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Post by sid on Sept 6, 2016 5:24:10 GMT
I really don't understand the constant negativity, it was inevitable that this was going to happen sooner or later and the situation is bad enough now at busy times without the masses that Crossrail is expected to bring to the area. Bus routes along Oxford Street have been thinned out over recent years and remaining routes are often very lightly loaded. Yes a few people might be slightly inconvenienced but the same would apply to any other area that has been pedestrianised and they wouldn't have two underground railway lines as an alternative. It's simple enough. People are demanding bus reductions well in advance of 2018. That's unacceptable. There is no funding nor is there an agreed scheme for Oxford St pedestrianisation. There is no legal sign off from anyone. Boris talked about it for over 4 years and got nowhere. Anyone who thinks Mayor Khan can magically make Westminster City Council, whose street it is, do what he might want is living in cloud cuckoo land. They have the responsibility to balance a whole load of conflicting issues and they'll be responsible for doing the work. I wonder when the next council elections are? Oh yes, May 2018 - excellent timing.  We don't have two underground railways today and we won't have them until Dec 2018. Even in 2018 Crossrail will not be operating a full service - that takes at least another year. The railway that is currently there is not accessible nor are there plans to make Oxford Circus or Marble Arch stations accessible at any time within the next decade never mind by 2018/9. Therefore it is wholly unreasonable to withdraw the accessible public transport available to everyone when there is no alternative. If WCC or TfL try to do this without a full and proper Equality Impact Assessment they'll find themselves on the wrong end of a legal challenge - guaranteed! Transport for All will ensure that happens. And just because you are seemingly happy with this policy really doesn't mean everyone else has to be. I wouldn't go as far as to say I'm happy about it, I just see it as inevitable. I can remember similar concerns being aired when North End in Croydon was closed to buses years ago, largely due to safety reasons. |
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Post by sid on Sept 6, 2016 5:33:59 GMT
remaining routes are often very lightly loaded. Sorry but this statement is a myth. I accept some routes along Oxford Street have small loads but not all do - just recently, I've done the 7 and 98 along Oxford Street and both were very busy. These are not one offs either as over the years, I've seen squillions of packed buses along Oxford Street on a number of different routes. Pedestrianisation will create more issues than it's solves - traffic will simply not vanish into thin air but instead be plonked elsewhere making that place full of congestion and pollution whilst the poor & less able lose links left, right & centre because some moany residents will have heart attacks at the sight of buses passing their front door supposedly full of axe murders, thieves, etc. Meanwhile, the extremely overrated black taxi trade will be able to rob more peoples money in the process - absolutely criminal! I'm not suggesting that every single bus carries little more than fresh air, some are busy, but at busy times it's certainly not unusual to see buses on the 25 and 55 for example empty out at TCR because it is quicker to walk, then crawl along empty to Oxford Circus to turn around and probably just pick up a handful of passengers on the way back. When Oxford Street is at a standstill it's generally quicker to walk to Marble Arch, Regent Street or TCR and get a bus from there. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2016 6:15:32 GMT
This is all cynical comments being made by people and agencies / firms / councils demanding the road closures.
It is all to do with money.
Not safety, that is a convenient little excuse to throw into the arguments.
Money, because of Westfield. They have two sites already and by 2019 I would imagine the Croydon one will be open.
The only way they can make Oxford Street more like Westfield is to create the pedestrian themed environment.
Yet it will all backfire, because pedestrians need to get there in the first instance. They also need to get back with all their shopping, workers need to get to the shops, etc.
The accessibility side of things is crucial to those in opposition of the plans, and I hope the protest groups pick up on this early to put pressure on WCC accordingly.
