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Post by Deleted on Jul 6, 2020 21:01:47 GMT
Barnet bus changes: Demand Responsive Travel is introduced in the areas of Hadley Wood, Hadley Green, Kitts End, Dancers Hill and Ganwick Corner. These vehicles can go to High Barnet, The Spires and Barnet Hospital. Changes as follows: Route 399: Discontinued Route 384: Changes don't go ahead Route 389: Extended from Barnet, The Spires to Edgware via Route 614 to Broadfields Avenue, buses then hail and ride down that section then Route 240 to Edgware Station. Frequency is increased to 3bph. The 389 will continue to end at Western Way though with Massive space in the junction with the Linkway, a Tooting Broadway style stand could be built for the 389 with 20mph zones implemented for the safety of others. Buses towards Edgware will now start at the Infant School and the Linkway stop will be removed. You may wonder why I am choosing for it to go via the A41 and then Broadfields Avenue onto Hale Lane. In doing this, we are still giving the 292 some existence and no frequency changes are needed, the journey times will be quicker and I am advocating for the route to use Broadfields Avenue due to Edgwarebury Lane being fairly traffic ridden as it is. Thoughts? Although having a bus route down Broadfields Avenue (entirely possible imo) is a good idea in principle, not serving Cloister Gardens at least means that 'Mill Hill' (as defined by TfL, not the useful areas like The Broadway) is still very isolated from Barnet and the Hospital/The Spires etc. This was one of the objectives of the original consultation, to improve links from Edgware/Hospital and Mill Hill to Barnet/Hospital. Could you rework something so that the route penetrates Mill Hill further? Also, would the small buses cope on what could be a route that sees high demand? Especially during peak times I think it would be very popular as an alternative to the 107.
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Post by LondonNorthern on Jul 6, 2020 21:30:20 GMT
Barnet bus changes: Demand Responsive Travel is introduced in the areas of Hadley Wood, Hadley Green, Kitts End, Dancers Hill and Ganwick Corner. These vehicles can go to High Barnet, The Spires and Barnet Hospital. Changes as follows: Route 399: Discontinued Route 384: Changes don't go ahead Route 389: Extended from Barnet, The Spires to Edgware via Route 614 to Broadfields Avenue, buses then hail and ride down that section then Route 240 to Edgware Station. Frequency is increased to 3bph. The 389 will continue to end at Western Way though with Massive space in the junction with the Linkway, a Tooting Broadway style stand could be built for the 389 with 20mph zones implemented for the safety of others. Buses towards Edgware will now start at the Infant School and the Linkway stop will be removed. You may wonder why I am choosing for it to go via the A41 and then Broadfields Avenue onto Hale Lane. In doing this, we are still giving the 292 some existence and no frequency changes are needed, the journey times will be quicker and I am advocating for the route to use Broadfields Avenue due to Edgwarebury Lane being fairly traffic ridden as it is. Thoughts? Although having a bus route down Broadfields Avenue (entirely possible imo) is a good idea in principle, not serving Cloister Gardens at least means that 'Mill Hill' (as defined by TfL, not the useful areas like The Broadway) is still very isolated from Barnet and the Hospital/The Spires etc. This was one of the objectives of the original consultation, to improve links from Edgware/Hospital and Mill Hill to Barnet/Hospital. Could you rework something so that the route penetrates Mill Hill further? Also, would the small buses cope on what could be a route that sees high demand? Especially during peak times I think it would be very popular as an alternative to the 107. If demand is seeked then absolutely it can go via the 292 if necessary. If there is not the demand then it can go via the A41 and Broadfields Avenue
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Post by greg on Jul 6, 2020 21:38:49 GMT
59: Extended to Tooting Broadway via the 333 109: Extended from Brixton to Elephant & Castle via the 333 333: Withdrawn N109: renumbered N159
I think this will be amazing for the 59 and 109, but theres no reason to withdraw the 333 anyway. I think it would give the 109 that South London type. Dont know how to explain.
Also, did not know whether the 109/250 to extend to Elephant theyre both quite similar, but I think 109 would be better.
The 250 could also aswell as the N250 without any changes to the 109, N109 and 159.
