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Post by Deleted on Mar 28, 2018 10:23:01 GMT
GWR to manage Heathrow Express service www.railwaygazette.com/news/single-view/view/gwr-to-manage-heathrow-express-service.html "UK: The Heathrow Express premium airport service between London Paddington and Heathrow Aiport is to contiune running until at least 2028 under a new agreement announced on March 28. The non-franchised service is currently operated in-house by Heathrow Airport, which will continue to own the service and be responsible for managing the stations at the airport. Under the new agreement approved by Department for Transport, FirstGroup’s Great Western Railway, which holds the Great Western franchise, is to operate the service under a management contract running from August 2018 until 2028; it expected that the arrangement would transfer to any future holder of the Great Western franchise. GWR will operate Heathrow Express services using its Bombardier Transportation Class 387 Electrostar EMUs. A dedicated pool of 12 of the EMUs will be modified by December 2019 to provide first class accommodation, high speed wi-fi, additional luggage racks and on-board entertainment. The agreement means there is no need to build a new depot to replace the current facility at Old Oak Common which Heathrow Express must vacate by the end of 2019 as part of the High Speed 2 project. New ticket readers will also be provided at Heathrow and Paddington to enable users of Heathrow Express and TfL’s future Elizabeth Line service to the airport to use pay-as-you-go Oyster or contactless ticketing. FirstGroup Chief Executive Tim O’Toole said the agreement ‘demonstrates the transport industry working in partnership for the benefit of passengers, allowing fast and convenient connections to continue on this crucial airport link.’ Heathrow Chief Executive John Holland-Kay said the agreement would secure ‘convenient and reliable public transport journeys to Heathrow in this decade and beyond’"
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Post by snowman on Mar 28, 2018 10:26:06 GMT
Copying from GWR thread It appears that First Group have been awarded a management contract to operate Heathrow Express for 10 years from August 2018 Initially will use existing HEx fleet, but will modify 12 of the class 387 to operate a dedicated service by December 2019 No idea what happens to current fleet No idea why First Great Western have 12 surplus trains that they can modify and use Heathrow Express needs to change depot anyway as Crossrail is taking over current site www.firstgroupplc.com/news-and-media/latest-news/2018/28-03-18a.aspx
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Post by snoggle on Mar 28, 2018 11:30:59 GMT
Copying from GWR thread It appears that First Group have been awarded a management contract to operate Heathrow Express for 10 years from August 2018 Initially will use existing HEx fleet, but will modify 12 of the class 487 to operate a dedicated service by December 2019 No idea what happens to current fleet No idea why First Great Western have 12 surplus trains that they can modify and use Heathrow Express needs to change depot anyway as Crossrail is taking over current site www.firstgroupplc.com/news-and-media/latest-news/2018/28-03-18a.aspxApologies for pedantry but it's class 387s. I imagine that HEX will sell their existing stock if they own them. Otherwise they return to a ROSCO. I can see Northern being interested in them given they have a similar, but lower spec, fleet on electric services out of Leeds. Being able to lengthen those trains, subject to platform lengths, will help with peak overcrowding. GWR have surplus stock courtesy of Crossrail taking over more services than originally expected towards Reading. Also DfT sanctioned a much larger than expected EMU order for GWR as it allowed them to take on some of the speculative class 387 build. For the DfT and Network Rail this simplifies operation out of Paddington by effectively taking HEX, as an independent operator, out of the picture. They will only have 2 operators to deal with - MTR Crossrail and GWR which is probably a significant factor given the challenges of running Crossrail alongside an increased GWR main line express service. With the benefit of hindsight this looks like a carefully crafted set of changes to try to rationalise matters at Paddington while creating some sort of "upside" for passengers. - TfL and DfT were "together" in opposing HAL's ludicrous access charges for Crossrail services. HAL lost their case and appeal. - HAL are probably anxious about the risk to HEX after Crossrail launches - TfL, for political reasons, wanted access to T5 for Crossrail - DfT and GWR probably wanted shot of some of the suburban workings to ease fleet management / operational issues. TfL took on extra Reading and Airport services at the cost of 5 extra trains but with a greater share of the revenue. - Under the management contract this allows HEX to run til 2028 but removes a load of operating and asset cost for HAL by "sub contracting" to GWR. The real surprise is DfT seemingly being willing to carry over the management contract to the next franchise. I assume this is part of a wider "Heathrow expansion" deal of some sort. - Passengers retain a choice of service into Heathrow from Paddington and gain Oyster / Contactless ticketing. - HAL can dump their own trains and avoid needing a new depot to replace their Old Oak Common depot. That eases matters for HS2. GWR keep part of their class 387 fleet operational that might otherwise have been "pensioned off". I suspect there are some big commercial issues sitting behind all this that we'll never know about.
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brutxi
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Post by brutxi on Mar 28, 2018 15:38:05 GMT
Copying from GWR thread It appears that First Group have been awarded a management contract to operate Heathrow Express for 10 years from August 2018 Initially will use existing HEx fleet, but will modify 12 of the class 387 to operate a dedicated service by December 2019 No idea what happens to current fleet No idea why First Great Western have 12 surplus trains that they can modify and use Heathrow Express needs to change depot anyway as Crossrail is taking over current site www.firstgroupplc.com/news-and-media/latest-news/2018/28-03-18a.aspxAs someone who uses the service quite regularly the 15-20 min journey to the airport is worth the extra expense and convenience if you are in a rush which is more often than not. I do hope this change will also bring upon cheaper fares. I cannot see the 387's interior being modified to the extent of the 332's. I find the seats one of the most comfortable on the network.