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Post by sid on Sept 7, 2016 8:36:57 GMT
This is all cynical comments being made by people and agencies / firms / councils demanding the road closures. It is all to do with money. Not safety, that is a convenient little excuse to throw into the arguments. Money, because of Westfield. They have two sites already and by 2019 I would imagine the Croydon one will be open. The only way they can make Oxford Street more like Westfield is to create the pedestrian themed environment. Yet it will all backfire, because pedestrians need to get there in the first instance. They also need to get back with all their shopping, workers need to get to the shops, etc. The accessibility side of things is crucial to those in opposition of the plans, and I hope the protest groups pick up on this early to put pressure on WCC accordingly. The whole reason shops are open is to make money so that's rather stating the obvious, you encourage more customers by creating a safer and more pleasant environment. I really can't see why you think this is going to backfire, is Oxford Street going to become a ghost town or will it be more popular than ever? I strongly suspect the latter but obviously time will tell. It is really not much different to pedestrianisation in towns like Croydon and Kingston. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2016 10:21:28 GMT
This is all cynical comments being made by people and agencies / firms / councils demanding the road closures. It is all to do with money. Not safety, that is a convenient little excuse to throw into the arguments. Money, because of Westfield. They have two sites already and by 2019 I would imagine the Croydon one will be open. The only way they can make Oxford Street more like Westfield is to create the pedestrian themed environment. Yet it will all backfire, because pedestrians need to get there in the first instance. They also need to get back with all their shopping, workers need to get to the shops, etc. The accessibility side of things is crucial to those in opposition of the plans, and I hope the protest groups pick up on this early to put pressure on WCC accordingly. The whole reason shops are open is to make money so that's rather stating the obvious, you encourage more customers by creating a safer and more pleasant environment. B I really can't see why you think this is going to backfire, is Oxford Street going to become a ghost town or will it be more popular than ever? I strongly suspect the latter but obviously time will tell. It is really not much different to pedestrianisation in towns like Croydon and Kingston. I cant understand how you can compare with Kingston or Croydon. Neither meant huge implications and potential withdrawal of bus routes. |
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Post by sid on Sept 7, 2016 11:28:18 GMT
The whole reason shops are open is to make money so that's rather stating the obvious, you encourage more customers by creating a safer and more pleasant environment. B I really can't see why you think this is going to backfire, is Oxford Street going to become a ghost town or will it be more popular than ever? I strongly suspect the latter but obviously time will tell. It is really not much different to pedestrianisation in towns like Croydon and Kingston. I cant understand how you can compare with Kingston or Croydon. Neither meant huge implications and potential withdrawal of bus routes. Certainly in the case of Croydon much the same arguments were put forward regarding the distance between bus stops and the shopping area especially for southbound buses but people soon got used to the arrangement and I don't think many people would be favour of returning buses to North End now. The opening of Crossrail is inevitably going to result in some reductions in bus services anyway. |
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Post by snoggle on Nov 1, 2016 0:17:33 GMT
From the latest TfL Commissioner's Report.
TfL aiming to cut 40% of buses from Oxford Street in an upcoming consultation.
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Post by southlondonbus on Nov 1, 2016 7:13:10 GMT
I think we can Safely say Sadiq Kahn will not be stepping in to save the 13. How can TFL possibly reduced the numbers if they can remove any routes altogether.
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Post by sid on Nov 1, 2016 7:52:48 GMT
I think we can Safely say Sadiq Kahn will not be stepping in to save the 13. How can TFL possibly reduced the numbers if they can remove any routes altogether. Sorry if I've misunderstood something but your post doesn't seem to make much sense? And isn't the 82 going to be renumbered 13? |
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Post by routew15 on Nov 1, 2016 8:08:03 GMT
From the latest TfL Commissioner's Report. TfL aiming to cut 40% of buses from Oxford Street in an upcoming consultation. The north-south Victoria Northern and Jubliee Lines are most definitely the enhanced routes being mentioned as Central Line currently is not. Oxford Circus station is a frequent culprit of station closures due to overcrowding (something that was meant to be less frequent once TCR reopened fully). Whilst Stratford does often get very busy at least you can get into the station with your shopping, standing in the rain with bags of shopping will not be any experience many shoppers wish to have . |
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Post by southlondonbus on Nov 1, 2016 21:29:15 GMT
What I'm saying is is that inevitably when Oxford street is pedestrianised TFL will simply not divert every route in their current form down alternative roads as that would simply move the problem elsewhere. For that reason some routes will inevitably be removed from the area altogether so if the chance to remove one outright like the 13 comes along there's not much change of it being saved.
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Post by danorak on Nov 24, 2016 10:35:48 GMT
From the latest TfL Commissioner's Report. TfL aiming to cut 40% of buses from Oxford Street in an upcoming consultation. According to the agenda paper for next week's London Travelwatch Board Meeting, TfL will launch its consultation on Central London bus changes tomorrow. |
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Post by snoggle on Nov 24, 2016 12:10:42 GMT
From the latest TfL Commissioner's Report. TfL aiming to cut 40% of buses from Oxford Street in an upcoming consultation. According to the agenda paper for next week's London Travelwatch Board Meeting, TfL will launch its consultation on Central London bus changes tomorrow. Yes I've just seen the very same thing. Time for a new mega thread to emerge! I wonder how long TfL will allow for the consultation given the likely scale of the changes and the approaching holiday season. |
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Post by danorak on Nov 24, 2016 13:01:05 GMT
According to the agenda paper for next week's London Travelwatch Board Meeting, TfL will launch its consultation on Central London bus changes tomorrow. Yes I've just seen the very same thing. Time for a new mega thread to emerge! I wonder how long TfL will allow for the consultation given the likely scale of the changes and the approaching holiday season. I have my crayons standing by. It's Black Friday tomorrow: hope that's not an omen... |
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Post by danorak on Nov 25, 2016 9:38:24 GMT
The consultation's up: done as a series of separate consultations rather than one big one it seems.
To the consultation sub-forum....
Edited to add that although they are presented separately, there looks to be one response form.
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