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Post by vjaska on Jul 6, 2020 22:43:01 GMT
59: Extended to Tooting Broadway via the 333 109: Extended from Brixton to Elephant & Castle via the 333 333: Withdrawn N109: renumbered N159 I think this will be amazing for the 59 and 109, but theres no reason to withdraw the 333 anyway. I think it would give the 109 that South London type. Dont know how to explain. Also, did not know whether the 109/250 to extend to Elephant theyre both quite similar, but I think 109 would be better. The 250 could also aswell as the N250 without any changes to the 109, N109 and 159. As a local, the 109 is not a great candidate to extend at all as it runs into a lot of traffic on the A23, particularly in Streatham & along London Road - a longer version would mess up the route especially when you consider it's in the top three in terms of South London's busiest routes. Not only that but the frequencies of the 109 & 333 do not match at all. The 250 is an even longer route and whilst it avoids part of London Road, it still hits traffic in Streatham and by Broad Green on the part of London Road it serves. Same issue with the 59 - Tooting Broadway is too far a distance for it to run and there isn't a need to withdraw the 333 as you point out.
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Post by greg on Jul 6, 2020 22:45:19 GMT
59: Extended to Tooting Broadway via the 333 109: Extended from Brixton to Elephant & Castle via the 333 333: Withdrawn N109: renumbered N159 I think this will be amazing for the 59 and 109, but theres no reason to withdraw the 333 anyway. I think it would give the 109 that South London type. Dont know how to explain. Also, did not know whether the 109/250 to extend to Elephant theyre both quite similar, but I think 109 would be better. The 250 could also aswell as the N250 without any changes to the 109, N109 and 159. As a local, the 109 is not a great candidate to extend at all as it runs into a lot of traffic on the A23, particularly in Streatham & along London Road - a longer version would mess up the route especially when you consider it's in the top three in terms of South London's busiest routes. Not only that but the frequencies of the 109 & 333 do not match at all. The 250 is an even longer route and whilst it avoids part of London Road, it still hits traffic in Streatham and by Broad Green on the part of London Road it serves. Same issue with the 59 - Tooting Broadway is too far a distance for it to run and there isn't a need to withdraw the 333 as you point out. You are right indeed.
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Post by ADH45258 on Jul 6, 2020 23:08:15 GMT
To rationalise the night network and route contracts, perhaps the standalone night routes could be amended to work alongside a day route - plus some other changes to day routes for new links in Central London.
N168 - Renumbering of the N5. Rerouted between Euston and Trafalgar Square via the 91. Or extended along the 168 towards Old Kent Road.
N390 - Extended from Archway to Barnet via the N20. Route 134 continues links via Camden and Kentish Town. N20 withdrawn.
23 - diverted (day and night) between Knightsbridge and Hammersmith via the 74 towards Earl's Court, continuing along the A4 to Hammersmith via West Kensington Station. Provides a bus service to the area around Barons Court Station, plus new links between South Kensington and Hammersmith. Frequency increase on route 9 if needed. Route N97 withdrawn, replaced by night service on revised route 23. Option to also reroute the N74 to Trafalgar Square via the N97.
N136 - Retendered under the 136's contract. Or renumbered N436 and attached to the 436 contract, if the route is deemed to have more in common with the 436. Alternatively, as the 36N parallels via Vauxhall and Camberwell, the N136 could be rerouted via the 136 to Elephant, then via Lambeth North and Westminster Bridge to line of route - would also be more direct than the current routeing via Victoria.
N135 - Renumbering of route N550. Diverted via Spindrift Avenue. Also rerouted via Liverpool Street (via the 135), then continuing along London Wall and New Change to line of route.
4 - Re-extended to Waterloo, but via Blackfriars Bridge and Stamford Street to provide new links. To stand near County Hall, using the former 341 stand.
115 - Extended from Aldgate to Blackfriars, via the 15 to Mansion House, then along Queen Victoria Street, using the 4's stand space. To relieve the 15 along the section near Tower Hill.
15 - Rerouted between Tower Hill and Limehouse via The Highway, making the route slightly more direct, and providing new links around Shadwell. Extended to Canning Town.
N15 - Renumbering of route N551. Rerouted between Tower Hill and Mansion House direct via the 15.
N5 (or N115) - Renumbering of the existing N15 between Trafalgar Square and Romford.
