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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2020 16:00:41 GMT
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Post by rugbyref on Sept 12, 2020 7:23:14 GMT
This just shows how out of touch with reality TFL is. The Red route on the A21 at Bromley Common requires the bus lane in the morning peak, but absolutely not at any other time. Additionally, the signage is overgrown, so presumably would cause problems in court if a fine were to be challenged?
And TFL looks incompetent when it cannot even post a pdf with the pages all oriented in the same direction!
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Post by greenboy on Sept 12, 2020 7:46:14 GMT
This just shows how out of touch with reality TFL is. The Red route on the A21 at Bromley Common requires the bus lane in the morning peak, but absolutely not at any other time. Additionally, the signage is overgrown, so presumably would cause problems in court if a fine were to be challenged? And TFL looks incompetent when it cannot even post a pdf with the pages all oriented in the same direction! Again TfL are d*mned whatever they do............. why would other traffic need to be using this particular bus lane? I don't know why it isn't already 24hr. |
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Post by SILENCED on Sept 12, 2020 7:48:32 GMT
This just shows how out of touch with reality TFL is. The Red route on the A21 at Bromley Common requires the bus lane in the morning peak, but absolutely not at any other time. Additionally, the signage is overgrown, so presumably would cause problems in court if a fine were to be challenged? And TFL looks incompetent when it cannot even post a pdf with the pages all oriented in the same direction! Again TfL are d*mned whatever they do............. why would other traffic need to be using this particular bus lane? I don't know why it isn't already 24hr. You can turn that question around, why do buses need exclusive use of it 24 hours a day. Quite simply they don't. |
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Post by greenboy on Sept 12, 2020 7:51:59 GMT
Again TfL are d*mned whatever they do............. why would other traffic need to be using this particular bus lane? I don't know why it isn't already 24hr. You can turn that question around, why do buses need exclusive use of it 24 hours a day. Quite simply they don't. Each one needs to be judged on it's own merits, loading bays etc. The Bromley Common one is adjacent to foliage and there really is no need for any other vehicle to use it. |
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Post by SILENCED on Sept 12, 2020 8:06:13 GMT
You can turn that question around, why do buses need exclusive use of it 24 hours a day. Quite simply they don't. Each one needs to be judged on it's own merits, loading bays etc. The Bromley Common one is adjacent to foliage and there really is no need for any other vehicle to use it. And what need is there for its exclusive usage? |
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Post by wirewiper on Sept 12, 2020 8:50:54 GMT
Again TfL are d*mned whatever they do............. why would other traffic need to be using this particular bus lane? I don't know why it isn't already 24hr. You can turn that question around, why do buses need exclusive use of it 24 hours a day. Quite simply they don't. Maybe that's true. However it's an easy rule to understand and implement, all bus lanes on Red Routes become 24-hour. You can then argue for the exemptions, but unless there is a strong case for one (e.g. off-peak loading/unloading for shops), the rule stands. Saying that buses do not need exclusive 24-hour use of a particular bus lane is not in itself a reason why they should not have it. |
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Post by SILENCED on Sept 12, 2020 9:29:27 GMT
You can turn that question around, why do buses need exclusive use of it 24 hours a day. Quite simply they don't. Maybe that's true. However it's an easy rule to understand and implement, all bus lanes on Red Routes become 24-hour. You can then argue for the exemptions, but unless there is a strong case for one (e.g. off-peak loading/unloading for shops), the rule stands. Saying that buses do not need exclusive 24-hour use of a particular bus lane is not in itself a reason why they should not have it. But sounds an even weaker excuse as to why they should have exclusive access. Surely it is all about maximizing the use of existing road space ... not some draconian rule prohibiting use due to something that is not required ... sounds like introducing red tape at a drop of a hat with very little thought ... Did someone mention planters? |
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Post by greenboy on Sept 12, 2020 9:42:12 GMT
Maybe that's true. However it's an easy rule to understand and implement, all bus lanes on Red Routes become 24-hour. You can then argue for the exemptions, but unless there is a strong case for one (e.g. off-peak loading/unloading for shops), the rule stands. Saying that buses do not need exclusive 24-hour use of a particular bus lane is not in itself a reason why they should not have it. But sounds an even weaker excuse as to why they should have exclusive access. Surely it is all about maximizing the use of existing road space ... not some draconian rule prohibiting use due to something that is not required ... sounds like introducing red tape at a drop of a hat with very little thought ... Did someone mention planters? The question is, why would other vehicles need to use the Bromley Common bus lane if there is no congestion? And if there is congestion the bus lane is justified. Clearly TfL are just trying to speed up bus travel in the face of increased car usage because of covid. |
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Post by SILENCED on Sept 12, 2020 9:46:34 GMT
