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Post by LondonNorthern on Apr 27, 2020 18:42:57 GMT
Would new hydrogen buses be ordered for the 245? After the 7 receives its hydrogens, I can see the 245 getting new hydrogens for its next contract if its retained by Metroline When is its next contract starting?
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Post by TB123 on Apr 27, 2020 18:43:48 GMT
After the 7 receives its hydrogens, I can see the 245 getting new hydrogens for its next contract if its retained by Metroline When is its next contract starting? June 2022
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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2020 22:18:04 GMT
After the 7 receives its hydrogens, I can see the 245 getting new hydrogens for its next contract if its retained by Metroline When is its next contract starting? 25th June 2022
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Post by TB123 on Apr 28, 2020 8:43:26 GMT
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Post by southlondonbus on Apr 28, 2020 16:10:11 GMT
Until they go into to service on the 7 we have no ideas at all about how a hydrogen DD could work in London. I'm guessing Bamford are not working at the moment but I think it's so important to get them on the 7 ASAP if the company really want to be serious about it as a future product.
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Post by southlondonbus on Apr 28, 2020 16:12:12 GMT
Until they go into to service on the 7 we have no ideas at all about how a hydrogen DD could work in London. I'm guessing Bamford are not working at the moment but I think it's so important to get them on the 7 ASAP if the company really want to be serious about it as a future product. Whilst the 43 was a fairly slow but steady introduction, the 94 has proved how easily electric DDs can go into service. Right now electric is winning the Betamax v video war in the zero emission market.
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Post by snowman on Jun 19, 2020 6:53:45 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2020 6:57:52 GMT
I wonder how widespread this source of energy will ever be.
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Jun 19, 2020 10:25:33 GMT
I wonder how widespread this source of energy will ever be. The biggest benefit Hydrogen buses have over electrics is obviously the refilling factor, they can be refilled in a matter of minutes like petrol as opposed to the 2 hours electric buses require to charge. Another benefit is that the range of the bus is unlikely to be affected over time as a tank won't change the amount of Hydrogen it can hold over the years while an electric battery does degrade. However then there are many other issues. Hydrogen as a fuel is obviously in gas form as opposed to the liquid form of diesel and as a result is a lot less space efficient. However judging by the trial on the RV1 this issue in itself doesn't seem to be resulting in range issues however I do believe they needed some extra Hydrogen tanks fitted at one point. Then you do have the obvious security issue Hydrogen possesses, one small hole in the tank can result in the whole nearby area needing to be evacuated until the gas disperses and obviously the gas is extremely explosive - among the most reactive gases you can actually get out there. One simple spark can be deadly - thankfully it's not happened in all the years that we've had Hydrogen on London's streets but the scale of danger that lies there is not one to overlook. An unfortunate reality is that London is still susceptible to terrorist attacks and should someone pull one off on a Hydrogen bus it would be a lot more deadly than it should have ever been. The other issue is the source of Hydrogen. The reality is 95% of Hydrogen used is still coming from fossil fuels, yes it can be obtained renewably but it is not there yet - or even close. Over half the electricity were use on the other hand now comes from renewable resources. The most obvious way of getting Hydrogen renewably is electrolysis but that requires a heap of electricity, and even more water. The water also needs to be of a good quality as otherwise you could end up extracting something else instead. The amount of electricity that will need pumping in will need to result in a net gain of range on a bus i.e the Hydrogen produced through electrolysis can give a bus more range than if the electricity used in the process did. If it doesn't then there's no point even extracting it as you might as well just pump the electricity into an electric bus and skip a whole process.
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Post by SILENCED on Jun 19, 2020 10:46:07 GMT
I wonder how widespread this source of energy will ever be. The biggest benefit Hydrogen buses have over electrics is obviously the refilling factor, they can be refilled in a matter of minutes like petrol as opposed to the 2 hours electric buses require to charge. Another benefit is that the range of the bus is unlikely to be affected over time as a tank won't change the amount of Hydrogen it can hold over the years while an electric battery does degrade. However then there are many other issues. Hydrogen as a fuel is obviously in gas form as opposed to the liquid form of diesel and as a result is a lot less space efficient. However judging by the trial on the RV1 this issue in itself doesn't seem to be resulting in range issues however I do believe they needed some extra Hydrogen tanks fitted at one point. Then you do have the obvious security issue Hydrogen possesses, one small hole in the tank can result in the whole nearby area needing to be evacuated until the gas disperses and obviously the gas is extremely explosive - among the most reactive gases you can actually get out there. One simple spark can be deadly - thankfully it's not happened in all the years that we've had Hydrogen on London's streets but the scale of danger that lies there is not one to overlook. An unfortunate reality is that London is still susceptible to terrorist attacks and should someone pull one off on a Hydrogen bus it would be a lot more deadly than it should have ever been. The other issue is the source of Hydrogen. The reality is 95% of Hydrogen used is still coming from fossil fuels, yes it can be obtained renewably but it is not there yet - or even close. Over half the electricity were use on the other hand now comes from renewable resources. The most obvious way of getting Hydrogen renewably is electrolysis but that requires a heap of electricity, and even more water. The water also needs to be of a good quality as otherwise you could end up extracting something else instead. The amount of electricity that will need pumping in will need to result in a net gain of range on a bus i.e the Hydrogen produced through electrolysis can give a bus more range than if the electricity used in the process did. If it doesn't then there's no point even extracting it as you might as well just pump the electricity into an electric bus and skip a whole process. Not sure the quality of water statement is correct as pure water is a bad conductor of electricity, it need impurities to conduct the electricity which is why sea water is commonly used.
