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Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2015 23:33:00 GMT
Who makes those dot matrix displays at bus stops?
When were they first introduced?
Also, I assume that TfL are the ones that actually provide and manage their service. Is that correct?
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Post by snoggle on Dec 12, 2015 23:56:51 GMT
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Post by vjaska on Dec 13, 2015 1:00:19 GMT
Who makes those dot matrix displays at bus stops? When were they first introduced? Also, I assume that TfL are the ones that actually provide and manage their service. Is that correct? They were first introduced in the very early 00's IIRC and whilst identical to the current ones, there were a few differences: The LED displays were in red rather than orange The scrolling message only told you something along the lines of, "Countdown brings you up to the minute information on routes" and then whatever routes the bus stop serves Not all bus routes were displayed - the two earliest bus stops in my area was the Brixton Station stop outside Iceland and the old Crownstone Road bus stop towards Brixton (was situated next to the zebra crossing on Effra Road) - the Brixton Station stop showed just the 3 & 35 and the Crownstone Road stop showed just the 3 & 37. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2015 10:06:04 GMT
Who makes those dot matrix displays at bus stops? When were they first introduced? Also, I assume that TfL are the ones that actually provide and manage their service. Is that correct? They were first introduced in the very early 00's IIRC and whilst identical to the current ones, there were a few differences: The LED displays were in red rather than orange The scrolling message only told you something along the lines of, "Countdown brings you up to the minute information on routes" and then whatever routes the bus stop serves Not all bus routes were displayed - the two earliest bus stops in my area was the Brixton Station stop outside Iceland and the old Crownstone Road bus stop towards Brixton (was situated next to the zebra crossing on Effra Road) - the Brixton Station stop showed just the 3 & 35 and the Crownstone Road stop showed just the 3 & 37. Actually I think the Countdown system was first introduced in 1992 as a trial along route 18. The trial proved successful and this was the first route to be put on Countdown. Around 1996-1997 TFL began deploying the system along other routes but I have read somewhere saying that a bus stop in Harlesden was the first from the trial and when the official system kicked in, either Brixton or Hammersmith were the first areas to receive Countdown. |
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Post by snoggle on Dec 13, 2015 10:27:33 GMT
They were first introduced in the very early 00's IIRC and whilst identical to the current ones, there were a few differences: The LED displays were in red rather than orange The scrolling message only told you something along the lines of, "Countdown brings you up to the minute information on routes" and then whatever routes the bus stop serves Not all bus routes were displayed - the two earliest bus stops in my area was the Brixton Station stop outside Iceland and the old Crownstone Road bus stop towards Brixton (was situated next to the zebra crossing on Effra Road) - the Brixton Station stop showed just the 3 & 35 and the Crownstone Road stop showed just the 3 & 37. Actually I think the Countdown system was first introduced in 1992 as a trial along route 18. The trial proved successful and this was the first route to be put on Countdown. Around 1996-1997 TFL began deploying the system along other routes but I have read somewhere saying that a bus stop in Harlesden was the first from the trial and when the official system kicked in, either Brixton or Hammersmith were the first areas to receive Countdown. Trial systems are not the same as what is now I-Bus. LT and LRT experimented with a range of systems over the years to track buses (BESI was on route 36 and Countdown on route 18) and to try to predict arrival times. These systems relied on fixed beacons along the route which then picked up vehicles fitted with appropriate tags and then the info was sent to the control room / displays. I-Bus is different because it uses GPS and the vehicles send their location every few seconds. kurtraschke.com/2011/10/the-case-for-bus-avlwww.20thcenturylondon.org.uk/ltm-1998-36690archive.commercialmotor.com/article/27th-december-1957/24/buses-tracked-by-new-electronic-systemI-Bus was trialled on route 149 IIRC and Tottenham was the first garage to fully convert. I remember this because the 123 suddenly got talking buses.  |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2015 22:14:36 GMT
Thanks for all the information! Especially to Snoggle for providing some really great reading material as well as the video. I didn't even know B.E.S.I existed. How interesting.
How exactly is the location for Countdown displays decided? They seem to be put in random places. Also: why do Bus Stations not have some sort of Countdown display? Vauxhall and Canada Water don't have them at least.
