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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2020 19:10:08 GMT
Or the Ilford section given over to other local routes ie the 369 extended to Stratford. 369 ? Long gone think you mean EL1 or EL2  |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2020 19:10:53 GMT
I was amazed the 25 wasnt changed on renewal in 2004 or even earlier in late 2002/2003 with something similar to the 10, 36, 74, 133 etc. Even as far back as 1999 First proposed to run it in sections. If it ran in sections, it would’ve almost certainly had a fate similar to the 207, eventually splitting into 2 routes And the 253. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2020 19:20:54 GMT
I was amazed the 25 wasnt changed on renewal in 2004 or even earlier in late 2002/2003 with something similar to the 10, 36, 74, 133 etc. Even as far back as 1999 First proposed to run it in sections. I seem to remember something where First planned to run the two sections from separate garages - I assume the Ilford part from DM and the middle section from Hackney. |
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Post by 15002 on Sept 5, 2020 19:31:13 GMT
Or the Ilford section given over to other local routes ie the 369 extended to Stratford. 369 ? Long gone think you mean EL1 or EL2 EL2 doesn’t go to Ilford anymore  |
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Post by southlondonbus on Sept 5, 2020 19:36:05 GMT
Or the Ilford section given over to other local routes ie the 369 extended to Stratford. 369 ? Long gone think you mean EL1 or EL2 No I did mean 369. I was thinking more of TFL had altered it in 2004. |
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Post by LondonNorthern on Sept 5, 2020 21:18:40 GMT
I think there is scope for the 53 to be restored to Trafalgar Square, as the 53 doesn’t parallel CrossRail at any point apart from the fact that both serve Woolwich. The 25 is basically the eastern end of CrossRail but a bus version, I still think it could be extended to Trafalgar Square itself. I think the next three years should be a time in which the other changes can be reviewed, like the proposed butchering of the 180 for instances which is needed along the Greenwich-Charlton-Woolwich corridor to aid with the 177. Wasn’t there some controversy surrounding the 427 changes? However Route 53 did encounter Parliament Square & Whitehall, which have been bombarded with protests in recent years. Imo, the 53 should be kept at County Hall or sent down to Lambeth Palace to better serve the Hospital departments. |
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Post by ronnie on Sept 5, 2020 21:51:32 GMT
Look at the times in 1968! Imagine what they'd be like nowadays? Taken from Ian Armstrongs web page View AttachmentDecided to do a quick comparison between that timetable and one from today (if anyone has the timetable just before it's cutback, please link it) In 1968, Oxford Circus to Ilford High Road, Green Lanes (a little further ahead than it's current Ilford terminus but whatever  ) was timed at at 1h 7 mins when looking at the 16:30 journey and that's not even the full route from either end - today, if I look at the 16:29 journey from Holborn Viaduct to Ilford, Hainault Street, it takes 1h 43 mins and if I look at a current day 55 timetable just for the Oxford Circus to Holborn section, it takes 20 minutes during that time of day so your are looking at nearly 2h for the 25's Oxford Circus to Ilford routing before the cutback I did the 25 in the last week it was in its old form - funnily it was a 16:29ish departure from Oxford Circus. Took 2 hours 20 min to ilford and it was so crowded! There was another similarly packed 25 1 stop ahead and both buses skipped every stop from proctor street till Aldgate, it was that crowded! |
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Post by southlondonbus on Sept 5, 2020 22:04:00 GMT
I still think an Oxford Circus to Stratford route and Aldgate to Ilford would be better then the 25 running for nearly 80 mins then stopping just short of Holborn at City Thameslink.
