data but it would be interesting to know if there is some hidden data on boarding. The Oyster data shown in an individual Oyster Card history just shows the route and time of boarding but no stop location. Any info gratefully received. The ETM and iBus are very much connected. The 'random' numbers that appear on the Electronic Ticket Machine display are indeed the geocode stop numbers (not the same number as for countdown use). These update as the bus moves along the route. Certain stop also additionally provide the trigger point for routes to exit or enter the route when curtailed, and likewise for triggering announcements about tube info and change of trip number on the Electronic Ticket Machine too. Fare stages haven't been used for a long time now in the traditional sense, and haven't for internal purposes since the last software upgrade last year. The time, route, direction, and stop boarding info are recorded for each validation on Oyster internally.
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Post by bigbaddom1981 on Nov 23, 2013 23:20:45 GMT
A slightly involved question about what happens between I-Bus, the bus ETM and the data that is captured when people use an Oyster card on a bus. Hopefully someone will know what happens! My question is whether I-Bus "talks" to the bus ETM so that the ETM "knows" where the bus is when it stops at a bus stop? I believe drivers no longer have to press fare stages as a bus moves along a route. The reason for asking is whether TfL get data from the ETM that shows where an Oyster Card holder boarded a bus. I know there is no recording of exit data but it would be interesting to know if there is some hidden data on boarding. The Oyster data shown in an individual Oyster Card history just shows the route and time of boarding but no stop location. Any info gratefully received. The ETM and iBus are very much connected. The 'random' numbers that appear on the Electronic Ticket Machine display are indeed the geocode stop numbers (not the same number as for countdown use). These update as the bus moves along the route. Certain stop also additionally provide the trigger point for routes to exit or enter the route when curtailed, and likewise for triggering announcements about tube info and change of trip number on the Electronic Ticket Machine too. Fare stages haven't been used for a long time now in the traditional sense, and haven't for internal purposes since the last software upgrade last year. The time, route, direction, and stop boarding info are recorded for each validation on Oyster internally. Is it really difficult to change a destination on ibus mid journey as I've encountered many times the driver showing correct blind destination but ibus announcing something else!?
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Post by Swadbus on Nov 23, 2013 23:29:29 GMT
The ETM and iBus are very much connected. The 'random' numbers that appear on the Electronic Ticket Machine display are indeed the geocode stop numbers (not the same number as for countdown use). These update as the bus moves along the route. Certain stop also additionally provide the trigger point for routes to exit or enter the route when curtailed, and likewise for triggering announcements about tube info and change of trip number on the Electronic Ticket Machine too. Fare stages haven't been used for a long time now in the traditional sense, and haven't for internal purposes since the last software upgrade last year. The time, route, direction, and stop boarding info are recorded for each validation on Oyster internally. Is it really difficult to change a destination on ibus mid journey as I've encountered many times the driver showing correct blind destination but ibus announcing something else!? It's usually due to either: A) Lack of driver training / knowledge. B) A curtailment that isn't programmed into iBus due to it not being on the route record or an unusual instruction due to NOE or emergency curtailment due to disruption that is not a usual curtailment point. C) An instruction not to program the MDT from the garage official/supervisor who can initiate it on the workstation directly (rather than the driver doing it via the MDT). D) Faulty MDT.
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Post by snoggle on Nov 23, 2013 23:31:38 GMT
A slightly involved question about what happens between I-Bus, the bus ETM and the data that is captured when people use an Oyster card on a bus. Hopefully someone will know what happens! My question is whether I-Bus "talks" to the bus ETM so that the ETM "knows" where the bus is when it stops at a bus stop? I believe drivers no longer have to press fare stages as a bus moves along a route. The reason for asking is whether TfL get data from the ETM that shows where an Oyster Card holder boarded a bus. I know there is no recording of exit data but it would be interesting to know if there is some hidden data on boarding. The Oyster data shown in an individual Oyster Card history just shows the route and time of boarding but no stop location. Any info gratefully received. The ETM and iBus are very much connected. The 'random' numbers that appear on the Electronic Ticket Machine display are indeed the geocode stop numbers (not the same number as for countdown use). These update as the bus moves along the route. Certain stop also additionally provide the trigger point for routes to exit or enter the route when curtailed, and likewise for triggering announcements about tube info and change of trip number on the Electronic Ticket Machine too. Fare stages haven't been used for a long time now in the traditional sense, and haven't for internal purposes since the last software upgrade last year. The time, route, direction, and stop boarding info are recorded for each validation on Oyster internally. Very interesting and thanks for sharing that info. The route and direction aspect of the info is potentially very useful in seeing if there are patterns of journeys involving interchange between routes. Not quite as good as full entry and exit info for every bus journey but TfL would be able to impute journey patterns by applying time parameters for the journey so they can estimate where people get off one bus and then get on another within a short time rather than breaking their journey by doing something else at the "interchange" point. Nice to know they can see when I go to the supermarket every week.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2013 12:30:55 GMT
Is the tiny blue light I see on some bus stops anything to do with tracking the bus.
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Post by snowman on Nov 25, 2013 14:18:38 GMT
Is the tiny blue light I see on some bus stops anything to do with tracking the bus. Are you talking about the light on a button that you can press to light up the timetables (there are small led lights above the timetable display) useful when darkish, but so many roads have powerful streetlights that you can read them without the extra illumination anyway
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Post by Swadbus on Nov 26, 2013 13:40:34 GMT
Is the tiny blue light I see on some bus stops anything to do with tracking the bus. No they are buttons that illuminate the bus timetable. Try it...
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Post by snoggle on Mar 9, 2014 18:34:09 GMT
One further question re the bus stop number on the ETM - does the ETM "beep" as the bus stop number changes? I ask because I was sat behind the cab of a W11 the other day and noticed for the first time a "beep" as we got close to each stop on the route. Is the "beep" mutable by the driver as I have not heard it before? I imagine it might drive you insane if you heard it hundreds of times a day.
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