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Jun 19, 2020 10:52:46 GMT
The biggest benefit Hydrogen buses have over electrics is obviously the refilling factor, they can be refilled in a matter of minutes like petrol as opposed to the 2 hours electric buses require to charge. Another benefit is that the range of the bus is unlikely to be affected over time as a tank won't change the amount of Hydrogen it can hold over the years while an electric battery does degrade. However then there are many other issues. Hydrogen as a fuel is obviously in gas form as opposed to the liquid form of diesel and as a result is a lot less space efficient. However judging by the trial on the RV1 this issue in itself doesn't seem to be resulting in range issues however I do believe they needed some extra Hydrogen tanks fitted at one point. Then you do have the obvious security issue Hydrogen possesses, one small hole in the tank can result in the whole nearby area needing to be evacuated until the gas disperses and obviously the gas is extremely explosive - among the most reactive gases you can actually get out there. One simple spark can be deadly - thankfully it's not happened in all the years that we've had Hydrogen on London's streets but the scale of danger that lies there is not one to overlook. An unfortunate reality is that London is still susceptible to terrorist attacks and should someone pull one off on a Hydrogen bus it would be a lot more deadly than it should have ever been. The other issue is the source of Hydrogen. The reality is 95% of Hydrogen used is still coming from fossil fuels, yes it can be obtained renewably but it is not there yet - or even close. Over half the electricity were use on the other hand now comes from renewable resources. The most obvious way of getting Hydrogen renewably is electrolysis but that requires a heap of electricity, and even more water. The water also needs to be of a good quality as otherwise you could end up extracting something else instead. The amount of electricity that will need pumping in will need to result in a net gain of range on a bus i.e the Hydrogen produced through electrolysis can give a bus more range than if the electricity used in the process did. If it doesn't then there's no point even extracting it as you might as well just pump the electricity into an electric bus and skip a whole process. Not sure the quality of water statement is correct as pure water is a bad conductor of electricity, it need impurities to conduct the electricity which is why sea water is commonly used. Which is why I said the quality of the water is important, not the purity. I'm well aware you need ions in water for it to conduct, I was more referring to chlorine which should it end up being dissolved in the water has been known to end up forming at the positive electrode.
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Post by SILENCED on Jun 19, 2020 11:12:04 GMT
Not sure the quality of water statement is correct as pure water is a bad conductor of electricity, it need impurities to conduct the electricity which is why sea water is commonly used. Which is why I said the quality of the water is important, not the purity. I'm well aware you need ions in water for it to conduct, I was more referring to chlorine which should it end up being dissolved in the water has been known to end up forming at the positive electrode. Chlorine is an element of salt, it is more about conducting the electrolysis out in properly controlled conditions.
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Post by snowman on Jun 30, 2020 20:03:08 GMT
Latest is a press release about supply line for the 20 new Ryse/Wrightbus hydrogen buses for TfL. Hydrogen fuel will be trucked 200 mile from Runcorn to Perivale.
Not sure what the point of having a hydrogen bus is, if you send a diesel truck on a 400 mile round trip to fuel it.
The mayor of London is a genius at irony
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Jun 30, 2020 20:13:34 GMT
Latest is a press release about supply line for the 20 new Ryse/Wrightbus hydrogen buses for TfL. Hydrogen fuel will be trucked 200 mile from Runcorn to Perivale. Not sure what the point of having a hydrogen bus is, if you send a diesel truck on a 400 mile round trip to fuel it. The mayor of London is a genius at irony Yeah not quite sure if this is going to be a good idea if this is their ultimate way of transporting it. Out of interest does anyone know how the Hydrogen was transported to LI for their plant?
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Post by galwhv69 on Jun 30, 2020 22:09:30 GMT
Latest is a press release about supply line for the 20 new Ryse/Wrightbus hydrogen buses for TfL. Hydrogen fuel will be trucked 200 mile from Runcorn to Perivale. Not sure what the point of having a hydrogen bus is, if you send a diesel truck on a 400 mile round trip to fuel it. The mayor of London is a genius at irony Yeah not quite sure if this is going to be a good idea if this is their ultimate way of transporting it. Out of interest does anyone know how the Hydrogen was transported to LI for their plant? From Rotterdam ( ) by truck
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