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Post by vjaska on Sept 5, 2020 22:24:01 GMT
Decided to do a quick comparison between that timetable and one from today (if anyone has the timetable just before it's cutback, please link it) In 1968, Oxford Circus to Ilford High Road, Green Lanes (a little further ahead than it's current Ilford terminus but whatever ) was timed at at 1h 7 mins when looking at the 16:30 journey and that's not even the full route from either end - today, if I look at the 16:29 journey from Holborn Viaduct to Ilford, Hainault Street, it takes 1h 43 mins and if I look at a current day 55 timetable just for the Oxford Circus to Holborn section, it takes 20 minutes during that time of day so your are looking at nearly 2h for the 25's Oxford Circus to Ilford routing before the cutback I did the 25 in the last week it was in its old form - funnily it was a 16:29ish departure from Oxford Circus. Took 2 hours 20 min to ilford and it was so crowded! There was another similarly packed 25 1 stop ahead and both buses skipped every stop from proctor street till Aldgate, it was that crowded! That's roughly how long it took me when doing my end to end challenge - I had to abort my first one as my original 25 turned at Holborn Circus and I waited ages for one before giving in and getting one to Holborn and going home from there but on the successful attempt, it took my pretty 2 hours dead on. |
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Post by greg on Sept 5, 2020 22:32:49 GMT
I still think an Oxford Circus to Stratford route and Aldgate to Ilford would be better then the 25 running for nearly 80 mins then stopping just short of Holborn at City Thameslink. Agree here, the 25 is one of those routes that just needed to be split. Most of the bendy bus routes have been split into two which is quite funny. The 207 and 427 53 and 453 36 and 436 29 and 329 |
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Post by vjaska on Sept 5, 2020 22:40:37 GMT
I still think an Oxford Circus to Stratford route and Aldgate to Ilford would be better then the 25 running for nearly 80 mins then stopping just short of Holborn at City Thameslink. Agree here, the 25 is one of those routes that just needed to be split. Most of the bendy bus routes have been split into two which is quite funny. The 207 and 427 53 and 453 36 and 436 29 and 329 Out of the above, the 36 & 53 didn't receive be Artics but instead, the 436 & 453 did whilst the 29 wasn't split but was cutback in 1992 with the 329 taking over the Wood Green to Enfield section with a tiny overlap between Turnpike Lane & Wood Green. The 207 was a former Artic route that was split. There were more non Artic routes that were split in reality. |
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Post by greg on Sept 5, 2020 22:53:24 GMT
Agree here, the 25 is one of those routes that just needed to be split. Most of the bendy bus routes have been split into two which is quite funny. The 207 and 427 53 and 453 36 and 436 29 and 329 Out of the above, the 36 & 53 didn't receive be Artics but instead, the 436 & 453 did whilst the 29 wasn't split but was cutback in 1992 with the 329 taking over the Wood Green to Enfield section with a tiny overlap between Turnpike Lane & Wood Green. The 207 was a former Artic route that was split. There were more non Artic routes that were split in reality. The 45 and 46 were one which comes to my mind with the 46 replacing the 45 between King’s Cross and Hampstead and then going further to Lancaster Gate. |
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Post by route53 on Sept 5, 2020 23:11:34 GMT
This may seem that I’m living up to my username but I don’t agree that the 53 should be kept at County Hall, it should be restored to Whitehall/Trafalgar Square, it’s a useful cheap way to get people to the West End.
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Post by route53 on Sept 5, 2020 23:12:51 GMT
I still think an Oxford Circus to Stratford route and Aldgate to Ilford would be better then the 25 running for nearly 80 mins then stopping just short of Holborn at City Thameslink. Agree here, the 25 is one of those routes that just needed to be split. Most of the bendy bus routes have been split into two which is quite funny. The 207 and 427 53 and 453 36 and 436 29 and 329 The 18 like the 25 also wasn’t split when the artics first arrived, it still runs a lengthy route from Euston to Sudbury to this day |
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Post by rift on Sept 5, 2020 23:23:52 GMT
This may seem that I’m living up to my username but I don’t agree that the 53 should be kept at County Hall, it should be restored to Whitehall/Trafalgar Square, it’s a useful cheap way to get people to the West End. Most people I’m sure would agree with you, although traffic is likely what’s keeping it from going back, and no prizes for guessing what’s possibly pushed back the plan to reduce traffic in Central London... |
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) was timed at at 1h 7 mins when looking at the 16:30 journey and that's not even the full route from either end - today, if I look at the 16:29 journey from Holborn Viaduct to Ilford, Hainault Street, it takes 1h 43 mins and if I look at a current day 55 timetable just for the Oxford Circus to Holborn section, it takes 20 minutes during that time of day so your are looking at nearly 2h for the 25's Oxford Circus to Ilford routing before the cutback