But sounds an even weaker excuse as to why they should have exclusive access. Surely it is all about maximizing the use of existing road space ... not some draconian rule prohibiting use due to something that is not required ... sounds like introducing red tape at a drop of a hat with very little thought ... Did someone mention planters? The question is, why would other vehicles need to use the Bromley Common bus lane if there is no congestion? And if there is congestion the bus lane is justified. Clearly TfL are just trying to speed up bus travel in the face of increased car usage because of covid. Surely the reason why something should be prohibited should be answered before a reason why it should not be prohibited needs to be answered. TfL are proposing a change, which had already been agreed it is not needed. There needs to be a justified reason for this change, and frankly there is not one. Why waste time, money and effort on something that is not needed. Planters 2. |
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Post by greenboy on Sept 12, 2020 10:37:02 GMT
The question is, why would other vehicles need to use the Bromley Common bus lane if there is no congestion? And if there is congestion the bus lane is justified. Clearly TfL are just trying to speed up bus travel in the face of increased car usage because of covid. Surely the reason why something should be prohibited should be answered before a reason why it should not be prohibited needs to be answered. TfL are proposing a change, which had already been agreed it is not needed. There needs to be a justified reason for this change, and frankly there is not one. Why waste time, money and effort on something that is not needed. Planters 2. Planters? Covid has changed things, rush hours are much quieter because of fewer people travelling to and from work whilst off peak is a lot busier so it seems a sensible move for TfL to make changes to bus lanes but as always they're never going to please everybody and will be d*mned whatever they do. |
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Post by vjaska on Sept 12, 2020 11:23:04 GMT
The question is, why would other vehicles need to use the Bromley Common bus lane if there is no congestion? And if there is congestion the bus lane is justified. Clearly TfL are just trying to speed up bus travel in the face of increased car usage because of covid. Surely the reason why something should be prohibited should be answered before a reason why it should not be prohibited needs to be answered. TfL are proposing a change, which had already been agreed it is not needed. There needs to be a justified reason for this change, and frankly there is not one. Why waste time, money and effort on something that is not needed. Planters 2. This is not the same as the planters - a 24 hour bus lane isn't going to cause extra congestion when currently, the likely time the bus lane is in operation is during the peak periods anyway. Even then, peak periods may change as a result of the pandemic especially if we get to a point where people do go back to work and times are staggered. The planters/LTN's cause extra traffic by blocking entire roads off which is clearly an entirely different thing. |
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Post by SILENCED on Sept 12, 2020 11:59:19 GMT
Surely the reason why something should be prohibited should be answered before a reason why it should not be prohibited needs to be answered. TfL are proposing a change, which had already been agreed it is not needed. There needs to be a justified reason for this change, and frankly there is not one. Why waste time, money and effort on something that is not needed. Planters 2. Planters? Covid has changed things, rush hours are much quieter because of fewer people travelling to and from work whilst off peak is a lot busier so it seems a sensible move for TfL to make changes to bus lanes but as always they're never going to please everybody and will be d*mned whatever they do. If roads are quieter, then surely bus lanes are no longer needed ... should be suspending them rather than extending hours of operation. |
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Post by SILENCED on Sept 12, 2020 12:00:29 GMT
Surely the reason why something should be prohibited should be answered before a reason why it should not be prohibited needs to be answered. TfL are proposing a change, which had already been agreed it is not needed. There needs to be a justified reason for this change, and frankly there is not one. Why waste time, money and effort on something that is not needed. Planters 2. This is not the same as the planters - a 24 hour bus lane isn't going to cause extra congestion when currently, the likely time the bus lane is in operation is during the peak periods anyway. Even then, peak periods may change as a result of the pandemic especially if we get to a point where people do go back to work and times are staggered. The planters/LTN's cause extra traffic by blocking entire roads off which is clearly an entirely different thing. Same lack of thought and planning in both from the TfL pie in the sky team |
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Post by LJ17THF on Sept 12, 2020 12:22:54 GMT
Planters? Covid has changed things, rush hours are much quieter because of fewer people travelling to and from work whilst off peak is a lot busier so it seems a sensible move for TfL to make changes to bus lanes but as always they're never going to please everybody and will be d*mned whatever they do. If roads are quieter, then surely bus lanes are no longer needed ... should be suspending them rather than extending hours of operation. Roads are certainly not quieter, in my area at least - over 200 extra buses running on top of the existing thousands, more people going in cars. Suspending the bus lanes would bring more relief to the traffic, but would discourage people from using public transport, they would use their cars if they had one. I think a trial is a good idea, rather than immediately going ahead with it - perhaps they might get more people on buses where roads are congested. However, I doubt it will make much of a difference, not many people remember that there are specific time limits for bus lanes and just don't use them at all. |
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