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Post by busman on Aug 16, 2019 20:14:25 GMT
For those who are sure the 427 will be diverted to Southall in April 2020, what makes you so certain it will happen a month before the mayoral election? Has the diversion been confirmed by anyone? Recently there have been a few reversals of previous cuts and some routes being extended. The 301 was introduced in addition to existing services. Call me cynical, but it’s possible the mayor won’t want to give his opponents any more sticks to beat him with and we see a temporary mellowing of TfLs aggressive cuts.
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Post by busaholic on Aug 16, 2019 20:20:16 GMT
They've cut the 25 before Crossrail opens so they'll do the 427. Not to mention the 427 already has its part of Crossrail running while the 25 didn't at all. Which form of Crossrail is currently running? Answer: none of it.
TfL Rail already existed Liverpool Street-Shenfield when the 25 was cutback. When the 427 gets cutback, all that'll be running is TfL Rail Heathrow-Paddington. However, as I'm sure you know, TfL Rail is just a temporary facade adopted by TfL since they've taken over the LS-Shenfield and Paddington-Heathrow lines, no significant alterations to frequencies or stopping paterns have been made under TfL Rail
I was listening to a very interesting radio programme yesterday about Berlin's Brandenburg Willy Brandt Airport, originally due to open in 2012, with a succession of opening dates after that but still bereft of both airlines and passengers. The airport appears to be complete (the baggage carousels are kept functioning 24 hours per day because of fears that they'd seize up otherwise) and the lovely spacious station under the airport sees a 'ghost' train every day mainly in order to blow air through the structure. The reasons for the monumental delays and huge cost overruns are, of course, unique to the project but elements among them made me prick up my ears and make valid comparisons with Crossrail, not least the competing parties responsible for the delivery of the project, huge egos requiring massaging and the inability, or unwillingness, to tell truth to power. The incredible amount of wiring for different purposes, mostly hidden away of course, has been added to on many occasions, with new people/contractors on each occasion, and there was an admission from someone in the know that there was now nobody involved with the project who knew, or could explain, what all of it was for. Much of the later stuff wouldn't work in conjunction with the original stuff. I have a very strong feeling that the Crossrail core is facing similar problems, let alone all the station work that still needs to be done, and it could be years before it opens with (I suspect) systems having to be ripped out and replaced before then. Signalling must be the most obvious concern.
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Post by george on Aug 16, 2019 20:23:41 GMT
Which form of Crossrail is currently running? Answer: none of it.
TfL Rail already existed Liverpool Street-Shenfield when the 25 was cutback. When the 427 gets cutback, all that'll be running is TfL Rail Heathrow-Paddington. However, as I'm sure you know, TfL Rail is just a temporary facade adopted by TfL since they've taken over the LS-Shenfield and Paddington-Heathrow lines, no significant alterations to frequencies or stopping paterns have been made under TfL Rail
I was listening to a very interesting radio programme yesterday about Berlin's Brandenburg Willy Brandt Airport, originally due to open in 2012, with a succession of opening dates after that but still bereft of both airlines and passengers. The airport appears to be complete (the baggage carousels are kept functioning 24 hours per day because of fears that they'd seize up otherwise) and the lovely spacious station under the airport sees a 'ghost' train every day mainly in order to blow air through the structure. The reasons for the monumental delays and huge cost overruns are, of course, unique to the project but elements among them made me prick up my ears and make valid comparisons with Crossrail, not least the competing parties responsible for the delivery of the project, huge egos requiring massaging and the inability, or unwillingness, to tell truth to power. The incredible amount of wiring for different purposes, mostly hidden away of course, has been added to on many occasions, with new people/contractors on each occasion, and there was an admission from someone in the know that there was now nobody involved with the project who knew, or could explain, what all of it was for. Much of the later stuff wouldn't work in conjunction with the original stuff. I have a very strong feeling that the Crossrail core is facing similar problems, let alone all the station work that still needs to be done, and it could be years before it opens with (I suspect) systems having to be ripped out and replaced before then. Signalling must be the most obvious concern. For those that don't know about Berlin Airport here is a very interesting video about it www.youtube.com/watch?v=ll58ZrIupKA
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Post by vjaska on Aug 16, 2019 21:33:56 GMT
For those who are sure the 427 will be diverted to Southall in April 2020, what makes you so certain it will happen a month before the mayoral election? Has the diversion been confirmed by anyone? Recently there have been a few reversals of previous cuts and some routes being extended. The 301 was introduced in addition to existing services. Call me cynical, but it’s possible the mayor won’t want to give his opponents any more sticks to beat him with and we see a temporary mellowing of TfLs aggressive cuts. I think it will be diverted in December conveniently coinciding with the the 278's introduction and Crossrail operating from Paddington to Reading. If they were happy to cut the 25 before Crossrail even begun and the 25 being much busier than the 427, there is nothing stopping them doing it to the 427 bar substantial opposition. That way, it's in way before the mayoral election takes place in which case TfL would presume it's been all forgotten about. My guess is anything not cut before January will survive either temporarily until the elections are finished or permanently - the cycnic in me says thats why December has been purposely chosen and probably why the 159's cut has suddenly become permanent when roadworks have cropped up - get it out of the way now and people will forget about it they hope.