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Post by vjaska on Jul 7, 2020 0:30:28 GMT
To rationalise the night network and route contracts, perhaps the standalone night routes could be amended to work alongside a day route - plus some other changes to day routes for new links in Central London. N168 - Renumbering of the N5. Rerouted between Euston and Trafalgar Square via the 91. Or extended along the 168 towards Old Kent Road. N390 - Extended from Archway to Barnet via the N20. Route 134 continues links via Camden and Kentish Town. N20 withdrawn. 23 - diverted (day and night) between Knightsbridge and Hammersmith via the 74 towards Earl's Court, continuing along the A4 to Hammersmith via West Kensington Station. Provides a bus service to the area around Barons Court Station, plus new links between South Kensington and Hammersmith. Frequency increase on route 9 if needed. Route N97 withdrawn, replaced by night service on revised route 23. Option to also reroute the N74 to Trafalgar Square via the N97. N136 - Retendered under the 136's contract. Or renumbered N436 and attached to the 436 contract, if the route is deemed to have more in common with the 436. Alternatively, as the 36N parallels via Vauxhall and Camberwell, the N136 could be rerouted via the 136 to Elephant, then via Lambeth North and Westminster Bridge to line of route - would also be more direct than the current routeing via Victoria. N135 - Renumbering of route N550. Diverted via Spindrift Avenue. Also rerouted via Liverpool Street (via the 135), then continuing along London Wall and New Change to line of route. 4 - Re-extended to Waterloo, but via Blackfriars Bridge and Stamford Street to provide new links. To stand near County Hall, using the former 341 stand. 115 - Extended from Aldgate to Blackfriars, via the 15 to Mansion House, then along Queen Victoria Street, using the 4's stand space. To relieve the 15 along the section near Tower Hill. 15 - Rerouted between Tower Hill and Limehouse via The Highway, making the route slightly more direct, and providing new links around Shadwell. Extended to Canning Town. N15 - Renumbering of route N551. Rerouted between Tower Hill and Mansion House direct via the 15. N5 (or N115) - Renumbering of the existing N15 between Trafalgar Square and Romford. Why replace numbers for the sake of it?
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Post by gazza76 on Jul 7, 2020 12:31:19 GMT
Plus the n5 goes to Edgware not Romford
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Post by rif153 on Jul 7, 2020 12:58:35 GMT
To rationalise the night network and route contracts, perhaps the standalone night routes could be amended to work alongside a day route - plus some other changes to day routes for new links in Central London. N168 - Renumbering of the N5. Rerouted between Euston and Trafalgar Square via the 91. Or extended along the 168 towards Old Kent Road. N390 - Extended from Archway to Barnet via the N20. Route 134 continues links via Camden and Kentish Town. N20 withdrawn. 23 - diverted (day and night) between Knightsbridge and Hammersmith via the 74 towards Earl's Court, continuing along the A4 to Hammersmith via West Kensington Station. Provides a bus service to the area around Barons Court Station, plus new links between South Kensington and Hammersmith. Frequency increase on route 9 if needed. Route N97 withdrawn, replaced by night service on revised route 23. Option to also reroute the N74 to Trafalgar Square via the N97. N136 - Retendered under the 136's contract. Or renumbered N436 and attached to the 436 contract, if the route is deemed to have more in common with the 436. Alternatively, as the 36N parallels via Vauxhall and Camberwell, the N136 could be rerouted via the 136 to Elephant, then via Lambeth North and Westminster Bridge to line of route - would also be more direct than the current routeing via Victoria. N135 - Renumbering of route N550. Diverted via Spindrift Avenue. Also rerouted via Liverpool Street (via the 135), then continuing along London Wall and New Change to line of route. 4 - Re-extended to Waterloo, but via Blackfriars Bridge and Stamford Street to provide new links. To stand near County Hall, using the former 341 stand. 115 - Extended from Aldgate to Blackfriars, via the 15 to Mansion House, then along Queen Victoria Street, using the 4's stand space. To relieve the 15 along the section near Tower Hill. 15 - Rerouted between Tower Hill and Limehouse via The Highway, making the route slightly more direct, and providing new links around Shadwell. Extended to Canning Town. N15 - Renumbering of route N551. Rerouted between Tower Hill and Mansion House direct via the 15. N5 (or N115) - Renumbering of the existing N15 between Trafalgar Square and Romford. The 23 and 414 already have a lot in common so rerouting the 23 down to South Kensington would give it even more in common with the 414, I'm dubious about the need for another bus route between Knightsbridge and South Kensington. Also consider that sending the 23 down the A4 may sounds nice on paper and create useful new links but the 23 would really suffer from all the traffic it would face.
