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Post by enviroPB on Jun 21, 2016 5:47:11 GMT
Simply put; once the Night Tube starts, travelling on the weekend at least, will transform night-time travel to the likes not seen before. That prospect alone has arguably spurred counties around London to have night routes. Slough and Dartford now see night buses, mysteriously launched at the time Night Tube was supposed to start. Greater London needs to help out the home counties to get passengers home; and it's about time the N279 stops being the sole night route to technically leave London during operation.
Using compass points, I propose 3 other routes join the N279.
-From the east; the 174 should receive 24-hour status and the N86 rerouted from Gallows Corner via the 498 to Brentwood town centre.
-From the south-east; make the 96 24-hours or give Dartford a night service. Perhaps extend either N132 or N486 past Bexleyheath but nightly services are preferrable.
-From the west; well that's obvious. Make the 81 24 hour or give that corridor past Heathrow a night service.
Assuming the Night Tube is in motion, what are your thoughts & views with night buses serving areas that technically isn't in greater London but is within the M25? I purposely left south London alone as I'm not too knowledgeable there but at a quick glance, I'd give the 293 a night service (to Epsom). I would also have a N237 which will go to Sunbury Village via the 235 past Hounslow Heath.
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Post by Green Kitten on Jun 21, 2016 8:05:29 GMT
There's no way that TfL are going to fund any more night routes out of London (they're already making the cuts to daytime cross-boundary routes). If they touch the 298 there's going to be trouble.  (i.e. I'll rant about it on Twitter whilst they withdraw it.  ) I would extend the N20 or N91, in my dream world of kittens, rainbows, ponies and unicorns, to Potters Bar Station, however there's not much demand for this. I'm often the only person on the last 298 to Potters Bar. (However there are a lot of punters late at night alighting at Potters Bar on the last Great Northern services). It'll be Uber for me I'm afraid!  An N16 or N113 to Watford Junction might be used quite a bit more, however. |
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Post by snoggle on Jun 21, 2016 9:27:05 GMT
Nice idea. It'll never happen. No money in the TfL budget and certainly none from neighbouring authorities. With the advance of Uber and similar concepts they are going to grab whatever low volume flows there are. Night buses are already showing signs of decline and many outer suburban service now carry lower volumes than the night routes which were axed in Ken Livingstone's days (e.g. N58, N75, N101, N106, part curtailment of the N213). Makes we wonder how TfL can justify running these more marginal services.
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Post by stubag on Jun 21, 2016 9:48:05 GMT
Simply put; once the Night Tube starts, travelling on the weekend at least, will transform night-time travel to the likes not seen before. That prospect alone has arguably spurred counties around London to have night routes. Slough and Dartford now see night buses, mysteriously launched at the time Night Tube was supposed to start. Greater London needs to help out the home counties to get passengers home; and it's about time the N279 stops being the sole night route to technically leave London during operation. Using compass points, I propose 3 other routes join the N279. -From the east; the 174 should receive 24-hour status and the N86 rerouted from Gallows Corner via the 498 to Brentwood town centre. -From the south-east; make the 96 24-hours or give Dartford a night service. Perhaps extend either N132 or N486 past Bexleyheath but nightly services are preferrable. -From the west; well that's obvious. Make the 81 24 hour or give that corridor past Heathrow a night service. Assuming the Night Tube is in motion, what are your thoughts & views with night buses serving areas that technically isn't in greater London but is within the M25? I purposely left south London alone as I'm not too knowledgeable there but at a quick glance, I'd give the 293 a night service (to Epsom). I would also have a N237 which will go to Sunbury Village via the 235 past Hounslow Heath. Doesn't First route 75 run 24 hours from Heathrow to Slough |
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Post by snoggle on Jun 21, 2016 10:34:42 GMT
