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Post by rj131 on Oct 5, 2019 22:13:35 GMT
Regarding the 49 Enviro CityEV buses on order for the 106, 212, 230 and 357, does anyone have any idea on where the funding for these vehicles is coming from?
It’s just that my very initial thought when reading that news was that if it’s TfL forking out for these buses, then I would have thought in this tough financial climate for them is it really necessarily spending all that money on these very expensive vehicles when I’d say a higher priority for them should be more route improvements and generally trying to make bus travel more attractive amid falling usage and cuts. *If* what I said is the case (and it may well not be) then it all just seems like a gimmick to me when conventional hybrids are perfectly adequate. I could see maybe that opinion maybe being unpopular to some but that’s just my take on it.
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Post by rif153 on Oct 5, 2019 22:18:41 GMT
Soon we'll have Go Ahead bragging that they have two garages in London with a fully electric fleet lol. They already boast about RA being the only garage in London with a fully electrics fleet and call it the Waterloo Revolution, I wonder what they'll call NP's conversion to a fully electric fleet.
Also if the electrics do go to NP for the 106, 212, 230, and 357 then it'll be very strange how NP will have a fleet consisting of diesels and electrics, yet no conventional hybrids.
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Post by rj131 on Oct 5, 2019 22:27:25 GMT
Soon we'll have Go Ahead bragging that they have two garages in London with a fully electric fleet lol. They already boast about RA being the only garage in London with a fully electrics fleet and call it the Waterloo Revolution, I wonder what they'll call NP's conversion to a fully electric fleet. Also if the electrics do go to NP for the 106, 212, 230, and 357 then it'll be very strange how NP will have a fleet consisting of diesels and electrics, yet no conventional hybrids. Not quite, they have LTs on the 76, and soon to be route 67 which are conventional hybrids
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Post by rif153 on Oct 5, 2019 22:30:16 GMT
Soon we'll have Go Ahead bragging that they have two garages in London with a fully electric fleet lol. They already boast about RA being the only garage in London with a fully electrics fleet and call it the Waterloo Revolution, I wonder what they'll call NP's conversion to a fully electric fleet. yet no conventional hybrids. Not quite, they have LTs on the 76, and soon to be route 67 which are conventional hybrids By the phrase no conventional hybrids I meant no two door conventional hybrid buses.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2019 22:32:13 GMT
Regarding the 49 Enviro CityEV buses on order for the 106, 212, 230 and 357, does anyone have any idea on where the funding for these vehicles is coming from? It’s just that my very initial thought when reading that news was that if it’s TfL forking out for these buses, then I would have thought in this tough financial climate for them is it really necessarily spending all that money on these very expensive vehicles when I’d say a higher priority for them should be more route improvements and generally trying to make bus travel more attractive amid falling usage and cuts. *If* what I said is the case (and it may well not be) then it all just seems like a gimmick to me when conventional hybrids are perfectly adequate. I could see maybe that opinion maybe being unpopular to some but that’s just my take on it. Personally I don’t see any of those routes receiving these vehicles. I think it is far more likely that the EVs, if indeed ordered, would be allocated to central London routes, maybe the 14/22/74 at Putney or 88 at Stockwell or 36 at New Cross with hybrids from this routes heading to NP. TfL has history for this like when they first introduced hybrids they were awarding routes in outer London with them but in practice swapping them onto central London routes, the 87/88 is a prime example of this.
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Post by E279 on Oct 5, 2019 22:39:49 GMT
Regarding the 49 Enviro CityEV buses on order for the 106, 212, 230 and 357, does anyone have any idea on where the funding for these vehicles is coming from? It’s just that my very initial thought when reading that news was that if it’s TfL forking out for these buses, then I would have thought in this tough financial climate for them is it really necessarily spending all that money on these very expensive vehicles when I’d say a higher priority for them should be more route improvements and generally trying to make bus travel more attractive amid falling usage and cuts. *If* what I said is the case (and it may well not be) then it all just seems like a gimmick to me when conventional hybrids are perfectly adequate. I could see maybe that opinion maybe being unpopular to some but that’s just my take on it. Personally I don’t see any of those routes receiving these vehicles. I think it is far more likely that the EVs, if indeed ordered, would be allocated to central London routes, maybe the 14/22/74 at Putney or 88 at Stockwell or 36 at New Cross with hybrids from this routes heading to NP. TfL has history for this like when they first introduced hybrids they were awarding routes in outer London with them but in practice swapping them onto central London routes, the 87/88 is a prime example of this. I disagree, Go Ahead are keen on making NP a fully electric garage.
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Oct 5, 2019 22:52:29 GMT
Personally I don’t see any of those routes receiving these vehicles. I think it is far more likely that the EVs, if indeed ordered, would be allocated to central London routes, maybe the 14/22/74 at Putney or 88 at Stockwell or 36 at New Cross with hybrids from this routes heading to NP. TfL has history for this like when they first introduced hybrids they were awarding routes in outer London with them but in practice swapping them onto central London routes, the 87/88 is a prime example of this. I disagree, Go Ahead are keen on making NP a fully electric garage. Have Go Ahead officially stated that anywhere?