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Post by northlondonbuses on Jul 7, 2020 15:51:56 GMT
59: Extended to Tooting Broadway via the 333 109: Extended from Brixton to Elephant & Castle via the 333 333: Withdrawn N109: renumbered N159 I think this will be amazing for the 59 and 109, but theres no reason to withdraw the 333 anyway. I think it would give the 109 that South London type. Dont know how to explain. Also, did not know whether the 109/250 to extend to Elephant theyre both quite similar, but I think 109 would be better. The 250 could also aswell as the N250 without any changes to the 109, N109 and 159. lol good luck to the drivers on the 59 to stay on time
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Post by greg on Jul 7, 2020 15:59:10 GMT
To rationalise the night network and route contracts, perhaps the standalone night routes could be amended to work alongside a day route - plus some other changes to day routes for new links in Central London. N168 - Renumbering of the N5. Rerouted between Euston and Trafalgar Square via the 91. Or extended along the 168 towards Old Kent Road. N390 - Extended from Archway to Barnet via the N20. Route 134 continues links via Camden and Kentish Town. N20 withdrawn. 23 - diverted (day and night) between Knightsbridge and Hammersmith via the 74 towards Earl's Court, continuing along the A4 to Hammersmith via West Kensington Station. Provides a bus service to the area around Barons Court Station, plus new links between South Kensington and Hammersmith. Frequency increase on route 9 if needed. Route N97 withdrawn, replaced by night service on revised route 23. Option to also reroute the N74 to Trafalgar Square via the N97. N136 - Retendered under the 136's contract. Or renumbered N436 and attached to the 436 contract, if the route is deemed to have more in common with the 436. Alternatively, as the 36N parallels via Vauxhall and Camberwell, the N136 could be rerouted via the 136 to Elephant, then via Lambeth North and Westminster Bridge to line of route - would also be more direct than the current routeing via Victoria. N135 - Renumbering of route N550. Diverted via Spindrift Avenue. Also rerouted via Liverpool Street (via the 135), then continuing along London Wall and New Change to line of route. 4 - Re-extended to Waterloo, but via Blackfriars Bridge and Stamford Street to provide new links. To stand near County Hall, using the former 341 stand. 115 - Extended from Aldgate to Blackfriars, via the 15 to Mansion House, then along Queen Victoria Street, using the 4's stand space. To relieve the 15 along the section near Tower Hill. 15 - Rerouted between Tower Hill and Limehouse via The Highway, making the route slightly more direct, and providing new links around Shadwell. Extended to Canning Town. N15 - Renumbering of route N551. Rerouted between Tower Hill and Mansion House direct via the 15. N5 (or N115) - Renumbering of the existing N15 between Trafalgar Square and Romford. I cant speak all, but I agree with the N168 and N390. I don’t think we really need the 73, 390, N5, N20, N73, N253 from Euston to Tottenham Court Road and then the 24, 29, N29 and N279 joining from Warren Street. Personally, i’d withdraw the N253 between Euston and TCR, but your N5 idea makes a lot of sense. It follows the 168 between Hampstead Heath and Euston, and there should be a night service linking the current 168 route, like at Russel Square. The N390, is also a good idea. I always thought a N43 would be better, as the 134/390 is already 24 hour. I think you should just make it an N43 and run via the N20 from Highgate. The 134 serves Highgate-Friern Barnet and js enough for one route during N route time.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2020 17:28:13 GMT
To rationalise the night network and route contracts, perhaps the standalone night routes could be amended to work alongside a day route - plus some other changes to day routes for new links in Central London. N168 - Renumbering of the N5. Rerouted between Euston and Trafalgar Square via the 91. Or extended along the 168 towards Old Kent Road. N390 - Extended from Archway to Barnet via the N20. Route 134 continues links via Camden and Kentish Town. N20 withdrawn. 