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Post by southlondonbus on Aug 16, 2019 22:20:37 GMT
With the 48 in October that is potentially most the planned cuts done thou there was a rumour the 460 was going to be withdrawn and the Sutton review still hasn't happened.
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Post by rif153 on Aug 17, 2019 8:29:29 GMT
With the 48 in October that is potentially most the planned cuts done thou there was a rumour the 460 was going to be withdrawn and the Sutton review still hasn't happened. Well that looks to have been kicked into the long grass. I wonder if changes to the 80/93/151/154 are planned in the Sutton review as those routes got a two year extension so now crop up after the mayoral election, a convinenient way for TfL to postpone the review/changes if that is the case (which it may not be)
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Post by southlondonbus on Aug 17, 2019 9:00:24 GMT
I think it more centred on the S4 and 470. I could easily have seen the 151 cut to Sutton thou aswell.
With the 13 more frequent then the 82 I think you could possibly cope without the 460 between Golders Green and North Finchley particulary if there are plans to extend another route to N Finchley.
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Post by COBO on Oct 2, 2019 13:16:50 GMT
aparently my colleague has had a TfL consultation posted through his letter box regarding a night service for the Uxbridge branch for the Piccadilly Line that runs from Central London. I thought that it would be on TfL website but it's not.
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Post by rif153 on Oct 2, 2019 18:28:39 GMT
aparently my colleague has had a TfL consultation posted through his letter box regarding a night service for the Uxbridge branch for the Piccadilly Line that runs from Central London. I thought that it would be on TfL website but it's not. If it goes ahead, that'll be excellent. I hope the night service continues all the way to Uxbridge, my fear is it'll only go as far as Rayners Lane.
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Post by COBO on Oct 2, 2019 18:31:10 GMT
aparently my colleague has had a TfL consultation posted through his letter box regarding a night service for the Uxbridge branch for the Piccadilly Line that runs from Central London. I thought that it would be on TfL website but it's not. If it goes ahead, that'll be excellent. I hope the night service continues all the way to Uxbridge, my fear is it'll only go as far as Rayners Lane. That’s my fear. Rayners Lane or Ruislip if we’re lucky.
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Post by Green Kitten on Oct 2, 2019 19:57:42 GMT
aparently my colleague has had a TfL consultation posted through his letter box regarding a night service for the Uxbridge branch for the Piccadilly Line that runs from Central London. I thought that it would be on TfL website but it's not. Not heard anything of the sort. This will not happen any time soon with the aging 1973 stock still running anyway - the last thing the Piccadilly line needs right now is a more strained and overworked fleet. I think there may be a possibility of the Uxbridge branch being served by night tube, but on the Metropolitan line - and if that were to happen that won’t be until the 4LM project is fully complete. You are very easily misled by rumors. Way too much. aparently my colleague has had a TfL consultation posted through his letter box regarding a night service for the Uxbridge branch for the Piccadilly Line that runs from Central London. I thought that it would be on TfL website but it's not. If it goes ahead, that'll be excellent. I hope the night service continues all the way to Uxbridge, my fear is it'll only go as far as Rayners Lane. I think if the Pic night tube extends up towards the Rayners branch it's very likely the service will terminate at Rayners Lane to be quite honest. Perhaps there is scope for a 3tph service on that branch. It won't be too much of a hassle to timetable the Pic to terminate at Rayners, with those passengers connecting with a Met a few minutes behind which continues to Uxbridge. I also feel it'll likely be an Acton Town to Rayners Lane shuttle - so as not to increase the frequency through the central area - but hard to predict something that won't come until at least 5 years time.
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Post by COBO on Oct 2, 2019 20:25:15 GMT
aparently my colleague has had a TfL consultation posted through his letter box regarding a night service for the Uxbridge branch for the Piccadilly Line that runs from Central London. I thought that it would be on TfL website but it's not. Not heard anything of the sort. This will not happen any time soon with the aging 1973 stock still running anyway - the last thing the Piccadilly line needs right now is a more strained and overworked fleet. I think there may be a possibility of the Uxbridge branch being served by night tube, but on the Metropolitan line - and if that were to happen that won’t be until the 4LM project is fully complete. You are very easily misled by rumors. Way too much. If it goes ahead, that'll be excellent. I hope the night service continues all the way to Uxbridge, my fear is it'll only go as far as Rayners Lane. I think if the Pic night tube extends up towards the Rayners branch it's very likely the service will terminate at Rayners Lane to be quite honest. Perhaps there is scope for a 3tph service on that branch. It won't be too much of a hassle to timetable the Pic to terminate at Rayners, with those passengers connecting with a Met a few minutes behind which continues to Uxbridge. I also feel it'll likely be an Acton Town to Rayners Lane shuttle - so as not to increase the frequency through the central area - but hard to predict something that won't come until at least 5 years time. Sorry please forgive me I was meant to say my colleague got a TfL consultation about night bus route that will provide a night service for the Uxbridge branch for Piccadilly Line you know how the N91 and N97 provides a night service for the rest of the Piccadilly Line and the N5 and N20 provides the Northern Line. He said that the night bus service will run from Central London to maybe Rayners Lane via Alperton, Whitton Avenue East and Sudbury Hill. So again a night bus service not the actual Piccadilly Line will be gaining a night service. Again Sorry I should’ve been clearer.
