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Post by ADH45258 on Apr 29, 2022 10:11:12 GMT
It’s too long to be a metro stopper service and it stops at too many stations to be a long distance service. It can’t be both. If they want Thameslink to be a metro stopper it shouldn’t go further than Dartford or maybe Gravesend, and St Albans should be the northern end point. It should stop at all stations via Greenwich & Woolwich Arsenal. If it is to be a Luton to Rainham long distance service, then between London Bridge and Dartford it should only stop at Woolwich Arsenal and Abbey Wood. This is Thameslink’s trouble, mixing all stop services with fast services, it should be one or the other I agree with this, ideally Thameslink should have been more like the Elizabeth Line - including more metro-style routes, in exchange for longer distance destinations such as Peterborough or Brighton returning to London terminal stations. The Class 700 trains are certainly not suitable for longer journeys such as London to Cambridge, not even having any plug sockets.
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Post by greenboy on Apr 29, 2022 10:21:15 GMT
Do people in Luton really need to get to the Medway Towns that badly? Enough to need a direct service? I’d scrap Thameslink from the area completely and just stick to Southeastern. 2tph - Cannon Street to Rainham - Semi Fast via Woolwich Arsenal Calling at London Bridge, Woolwich Arsenal, Abbey Wood, Dartford, Stone Crossing, Greenhithe, Swanscombe, Northfleet, Gravesend, Higham, Strood, Rochester, Chatham, Gillingham & Rainham. Well no that's why I suggested terminating the Thameslink service at Dartford and I'd look upon the Dartford to Luton service as a tube service, just a shame it can't be more frequent. No scope for any fast services because of the increase in stopping services.
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Post by kmkcheng on Apr 29, 2022 10:49:00 GMT
This is Thameslink’s trouble, mixing all stop services with fast services, it should be one or the other I agree with this, ideally Thameslink should have been more like the Elizabeth Line - including more metro-style routes, in exchange for longer distance destinations such as Peterborough or Brighton returning to London terminal stations. The Class 700 trains are certainly not suitable for longer journeys such as London to Cambridge, not even having any plug sockets. I think mixing is fine as long as the correct infrastructure is in place like 4-tracking to separate the fast and slow services.
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Post by route53 on Apr 29, 2022 10:57:26 GMT
Do people in Luton really need to get to the Medway Towns that badly? Enough to need a direct service? I’d scrap Thameslink from the area completely and just stick to Southeastern. 2tph - Cannon Street to Rainham - Semi Fast via Woolwich Arsenal Calling at London Bridge, Woolwich Arsenal, Abbey Wood, Dartford, Stone Crossing, Greenhithe, Swanscombe, Northfleet, Gravesend, Higham, Strood, Rochester, Chatham, Gillingham & Rainham. Well no that's why I suggested terminating the Thameslink service at Dartford and I'd look upon the Dartford to Luton service as a tube service, just a shame it can't be more frequent. No scope for any fast services because of the increase in stopping services. Well there doesn’t have to be stopping services, the Medways can return to a semi fast pattern leaving the Dartfords and Gravesends as the stoppers, simple as.
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Post by route53 on Apr 29, 2022 11:00:54 GMT
This is Thameslink’s trouble, mixing all stop services with fast services, it should be one or the other I agree with this, ideally Thameslink should have been more like the Elizabeth Line - including more metro-style routes, in exchange for longer distance destinations such as Peterborough or Brighton returning to London terminal stations. The Class 700 trains are certainly not suitable for longer journeys such as London to Cambridge, not even having any plug sockets. I think Thameslink could work as a express outer-suburban type if they improved the seats on the 700s, then you could run this type of service 1: Brighton to Bedford 2: Brighton to Cambridge 3: Chichester to Peterborough 4: Guildford to Luton 5: Ashford to Cambridge 6: Medway (via Bromley South) to Bedford
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Post by vjaska on Apr 29, 2022 11:07:52 GMT
I agree with this, ideally Thameslink should have been more like the Elizabeth Line - including more metro-style routes, in exchange for longer distance destinations such as Peterborough or Brighton returning to London terminal stations. The Class 700 trains are certainly not suitable for longer journeys such as London to Cambridge, not even having any plug sockets. I think Thameslink could work as a express outer-suburban type if they improved the seats on the 700s, then you could run this type of service 1: Brighton to Bedford 2: Brighton to Cambridge 3: Chichester to Peterborough 4: Guildford to Luton 5: Ashford to Cambridge 6: Medway (via Bromley South) to Bedford Sadly, I don't think they will improve the seats even though I think they should as they aren't great, seems to be a theme across sister batches too as I've used a couple of Great Northern examples recently and they too had the same iron board seats. Even Crossrail's Class 345's are in a similar position though ever so slightly better but not by much
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Post by greenboy on Apr 29, 2022 11:08:21 GMT
Well no that's why I suggested terminating the Thameslink service at Dartford and I'd look upon the Dartford to Luton service as a tube service, just a shame it can't be more frequent. No scope for any fast services because of the increase in stopping services. Well there doesn’t have to be stopping services, the Medways can return to a semi fast pattern leaving the Dartfords and Gravesends as the stoppers, simple as. You're just repeating the same thing here, the semi fast service won't be returning. If you feel that strongly about it then contact Southeastern.