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Post by snoggle on Dec 15, 2015 22:36:30 GMT
Thanks for all the information! Especially to Snoggle for providing some really great reading material as well as the video. I didn't even know B.E.S.I existed. How interesting. How exactly is the location for Countdown displays decided? They seem to be put in random places. Also: why do Bus Stations not have some sort of Countdown display? Vauxhall and Canada Water don't have them at least. TfL said they were aiming to locate Countdown displays at busy stops with high numbers of passengers using them. Clearly there are some compromises because otherwise all the displays would be in Zone 1. They also tried to provide a decent spread across each borough and to reflect where old style signs had been located in the past. IIRC they tried to do this all very logically and then got "slaughtered" by the public and councillors complaining about "stupid" sign locations. TfL then had to come back and change things round to reflect local feedback / consultation. I have never ever understood the reluctance to provide signs at stops in bus stations. The display boards at Walthamstow, Vauxhall etc are not very good IMO. They're located at entry points to the bus stations which has some logic to it but they're away from most stops meaning you face a trek to check times. I also intensely dislike the random way in which departures are listed - not every route is shown which is plain daft. There really should be a route or stand by stand display that lists *every* route. TfL have been pushing hard for places like hospitals, schools, colleges etc to fund computer type screens for indoor locations. TfL would tailor the data but someone has to pay for the installation. I've no idea how successful this venture has been. I'm more worried that there seems to be a secret policy to remove Countdown signs and hope people don't notice. I've even come across a dummy Countdown sign which just had a sticker telling you to get a text message. That's outrageous. I know TfL have issues with the Countdown contract but I really wish they would install more signs on the network. There is a significant proportion of people who value the info and who don't have / can't afford texts and smartphone use. |
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Post by vjaska on Dec 15, 2015 23:00:45 GMT
Thanks for all the information! Especially to Snoggle for providing some really great reading material as well as the video. I didn't even know B.E.S.I existed. How interesting. How exactly is the location for Countdown displays decided? They seem to be put in random places. Also: why do Bus Stations not have some sort of Countdown display? Vauxhall and Canada Water don't have them at least. TfL said they were aiming to locate Countdown displays at busy stops with high numbers of passengers using them. Clearly there are some compromises because otherwise all the displays would be in Zone 1. They also tried to provide a decent spread across each borough and to reflect where old style signs had been located in the past. IIRC they tried to do this all very logically and then got "slaughtered" by the public and councillors complaining about "stupid" sign locations. TfL then had to come back and change things round to reflect local feedback / consultation. I have never ever understood the reluctance to provide signs at stops in bus stations. The display boards at Walthamstow, Vauxhall etc are not very good IMO. They're located at entry points to the bus stations which has some logic to it but they're away from most stops meaning you face a trek to check times. I also intensely dislike the random way in which departures are listed - not every route is shown which is plain daft. There really should be a route or stand by stand display that lists *every* route. TfL have been pushing hard for places like hospitals, schools, colleges etc to fund computer type screens for indoor locations. TfL would tailor the data but someone has to pay for the installation. I've no idea how successful this venture has been. I'm more worried that there seems to be a secret policy to remove Countdown signs and hope people don't notice. I've even come across a dummy Countdown sign which just had a sticker telling you to get a text message. That's outrageous. I know TfL have issues with the Countdown contract but I really wish they would install more signs on the network. There is a significant proportion of people who value the info and who don't have / can't afford texts and smartphone use. TfL's handling of the countdown situation is farcical at times. I mean all Brixton Station bus stops had countdown screens until Lambeth widened the pavements resulting in the old shelters being removed from the KFC side of Brixton Road and new ones being installed without countdown screens and the northbound side losing the wider bus stop flag poles that had countdown screens on them for bog standard bus stop flag poles without the screens. So, if you want a countdown screen in Brixton, use Brixton Police Station, Brixton O2 Academy or Lambeth Town Hall stops. Meanwhile, even to this day, all the Brixton Hill bus stops have countdown screens. |
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Post by abc on Dec 23, 2015 13:44:19 GMT
What does the destination SEE BUS BLIND mean?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2015 14:14:04 GMT
What does the destination SEE BUS BLIND mean? I have been seeing this on Route 71 all day long. The destination either appears as SOUTHBOUND, NORTHBOUND, NO INFORMATION or SEE BUS BLIND. This occasionally happens on the 465 too. |
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Post by abc on Dec 23, 2015 14:19:23 GMT
First saw it on 27. Now on 36 as well. In both cases all buses on the route had that text while all other lines appeared normally.
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Post by snoggle on Dec 23, 2015 14:49:59 GMT
What does the destination SEE BUS BLIND mean? It means Countdown does not have the destination information for the bus and you should check the front of the bus as it approaches the stop to see where it is going. There is a technical problem with the system. |
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Post by vjaska on Dec 23, 2015 18:25:09 GMT
What does the destination SEE BUS BLIND mean? Don't take this the wrong way as I'm not trying to be rude but isn't it self explanatory? |
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Post by abc on Dec 23, 2015 18:34:29 GMT
What does the destination SEE BUS BLIND mean? Don't take this the wrong way as I'm not trying to be rude but isn't it self explanatory? My question was about what was going on with the system. |
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Post by ibus246 on Dec 23, 2015 19:49:36 GMT
What does the destination SEE BUS BLIND mean? Don't take this the wrong way as I'm not trying to be rude but isn't it self explanatory? You say that but think of it this way from a non enthusiasts point of view. Would you even know what the terminology "blind" is? Simpler to put "See Destination on front of bus" |
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