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Post by enviroPB on Dec 10, 2024 11:26:07 GMT
You can't imagine the garage that houses a problem route had a say in the route being thrown back? My bad, I forgot Arrival Merseyside deals with the 149's maintenance... 🤦 The 149s decision is a financial decision as clearly mentioned in the staff notice. The finance department will be based at Wood Green so why would Tottenham garage's engineers get a say? The notice also said that costs were significantly higher than expected. Everybody knows the LTs aren't the most reliable type. There would be a chat with engineers as to their viability in terms of repairs and parts. If you are in the services sector, it'd be very unwise to not speak to operational managers when making decisions such as this. Engineering managers won't get the final call, but at least they'd get a say. I will not be surprised at all if Arrival wins the 149 back with electrics. They can add onto what's already coming for the 243 and 341, and potentially get a discount thereby making rebidding "extremely competitive" as stated in the announcement. |
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Post by londonbuses on Dec 10, 2024 11:28:21 GMT
The 248's problems are well documented on here so not too surprising. AR must've looked at the new buses coming in and had a good think as to if the 149's current LT allocation is worth the hassle. If Arriva bid for the 248 again I wonder if they'll use different buses as surely they can't scrape another 3 years with buses deteriorating so fast. Any ideas if Arriva have any buses which would be suitable? Also in regards to routes which have been terminated early does anyone know a percentage of retains? I'm sure its high possibly even 100% but I don't have an exact figure off the top of my head. Retained - 23, 49, 55, 56, 65, 71, 117, 148, 160/660, 180, 273, 281, 283, 290, 308, 328, 335, 371, 398, 406/418, 415, 432, 488, H9/H10, K5, U5 Lost - 28, 306, 481, 639/670, 655, 697, C3, E1 (not including Sullivan routes) |
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Dec 10, 2024 11:34:12 GMT
The 149s decision is a financial decision as clearly mentioned in the staff notice. The finance department will be based at Wood Green so why would Tottenham garage's engineers get a say? The notice also said that costs were significantly higher than expected. Everybody knows the LTs aren't the most reliable type. There would be a chat with engineers as to their viability in terms of repairs and parts. If you are in the services sector, it'd be very unwise to not speak to operational managers when making decisions such as this. Engineering managers won't get the final call, but at least they'd get a say. I will not be surprised at all if Arrival wins the 149 back with electrics. They can add onto what's already coming for the 243 and 341, and potentially get a discount thereby making rebidding "extremely competitive" as stated in the announcement. Can't imagine it will go electric as chances are it will only be a 3 year contract, Arriva probably will have the option to bid with a 7 year but then all it will take is Go Ahead to swoop in with existing LTs to win it. I see an Arriva retain with existing LTs as the likely scenario here. |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Dec 10, 2024 12:32:22 GMT
You can't imagine the garage that houses a problem route had a say in the route being thrown back? My bad, I forgot Arrival Merseyside deals with the 149's maintenance... 🤦 The 149s decision is a financial decision as clearly mentioned in the staff notice. The finance department will be based at Wood Green so why would Tottenham garage's engineers get a say? Not Wood Green, but at Finsbury Park. Down to the Area operations directer, Managing director and Engineering director. |
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Post by atb123 on Dec 10, 2024 15:24:58 GMT
The 149s decision is a financial decision as clearly mentioned in the staff notice. The finance department will be based at Wood Green so why would Tottenham garage's engineers get a say? The notice also said that costs were significantly higher than expected. Everybody knows the LTs aren't the most reliable type. There would be a chat with engineers as to their viability in terms of repairs and parts. If you are in the services sector, it'd be very unwise to not speak to operational managers when making decisions such as this. Engineering managers won't get the final call, but at least they'd get a say. I will not be surprised at all if Arrival wins the 149 back with electrics. They can add onto what's already coming for the 243 and 341, and potentially get a discount thereby making rebidding "extremely competitive" as stated in the announcement. I agree with 149 getting electrics (Most likely the electric MCV if with Arriva)but that would leave 259 as the only LT/hybrid route at AR, if you don't include the 318, 123 could also convert to electric too as its contract is nearly over and with the HVs heading to GY. What can be done is the 259 can shift back to EC or to SF if it comes to that stage, NP could alternatively take 149 either using the current LTs with the 67/184D or bid for new electrics(Likely the Electroliner for GAL). |
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Post by southlondonbus on Dec 10, 2024 16:06:35 GMT
The notice also said that costs were significantly higher than expected. Everybody knows the LTs aren't the most reliable type. There would be a chat with engineers as to their viability in terms of repairs and parts. If you are in the services sector, it'd be very unwise to not speak to operational managers when making decisions such as this. Engineering managers won't get the final call, but at least they'd get a say. I will not be surprised at all if Arrival wins the 149 back with electrics. They can add onto what's already coming for the 243 and 341, and potentially get a discount thereby making rebidding "extremely competitive" as stated in the announcement. I agree with 149 getting electrics (Most likely the electric MCV if with Arriva)but that would leave 259 as the only LT/hybrid route at AR, if you don't include the 318, 123 could also convert to electric too as its contract is nearly over and with the HVs heading to GY. What can be done is the 259 can shift back to EC or to SF if it comes to that stage, NP could alternatively take 149 either using the current LTs with the 67/184D or bid for new electrics(Likely the Electroliner for GAL). Why would it get new when all the other LT hand backs haven't. Its mostly going to follow the 55, 148 and 415 with a 3 or 4 year term with existing. |