Simply put; once the Night Tube starts, travelling on the weekend at least, will transform night-time travel to the likes not seen before. That prospect alone has arguably spurred counties around London to have night routes. Slough and Dartford now see night buses, mysteriously launched at the time Night Tube was supposed to start. Greater London needs to help out the home counties to get passengers home; and it's about time the N279 stops being the sole night route to technically leave London during operation. Using compass points, I propose 3 other routes join the N279. -From the east; the 174 should receive 24-hour status and the N86 rerouted from Gallows Corner via the 498 to Brentwood town centre. -From the south-east; make the 96 24-hours or give Dartford a night service. Perhaps extend either N132 or N486 past Bexleyheath but nightly services are preferrable. -From the west; well that's obvious. Make the 81 24 hour or give that corridor past Heathrow a night service. Assuming the Night Tube is in motion, what are your thoughts & views with night buses serving areas that technically isn't in greater London but is within the M25? I purposely left south London alone as I'm not too knowledgeable there but at a quick glance, I'd give the 293 a night service (to Epsom). I would also have a N237 which will go to Sunbury Village via the 235 past Hounslow Heath. Doesn't First route 75 run 24 hours from Heathrow to Slough He did say that Slough has a night service.  |
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Post by vjaska on Jun 21, 2016 10:44:32 GMT
Nice idea. It'll never happen. No money in the TfL budget and certainly none from neighbouring authorities. With the advance of Uber and similar concepts they are going to grab whatever low volume flows there are. Night buses are already showing signs of decline and many outer suburban service now carry lower volumes than the night routes which were axed in Ken Livingstone's days (e.g. N58, N75, N101, N106, part curtailment of the N213). Makes we wonder how TfL can justify running these more marginal services. Even if Uber didn't exist and TfL had a surplus in the budget, I'd still question why night bus links would needed in the outer extremities of London given the population in those areas are predominantly wealthy, own cars and generally have thriving taxi trades. |
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Post by enviroPB on Jun 21, 2016 10:55:00 GMT
TfL may be on a budget I accept, but after the Night Tube consultation for the liberation of many night bus routes, I think night-time travelling will buck the trend of daytime travel. If you look at the original document which implies savings from cutting frequencies of night buses that duplicate the Night Tube; there are 16 bus routes with services slashed whereas there are 21 new night bus services proposed (20 if you offset the loss of the N47).
I accept factors like our previous Mayor wanting to charge utility companies and the like for digging up our roads religiously, but politics meant he back-pedalled on that policy hideously. I accept traffic has gotten worse and bus priority almost locked away with history; especially so in central London where buses are temporarily withdrawn and years later, that temporary withdrawl is still in place. I don't agree but accept what's happening to our bus network in the day. At night however, we are talking about a whole different ball game.
Night bus usage, last time I checked, hasn't bucked the trend of increasing 170% in the past 15 years. Routes like the N15 and N21 have seen their numbers continue to steadily grow. This is despite other nights routes along both routes respectively seeing a 'reliever route' eg. the 238 for the N15 & the weekend 132 for the N21. The N47 had usage of approximately 12,000 extra journeys per annum until 2014'15, where it disbanded to birth 2 new night routes. Admittedly it was hard to find facts to back up my point in more affluent corners of London but we all know that demographic is not the target here. The target demographic are the shift workers, around Dartford & Slough to cite but a couple; who hope to work at any time of their choosing. Unfortunately they don't have the means to.
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Post by enviroPB on Jun 21, 2016 11:06:32 GMT
Nice idea. It'll never happen. No money in the TfL budget and certainly none from neighbouring authorities. With the advance of Uber and similar concepts they are going to grab whatever low volume flows there are. Night buses are already showing signs of decline and many outer suburban service now carry lower volumes than the night routes which were axed in Ken Livingstone's days (e.g. N58, N75, N101, N106, part curtailment of the N213). Makes we wonder how TfL can justify running these more marginal services. Even if Uber didn't exist and TfL had a surplus in the budget, I'd still question why night bus links would needed in the outer extremities of London given the population in those areas are predominantly wealthy, own cars and generally have thriving taxi trades. London's population is ever increasing and unfortunately the high cost of living is being pushed out into the suburbs. I'm not calling for buses to replace private hire taxis, but simply to supplement the trade. It's the myth that buses don't go past this imaginary line to serve areas because it's not in London that I want to squash. For example, it wouldn't be that costly to add a few minutes' running time on the N55 to have it go to Loughton town centre instead of it terminate at desolate Woodford Wells. And yes, I know the Night Tube will go out to Loughton and passengers will probably transfer to the Central line. But not everyone; not everyone can afford that switch that's being unanimously tarnished as a seamless transfer. |
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(i.e. I'll rant about it on Twitter whilst they withdraw it. 
)
