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Post by route53 on Jun 23, 2019 13:59:33 GMT
How long has the X68 been running?
I would love for there to be a network of express routes in London (similar to the Green Line) But this could be the RedLine, radical express routes along the 18, 25, 43, 53, 91, 109 routes, the 68 & 207 already have this in the form of the X68 & 607
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Post by John tuthill on Jun 23, 2019 14:28:47 GMT
How long has the X68 been running? I would love for there to be a network of express routes in London (similar to the Green Line) But this could be the RedLine, radical express routes along the 18, 25, 43, 53, 91, 109 routes, the 68 & 207 already have this in the form of the X68 & 607 27.10.86 According to Ian Armstrongs bus route page
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Post by vjaska on Jun 23, 2019 14:43:11 GMT
How long has the X68 been running? I would love for there to be a network of express routes in London (similar to the Green Line) But this could be the RedLine, radical express routes along the 18, 25, 43, 53, 91, 109 routes, the 68 & 207 already have this in the form of the X68 & 607 You would have to get rid of the traffic on the A23 first for any sort of express route along the 109's route to work. The X68 only survives because it's corridor isn't as traffic intensive (even then, the express section runs via Brixton to slightly speed up journey times) and the fact that the connections it's offers can't be done by rail.
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Post by southlondonbus on Jun 23, 2019 15:44:21 GMT
I didn't realise the X68 was that old. I assumed it had started when the 68 was split in 1994 to maintain links atleast in the peaks in one direction only. So for a time there was the 68 and X68 in the peaks from Central London to Croydon.
I'm guessing as it would break the option of running fast via Brixton if a limited stop service could be introduced between West Norwood and Waterloo stopping just at Tulse Hill, Herne Hill, Kings, Camberwell Green and Elephant to relieve the 68/468 in the Peaks.
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Post by LVF_Admin on Jun 23, 2019 19:48:08 GMT
Strange that it started at Plumstead Common, rather than Plumstead itself, I’m assuming the 53X ran down Griffin Road to Plumstead then took the direct route to Woolwich from there via the A206. I would say the the 53X achieved its objective more effectively than the 607 which is semi fast at best, the 53X appears not have called at Charlton, West Greenwich and Deptford and only one stop on the OKR The 53X seems more similar to the X68 and the X26 The 53X was in effect the standard 53 with stops missed out. At that point the main 53 started at Plumstead Common and only garage journeys served Griffin Road. There was a stop in Charlton (at the top of Victoria Way). Here's a list of the stops on the 53X: Plumstead Common, Warwick Terrace Plumstead Common, The Ship Plumstead, Bloomfield Road/Plumstead Common Road Woolwich, Plumstead Road/Burrage Road Woolwich, Beresford Square Charlton, Charlton Road/Victoria Way Blackheath, Royal Standard New Cross Station New Cross Garage Elephant & Castle, Cinemas Elephant & Castle, St George's Road Westminster, Parliament Street Trafalgar Square, Whitehall Trafalgar Square, Canada House all stops to Oxford Circus The 177 Express was much more effective as there was flexibility in the actual route it ran with several variances depending on traffic and drivers. I those days as long as the key stops were served all was good. Plus the ex West Mids Coach Seated Titans and ECW Coach Seated Olympians were very comfortable.
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Post by rif153 on Jun 23, 2019 19:58:50 GMT
I didn't realise the X68 was that old. I assumed it had started when the 68 was split in 1994 to maintain links atleast in the peaks in one direction only. So for a time there was the 68 and X68 in the peaks from Central London to Croydon. I'm guessing as it would break the option of running fast via Brixton if a limited stop service could be introduced between West Norwood and Waterloo stopping just at Tulse Hill, Herne Hill, Kings, Camberwell Green and Elephant to relieve the 68/468 in the Peaks. There have been attempts to get a stop at Brixton introduced on the X68 althought TfL always respond with the loss of flexbility to run via Camberwell or Brixton if this were to be introduced. Are the 68/468 struggling in the peaks since the 468's PVR cut?
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Post by LVF_Admin on Jun 23, 2019 20:03:12 GMT
Looking at that timetable, Blackheath to Westminster in about half an hour! I wonder if that was achieved? Frequently achieved, remember there weren't so many traffic management plans when the route ran and the roads flowed better.
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Post by route53 on Jun 23, 2019 22:04:03 GMT
The 53X was in effect the standard 53 with stops missed out. At that point the main 53 started at Plumstead Common and only garage journeys served Griffin Road. There was a stop in Charlton (at the top of Victoria Way). Here's a list of the stops on the 53X: Plumstead Common, Warwick Terrace Plumstead Common, The Ship Plumstead, Bloomfield Road/Plumstead Common Road Woolwich, Plumstead Road/Burrage Road Woolwich, Beresford Square Charlton, Charlton Road/Victoria Way Blackheath, Royal Standard New Cross Station New Cross Garage Elephant & Castle, Cinemas Elephant & Castle, St George's Road Westminster, Parliament Street Trafalgar Square, Whitehall Trafalgar Square, Canada House all stops to Oxford Circus The 177 Express was much more effective as there was flexibility in the actual route it ran with several variances depending on traffic and drivers. I those days as long as the key stops were served all was good. Plus the ex West Mids Coach Seated Titans and ECW Coach Seated Olympians were very comfortable. I would imagine so, also the 177X was faster than both express 53’s
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Post by route53 on Jun 23, 2019 22:15:07 GMT
If you could and if it were brought back How would you operate the 53X or X53 today?