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Post by Green Kitten on Oct 2, 2019 21:46:09 GMT
Not heard anything of the sort. This will not happen any time soon with the aging 1973 stock still running anyway - the last thing the Piccadilly line needs right now is a more strained and overworked fleet. I think there may be a possibility of the Uxbridge branch being served by night tube, but on the Metropolitan line - and if that were to happen that won’t be until the 4LM project is fully complete. You are very easily misled by rumors. Way too much. I think if the Pic night tube extends up towards the Rayners branch it's very likely the service will terminate at Rayners Lane to be quite honest. Perhaps there is scope for a 3tph service on that branch. It won't be too much of a hassle to timetable the Pic to terminate at Rayners, with those passengers connecting with a Met a few minutes behind which continues to Uxbridge. I also feel it'll likely be an Acton Town to Rayners Lane shuttle - so as not to increase the frequency through the central area - but hard to predict something that won't come until at least 5 years time. Sorry please forgive me I was meant to say my colleague got a TfL consultation about night bus route that will provide a night service for the Uxbridge branch for Piccadilly Line you know how the N91 and N97 provides a night service for the rest of the Piccadilly Line and the N5 and N20 provides the Northern Line. He said that the night bus service will run from Central London to maybe Rayners Lane via Alperton, Whitton Avenue East and Sudbury Hill. So again a night bus service not the actual Piccadilly Line will be gaining a night service. Again Sorry I should’ve been clearer. Ah I see - makes more sense now That would be a great idea - that part of London is so poorly served by night buses! Literally every station except Ealing Common, Sudbury Town and Uxbridge on that branch has no night bus service from central London and some stations don’t have a night bus at all. Hmm, an N487 of sorts? 🤔🤔 Sorry for the frustrated tone in my above post.
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Post by kmkcheng on Oct 2, 2019 21:50:09 GMT
Sorry forgive I was meant to say my colleague got a TfL consultation about night bus route that will provide a night service for the Uxbridge branch for Piccadilly Line you know how the N91 and N97 provides a night service for the rest of the Piccadilly Line and the N5 and N20 provides the Northern Line. He said that the night bus service will run from Central London to maybe Rayners Lane via Alperton, Whitton Avenue East and Sudbury Hill. So again a night bus service not the actual Piccadilly Line will be gaining a night service. Again Sorry I should’ve been clearer. I suppose they could extend the N97. It’s already a short Piccadilly line night service so it could be extended, maybe following the N11 from Hammersmith upto to Acton High St, then Uxbridge Road, Eailing Common, Hanger Lane, Alperton, Whitton Ave East, Sudbury Hill, South Harrow, via 398 routing to Eastcote, Elm Ave, Pembroke Road, Ruislip, via U1 to Swakeleys Road, Long Lane, Hillingdon then U2 to Uxbridge. However, this would omit Acton Town station as there’s no right turn from Gunnersbury Lane onto the NCR unless they want to make changes to this junction just for a night route. If they wanted to serve Acton Town station, instead of following the N11 upto Acton, maybe follow the 267 to Chiswick roundabout then up the NCR and then right turn to Gunnersbury Lane. This would also require a small double run in Acton due to no left turn from Gunnersbury Lane onto Uxbridge Road so would need to turn around at the roundabout by Morrisons. This double run would also be required in the opposite direction.
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Post by COBO on Oct 2, 2019 22:48:10 GMT
Sorry please forgive me I was meant to say my colleague got a TfL consultation about night bus route that will provide a night service for the Uxbridge branch for Piccadilly Line you know how the N91 and N97 provides a night service for the rest of the Piccadilly Line and the N5 and N20 provides the Northern Line. He said that the night bus service will run from Central London to maybe Rayners Lane via Alperton, Whitton Avenue East and Sudbury Hill. So again a night bus service not the actual Piccadilly Line will be gaining a night service. Again Sorry I should’ve been clearer. Ah I see - makes more sense now That would be a great idea - that part of London is so poorly served by night buses! Literally every station except Ealing Common, Sudbury Town and Uxbridge on that branch has no night bus service from central London and some stations don’t have a night bus at all. Hmm, an N487 of sorts? 🤔🤔 Sorry for the frustrated tone in my above post. No problem.
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