23 - diverted (day and night) between Knightsbridge and Hammersmith via the 74 towards Earl's Court, continuing along the A4 to Hammersmith via West Kensington Station. Provides a bus service to the area around Barons Court Station, plus new links between South Kensington and Hammersmith. Frequency increase on route 9 if needed. Route N97 withdrawn, replaced by night service on revised route 23. Option to also reroute the N74 to Trafalgar Square via the N97. N136 - Retendered under the 136's contract. Or renumbered N436 and attached to the 436 contract, if the route is deemed to have more in common with the 436. Alternatively, as the 36N parallels via Vauxhall and Camberwell, the N136 could be rerouted via the 136 to Elephant, then via Lambeth North and Westminster Bridge to line of route - would also be more direct than the current routeing via Victoria. N135 - Renumbering of route N550. Diverted via Spindrift Avenue. Also rerouted via Liverpool Street (via the 135), then continuing along London Wall and New Change to line of route. 4 - Re-extended to Waterloo, but via Blackfriars Bridge and Stamford Street to provide new links. To stand near County Hall, using the former 341 stand. 115 - Extended from Aldgate to Blackfriars, via the 15 to Mansion House, then along Queen Victoria Street, using the 4's stand space. To relieve the 15 along the section near Tower Hill. 15 - Rerouted between Tower Hill and Limehouse via The Highway, making the route slightly more direct, and providing new links around Shadwell. Extended to Canning Town. N15 - Renumbering of route N551. Rerouted between Tower Hill and Mansion House direct via the 15. N5 (or N115) - Renumbering of the existing N15 between Trafalgar Square and Romford. If I’m not mistaken that would mean T Sq to Euston via CX Road etc , basically the Northern Line Cx branch unserved by the buses that provide the replacements to the north of the City. The N15 as is proves very popular for early morning workers and remains busy until T Square, I’ve also noticed a fair few passengers then change onto the N9 to access hotels across the West London area, particularly around Kensington and Knightsbridge. So the N115 would need to be the main route, trouble is I’m not sure the rerouting of the trunk 15 along The Highway would work. This road gets very busy with traffic heading across Tower Bridge.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2020 17:38:40 GMT
467 Extended to Esher from Hook via the Hook by Pass past Hinchley Wood Station, Remains hourly with the extra school trips which would also extend to Lower Green. This is probably more of a fantasy wish than realistic, yet would provide a handy link to Esher direct from Hook, Chessington and Ewell. Infrastructure in place for bus stops en route from the by gone days of the 72 , 152 and 189 former bus stops.
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Post by vjaska on Jul 7, 2020 21:21:49 GMT
i don't why N279 follows 29 to TQ from MH, 253 seems more suitable so... 279: Converted to 24hr and extended to either Finsbury Park or Holloway Nags Head at (Night Only) on the bus stops between Manor House and Holloway just like how the 47 used to have one. I also believe this route used to terminate at one of those places. N279: Withdrawn N253: Extended to Trafalgar Square and increased PVR Another thought: 9: Withdrawn ( I believe 10 is more useful than 9, i could be wrong) 10: Restored ( Same reason as 9) N9: Withdrawn bewteen Hyde Park Corner and Aldwych, re-routed to Kings Cross via 10 and re-numbered N10 (Support to Piccadilly from Kings Cross to Heathrow rather than just Piccadilly Circus) Both the 9 & 10 were useful - the 9 still is so no it shouldn't be withdrawn.
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Post by COBO on Jul 7, 2020 22:11:05 GMT
i don't why N279 follows 29 to TQ from MH, 253 seems more suitable so... 279: Converted to 24hr and extended to either Finsbury Park or Holloway Nags Head at (Night Only) on the bus stops between Manor House and Holloway just like how the 47 used to have one. I also believe this route used to terminate at one of those places. N279: Withdrawn N253: Extended to Trafalgar Square and increased PVR Another thought: 9: Withdrawn ( I believe 10 is more useful than 9, i could be wrong) 10: Restored ( Same reason as 9) N9: Withdrawn bewteen Hyde Park Corner and Aldwych, re-routed to Kings Cross via 10 and re-numbered N10 (Support to Piccadilly from Kings Cross to Heathrow rather than just Piccadilly Circus) The 9 is just as useful as the 10 because links Aldwych and Trafalgar to the West.
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