For me it would run from Plumstead Station, then A206 to Woolwich Arsenal Stn, Charlton Village, Blackheath Royal Standard, Greenwich Park, New Cross Gate, non stop to County Hall then all stops to Trafalgar Square, and will not call at Plumstead Common, Blackheath Hill/West Greenwich, Deptford, OKR & E&C
No bus lane for it as it could be held up at bus stops, run in peaks, not sure it’d be justifiable for it to run off peak, as great it would be for SE London to have an express bus.
I wasn’t sure about starting it at Thamesmead, the powers that be may cite CrossRail at Abbey Wood.
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Post by route53 on Jun 23, 2019 22:21:50 GMT
I didn't realise the X68 was that old. I assumed it had started when the 68 was split in 1994 to maintain links atleast in the peaks in one direction only. So for a time there was the 68 and X68 in the peaks from Central London to Croydon. I'm guessing as it would break the option of running fast via Brixton if a limited stop service could be introduced between West Norwood and Waterloo stopping just at Tulse Hill, Herne Hill, Kings, Camberwell Green and Elephant to relieve the 68/468 in the Peaks. There have been attempts to get a stop at Brixton introduced on the X68 althought TfL always respond with the loss of flexbility to run via Camberwell or Brixton if this were to be introduced. Are the 68/468 struggling in the peaks since the 468's PVR cut?
About three years ago I lived in Herne Hill, and I used to see AM Peak X68’s passing through the A215 road, never in the PM Oeaks however, which is strange since the A215 never actually seemed that busy even in the peaks, Herne Hill was a bit of a pinch. Should the X68 stop at Brixton? It’s a major transport interchange for those commuting to and from the southern end of the route, or is it not worth it?
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Post by busaholic on Jun 23, 2019 22:22:27 GMT
The 177 Express was much more effective as there was flexibility in the actual route it ran with several variances depending on traffic and drivers. I those days as long as the key stops were served all was good. Plus the ex West Mids Coach Seated Titans and ECW Coach Seated Olympians were very comfortable. I would imagine so, also the 177X was faster than both express 53’s Living in Blackheath for most of the time the 177X ran I regularly saw them in the p.m. peak travelling over the 53's route. By the way, I only remember it with an X suffix, but I've seen photos of buses displaying 177E, a suffix I can only previously remember on a tiny number of LT country routes in the pre 1970 period. Was it ever officially 177E?
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Post by vjaska on Jun 23, 2019 22:26:48 GMT
There have been attempts to get a stop at Brixton introduced on the X68 althought TfL always respond with the loss of flexbility to run via Camberwell or Brixton if this were to be introduced. Are the 68/468 struggling in the peaks since the 468's PVR cut?
About three years ago I lived in Herne Hill, and I used to see AM Peak X68’s passing through the A215 road, never in the PM Oeaks however, which is strange since the A215 never actually seemed that busy even in the peaks, Herne Hill was a bit of a pinch. Should the X68 stop at Brixton? It’s a major transport interchange for those commuting to and from the southern end of the route, or is it not worth it? Depends on how much time it would take as well as the argument that if you add one stop in, then others would want other stops included. Also, unlike most of the X68's stopping section, Brixton already has good links with Central London even if the cuts have eroded one or two by bus. The vast majority of X68's have run via Tulse Hill into Brixton for many years now though on the odd occasion, I've seen one or two run via Dulwich Road which is odd particularly going southbound when Herne Hill snarls up.
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Post by busaholic on Jun 23, 2019 22:28:13 GMT
There have been attempts to get a stop at Brixton introduced on the X68 althought TfL always respond with the loss of flexbility to run via Camberwell or Brixton if this were to be introduced. Are the 68/468 struggling in the peaks since the 468's PVR cut?
About three years ago I lived in Herne Hill, and I used to see AM Peak X68’s passing through the A215 road, never in the PM Oeaks however, which is strange since the A215 never actually seemed that busy even in the peaks, Herne Hill was a bit of a pinch. Should the X68 stop at Brixton? It’s a major transport interchange for those commuting to and from the southern end of the route, or is it not worth it? The urge to stop at Brixton should be resisted imo, on principle, the principle being to retain operational flexibility at all costs. Does the route ever run via Railton Road and if not, why not? (I mean if running via Herne Hill in the first place.)
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Post by route53 on Jun 23, 2019 23:02:58 GMT
I would imagine so, also the 177X was faster than both express 53’s Living in Blackheath for most of the time the 177X ran I regularly saw them in the p.m. peak travelling over the 53's route. By the way, I only remember it with an X suffix, but I've seen photos of buses displaying 177E, a suffix I can only previously remember on a tiny number of LT country routes in the pre 1970 period. Was it ever officially 177E? I too have seen photos of the 177E, but I think it eventually became the 177X, the “E” would imply that there was a 177A/B/C etc suffixes, X is easily identifiable as it being an Express route.
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Post by Mokujin on Jun 23, 2019 23:21:49 GMT
If you could and if it were brought back How would you operate the 53X or X53 today? For me it would run from Plumstead Station, then A206 to Woolwich Arsenal Stn, Charlton Village, Blackheath Royal Standard, Greenwich Park, New Cross Gate, non stop to County Hall then all stops to Trafalgar Square, and will not call at Plumstead Common, Blackheath Hill/West Greenwich, Deptford, OKR & E&C No bus lane for it as it could be held up at bus stops, run in peaks, not sure it’d be justifiable for it to run off peak, as great it would be for SE London to have an express bus. I wasn’t sure about starting it at Thamesmead, the powers that be may cite CrossRail at Abbey Wood. Personally I think it should call at Deptford Bridge and Elephant & Castle because of the connections they have. The former has the DLR to places such as Canary Wharf, Bank and Stratford while the latter has a variety of bus links to different places as well as the Tube lines. I’d imagine they would be more beneficial than calling at Charlton Village for example.
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