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Post by ADH45258 on Mar 28, 2018 15:48:19 GMT
Will the Heathrow Express brand be retained (and thus applied to the 387s), or will First operate the service as GWR?
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Post by routew15 on Mar 28, 2018 16:47:07 GMT
This sounds like good news. As all GW services are meant to move the fast line (during the peaks I believe) hopefully this should allow all the HEX trains to follow suit especially with the planned fleet change. Hopefully this will mean the Relief lines can solely be served by the E Line.
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Post by metrobusfan on Mar 28, 2018 18:32:29 GMT
What about Heathrow connect
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Post by snoggle on Mar 28, 2018 19:07:31 GMT
What about Heathrow connect This becomes TfL Rail in May 2018 when TfL take over. It then becomes Crossrail (or that other name) in 2019.
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Post by snoggle on Mar 28, 2018 19:10:54 GMT
Will the Heathrow Express brand be retained (and thus applied to the 387s), or will First operate the service as GWR? I expect it will retain the brand. It is far too well established to be dropped. After all GWR run Heathrow Connect at present but it's not branded as GWR at all. All Heathrow Airport are doing is sub contracting the operation of the rail service. They retain the money and operation of their stations at Heathrow. They also retain ownership of the tunnel into Heathrow. I would expect the 387s to be suitably rebranded and refitted for use from 2019.
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Post by ADH45258 on Mar 28, 2018 21:20:05 GMT
The 387s may be available due to electrification progress, e.g. London to Oxford services being replaced by Didcot services.
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Post by joefrombow on Mar 29, 2018 3:33:56 GMT
Had they waited a year until 2020 all the Existing class 379 Stansted Express trains already in an Airport layout which are as far as I know near on the same thing would be free as GA have ordered New trains to replace everything they currently run , Come 2020 there's going to be alot of surplus EMU's and still not enough DMU's with the Pacers being withdrawn and the Wales and West Country Electrification put on hold .
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Post by MetrolineGA1511 on Apr 1, 2018 10:55:35 GMT
Will the Heathrow Express brand be retained (and thus applied to the 387s), or will First operate the service as GWR? I expect it will retain the brand. It is far too well established to be dropped. After all GWR run Heathrow Connect at present but it's not branded as GWR at all. All Heathrow Airport are doing is sub contracting the operation of the rail service. They retain the money and operation of their stations at Heathrow. They also retain ownership of the tunnel into Heathrow. I would expect the 387s to be suitably rebranded and refitted for use from 2019. Potentially the Heathrow Express brand will be part of the Great Western operation just as Gatwick Express is part of the TSGN operation.
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Post by snoggle on Apr 1, 2018 11:05:41 GMT
I expect it will retain the brand. It is far too well established to be dropped. After all GWR run Heathrow Connect at present but it's not branded as GWR at all. All Heathrow Airport are doing is sub contracting the operation of the rail service. They retain the money and operation of their stations at Heathrow. They also retain ownership of the tunnel into Heathrow. I would expect the 387s to be suitably rebranded and refitted for use from 2019. Potentially the Heathrow Express brand will be part of the Great Western operation just as Gatwick Express is part of the TSGN operation. No potential about it. GWR will be running the service. HAL will be marketing the service, setting fares and keeping the revenue and managing the Heathrow stations. It is different to GatEx as that is an integral part of the GTR franchise specced by the DfT. The HEX operation is a sub contract not something specced by the DfT so there is a fundamental difference.
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Post by ADH45258 on Apr 3, 2018 18:36:32 GMT
Why can't the Class 332s be transferred with the services to GWR? This would save acquiring additional stock, shuffling of fleet between services, intensive refurbishment of brand new trains, and making the relatively new 332s redundant. One reason suggested is a lack of depot space at Reading, however the same number of trains will be needed in total, so shouldn't make a difference.
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Post by snoggle on Apr 3, 2018 21:23:15 GMT
Why can't the Class 332s be transferred with the services to GWR? This would save acquiring additional stock, shuffling of fleet between services, intensive refurbishment of brand new trains, and making the relatively new 332s redundant. One reason suggested is a lack of depot space at Reading, however the same number of trains will be needed in total, so shouldn't make a difference. Err no extra trains are needed for GWR. 387s are not intensively used now and some will become surplus when Crossrail runs through to Reading in Dec 2019. These spare trains will run the HEX service. I imagine HAL want rid of the trains and the depot at OOC as it's part of a cost reduction exercise for them now that HEX will face more intensive competition from Crossrail. I would expect HAL are paying for the changes to the 387 anyway so it's not a cost to the public sector. If GWR were to take on the 332s there would be a shortage of space as they'd be additional to the full fleet of underused 387s. This way Reading depot is not overstretched, is not required to maintain an unfamiliar type of train and HEX lower their cost base and get a 5 year extension to their running rights into Paddington. As I have said above I think this is all part of a wider plan about increasing rail access into Heathrow from directions other than the east. We just don't know what is involved just yet. I've read elsewhere that Heathrow are reluctant to give up HEX as it still provides a small but important contribution to their target for public transport access to the airport. More rail access for the future is even more important if Heathrow is to expand and achieve air quality targets.
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