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Post by matthieu1221 on Dec 10, 2024 17:50:17 GMT
Was this not a few weeks ago. A lot of this is down to traffic conditions and rising costs associated with the LT's like many operators are suffering. Even though TfL own and effectively lease the LT's to operators for £1, they have been plagued with extreme costs and lost mechanical mileage on them TfL are not taking any responsibility or slack on them. Various parts on back order is not helping and it seems as though they have given up in part on the LT's where a few years ago there was a lot of support for them. May just be pure coincidence given I seemed to have paid special attention to the LTs going by on TCR today but it didn't look good across all operators... lots of them stuck in diesel mode... and one on the 73 bellowing out a very unpleasant and very visible smoke! Not to mention the blinds which are a mess across the board too. The end, if someone doesn't foot a proper maintenance bill in the next 6 years, can't come too soon! |
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Post by 365tohaveringpark on Dec 10, 2024 18:50:58 GMT
This doesn't surprise me. I think Arriva is very likely to retain the 149 on a more lucrative 3-year contract, but the 248 is vulnerable. According to capitalomnibus (see above) the increasing unreliability of the LTs as they age, and delays in acquiring spare parts, may be factors here. GY is also apparently experiencing a lack of engineers for the maintenance of their vehicles, which is why their maintenance is rather slow and a lot of their fleet spend a long time off road, we can only hope for more Ts or the HVs to arrive soon to boost the reliability of their routes and vehicles, it also doesn't help that one DW needs to be reserved for the 375 as one of the ENLs are off road and the 347 takes priority over them. However I am not giving them any excuses for LT177 being off road for so long that its MOT has expired. I also do see the 248 being lost or regained as part of some joint bid with some of the other routes in the 935 tranche. On the more positive side of things, at least Arriva had the common sense to terminate the contract, and hopefully the fact that DB have left we should finally see the improvement and investment that DX and GY need! |
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Post by vjaska on Dec 10, 2024 20:38:44 GMT
I agree with 149 getting electrics (Most likely the electric MCV if with Arriva)but that would leave 259 as the only LT/hybrid route at AR, if you don't include the 318, 123 could also convert to electric too as its contract is nearly over and with the HVs heading to GY. What can be done is the 259 can shift back to EC or to SF if it comes to that stage, NP could alternatively take 149 either using the current LTs with the 67/184D or bid for new electrics(Likely the Electroliner for GAL). Why would it get new when all the other LT hand backs haven't. Its mostly going to follow the 55, 148 and 415 with a 3 or 4 year term with existing. Indeed, I don't think any current LT route is losing them yet....sadly! |
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Post by southlondonbus on Dec 10, 2024 20:45:06 GMT
Why would it get new when all the other LT hand backs haven't. Its mostly going to follow the 55, 148 and 415 with a 3 or 4 year term with existing. Indeed, I don't think any current LT route is losing them yet....sadly! I'm still 50/50 on whether the 2026 routes (3/24/27) will be the first or whether they will do a final 3 year term till 2029. |
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Post by RM1_Enthusiast on Dec 11, 2024 9:50:34 GMT
This doesn't surprise me. I think Arriva is very likely to retain the 149 on a more lucrative 3-year contract, but the 248 is vulnerable. According to capitalomnibus (see above) the increasing unreliability of the LTs as they age, and delays in acquiring spare parts, may be factors here. However I am not giving them any excuses for LT177 being off road for so long that its MOT has expired. Does any Arriva workers on here have any update on LT177 whether it will return or get withdrawn? Last time I have seen it was in GY back in June of 2024 sitting there with engine bay open! |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Dec 11, 2024 11:50:47 GMT
However I am not giving them any excuses for LT177 being off road for so long that its MOT has expired. Does any Arriva workers on here have any update on LT177 whether it will return or get withdrawn? Last time I have seen it was in GY back in June of 2024 sitting there with engine bay open! I doubt it would be withdrawn as yet. Not uncommon for vehicles requiring expensive parts or needing a major rebuild to stay out of action for months. |
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Post by DE20106 on Dec 11, 2024 12:28:13 GMT
Does any Arriva workers on here have any update on LT177 whether it will return or get withdrawn? Last time I have seen it was in GY back in June of 2024 sitting there with engine bay open! I doubt it would be withdrawn as yet. Not uncommon for vehicles requiring expensive parts or needing a major rebuild to stay out of action for months. DW445!! |
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Post by vjaska on Dec 11, 2024 12:50:27 GMT
However I am not giving them any excuses for LT177 being off road for so long that its MOT has expired. Does any Arriva workers on here have any update on LT177 whether it will return or get withdrawn? Last time I have seen it was in GY back in June of 2024 sitting there with engine bay open! Hopefully never to return and replaced with a DW or T! |
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Post by mark on Dec 11, 2024 14:17:46 GMT
Indeed, I don't think any current LT route is losing them yet....sadly! I'm still 50/50 on whether the 2026 routes (3/24/27) will be the first or whether they will do a final 3 year term till 2029. I suspect it’ll be another contract with LTs. Although they are becoming increasingly expensive to maintain the leasing costs that the operator pays to TfL are much lower than they would pay for any other type of bus. The LTs will probably have a lingering death with increasing numbers robbed of components to keep others running. Ultimately it could end up like the dying days of London Country’s Routemasters! |
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