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Post by greenboy on Apr 29, 2022 11:17:35 GMT
This is Thameslink’s trouble, mixing all stop services with fast services, it should be one or the other I agree with this, ideally Thameslink should have been more like the Elizabeth Line - including more metro-style routes, in exchange for longer distance destinations such as Peterborough or Brighton returning to London terminal stations. The Class 700 trains are certainly not suitable for longer journeys such as London to Cambridge, not even having any plug sockets. There are plug sockets in first class and whilst the seating could be better I don't think it's that bad. I've got some elderly relatives in Horsham who travel up to Lincoln occasionally and find it great with a cross platform change at Stevenage rather than trecking across Central London with luggage.
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Post by Dillon95 on Apr 29, 2022 11:40:21 GMT
I think Thameslink could work as a express outer-suburban type if they improved the seats on the 700s, then you could run this type of service 1: Brighton to Bedford 2: Brighton to Cambridge 3: Chichester to Peterborough 4: Guildford to Luton 5: Ashford to Cambridge 6: Medway (via Bromley South) to Bedford Sadly, I don't think they will improve the seats even though I think they should as they aren't great, seems to be a theme across sister batches too as I've used a couple of Great Northern examples recently and they too had the same iron board seats. Even Crossrail's Class 345's are in a similar position though ever so slightly better but not by much They are fine for short metro tube style journeys. The times I’ve sat on them from London Bridge or East Croydon all the way down to Brighton have been awful. They literally are ironing boards.
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Post by Dillon95 on Apr 29, 2022 11:42:11 GMT
Well there doesn’t have to be stopping services, the Medways can return to a semi fast pattern leaving the Dartfords and Gravesends as the stoppers, simple as. You're just repeating the same thing here, the semi fast service won't be returning. If you feel that strongly about it then contact Southeastern. Well he’s right they should return, Rainham is too far out of London to be a slow stopping service. Even if it skips a few stations like Erith out.
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Post by greenboy on Apr 29, 2022 11:52:19 GMT
You're just repeating the same thing here, the semi fast service won't be returning. If you feel that strongly about it then contact Southeastern. Well he’s right they should return, Rainham is too far out of London to be a slow stopping service. Even if it skips a few stations like Erith out. But Rainham does have the high speed service to St Pancras and fast trains to Victoria.
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Post by route53 on Apr 29, 2022 12:13:08 GMT
Well he’s right they should return, Rainham is too far out of London to be a slow stopping service. Even if it skips a few stations like Erith out. But Rainham does have the high speed service to St Pancras and fast trains to Victoria. So what that they have High Speed services? doesn’t mean Medway should have an unreliable, tediously slow, all stations service to London, the old semi fast actually served a purpose at getting those from Medway & Gravesend to key interchange stations like Woolwich Arsenal and Lewisham and soon to be Abbey Wood or serving large areas like Woolwich and Abbey Wood for Thamesmead. No everyone wants Victora or St. Pancras you do realise that don’t you?
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Post by route53 on Apr 29, 2022 12:15:14 GMT
Well there doesn’t have to be stopping services, the Medways can return to a semi fast pattern leaving the Dartfords and Gravesends as the stoppers, simple as. You're just repeating the same thing here, the semi fast service won't be returning. If you feel that strongly about it then contact Southeastern. And you’re repeating yourself too, how do you know the fast service won’t return? You can’t say that for certain as Nothing is guaranteed
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Post by greenboy on Apr 29, 2022 12:19:09 GMT
You're just repeating the same thing here, the semi fast service won't be returning. If you feel that strongly about it then contact Southeastern. And you’re repeating yourself too, how do you know the fast service won’t return? You can’t say that for certain as Nothing is guaranteed Passengers at stations that were not served by the semi fast now have a better service.
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Post by route53 on Apr 29, 2022 12:28:22 GMT
And you’re repeating yourself too, how do you know the fast service won’t return? You can’t say that for certain as Nothing is guaranteed Passengers at stations that were not served by the semi fast now have a better service. How? Thameslink has for the most part ran 1tph, leaving large gaps on the Greenwich line, whenever there is disruption it become a weird Dartford to Rainham service. The country shacks between Dartford, Greenhithe and Gravesend don’t need 4tph, and Plumstead and Slade Green are quiet stations that can cope with 6tph, and the Greenwich line would be much better off with 6tph to Cannon Street, I really don’t see why Medway/Gravesend passengers should have a slower service just because passengers at Plumstead or Slade Green don’t want to wait a few extra minutes, outer suburban/regional services tend to run fast through quiet suburban stations, that’s a reality.
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