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Post by E279 on Oct 5, 2019 22:59:14 GMT
I disagree, Go Ahead are keen on making NP a fully electric garage. Have Go Ahead officially stated that anywhere? I remember reading an article on google a few weeks back, was also said by a member of NP on here as well as a few chats with drivers about the upcoming 444 so I don’t think all of the mentioned are lying which is why I posted it. Another thing to consider is that NP is undergoing the construction of 60* new charging points, I highly doubt they would do this construction only to have the buses diverted to another garage and need to construct another load of electric charging points. * I think 60 was the number stated by the member of NP. This would also add up 49+ 11 = 60, 49 BYD electric DD + 11 SEes for Route 444.
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Post by vjaska on Oct 6, 2019 2:13:10 GMT
I disagree, Go Ahead are keen on making NP a fully electric garage. Have Go Ahead officially stated that anywhere? No but I believe further electric charging points are being fitted at NP which would lead to me think they'll go there even if it's a very odd choice of routes to pick from. Also very odd this sudden outlay on buses that are still relatively unproven.
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Post by E279 on Oct 6, 2019 2:21:08 GMT
Have Go Ahead officially stated that anywhere? No but I believe further electric charging points are being fitted at NP which would lead to me think they'll go there even if it's a very odd choice of routes to pick from. Also very odd this sudden outlay on buses that are still relatively unproven. BDEs seem to be gaining popularity with Metroline, RATP, Go Ahead London all ordering them, to be fair, they have been quite reliable on the 43 and I haven’t seen many issues with them other than teething issues but as you say they are a new thing for London and already 6 routes are being converted. I have a feeling th MetroDecker isn’t going to be a big thing in London, they seem to be having more issues than the BDEs and they don’t seem to be that reliable from what I’ve seen. If all goes well with the 4 NP routes being converted, I can see GAL trying to retain the 476 with E400 City EVs.
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Post by DT 11 on Oct 6, 2019 6:19:48 GMT
Regarding the 49 Enviro CityEV buses on order for the 106, 212, 230 and 357, does anyone have any idea on where the funding for these vehicles is coming from? It’s just that my very initial thought when reading that news was that if it’s TfL forking out for these buses, then I would have thought in this tough financial climate for them is it really necessarily spending all that money on these very expensive vehicles when I’d say a higher priority for them should be more route improvements and generally trying to make bus travel more attractive amid falling usage and cuts. *If* what I said is the case (and it may well not be) then it all just seems like a gimmick to me when conventional hybrids are perfectly adequate. I could see maybe that opinion maybe being unpopular to some but that’s just my take on it. Personally I don’t see any of those routes receiving these vehicles. I think it is far more likely that the EVs, if indeed ordered, would be allocated to central London routes, maybe the 14/22/74 at Putney or 88 at Stockwell or 36 at New Cross with hybrids from this routes heading to NP. TfL has history for this like when they first introduced hybrids they were awarding routes in outer London with them but in practice swapping them onto central London routes, the 87/88 is a prime example of this. You also need to be aware Electric Buses take up more room than diesels so it cannot just be a case divert them elsewhere. As more routes go Electric operators are going to require additional spaces to park buses. The routes mentioned at NP will get the Electric Buses especially as NP have the space and as mentioned above have already began installing the equipment... Overall its nice to see routes outside of Central London for once getting new stock as well as new technology instead of existing buses. Either way people complain if a route gets new buses or existing buses cannot win at all...
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Post by cl54 on Oct 6, 2019 7:21:16 GMT
I had a recent visit to the Red Arrow base at Waterloo.
The buses need to be charged whenever they are on site.
This is achieved by having a spine of charging points down the parking area. This reduces the number of vehicles that can be accommodated.
The vehicles also need servicing on vehicle lifts.
This means that operators have to concentrate garage by garage on the additional facilities.
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Post by southlondonbus on Oct 6, 2019 8:40:10 GMT
Once the points are installed at NP we will know for sure they are going there. They wont be last minute swapped with another garage.
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Post by rif153 on Oct 6, 2019 9:13:41 GMT
No but I believe further electric charging points are being fitted at NP which would lead to me think they'll go there even if it's a very odd choice of routes to pick from. Also very odd this sudden outlay on buses that are still relatively unproven. BDEs seem to be gaining popularity with Metroline, RATP, Go Ahead London all ordering them, to be fair, they have been quite reliable on the 43 and I haven’t seen many issues with them other than teething issues but as you say they are a new thing for London and already 6 routes are being converted. I have a feeling th MetroDecker isn’t going to be a big thing in London, they seem to be having more issues than the BDEs and they don’t seem to be that reliable from what I’ve seen. If all goes well with the 4 NP routes being converted, I can see GAL trying to retain the 476 with E400 City EVs. Would also give GAL electric DDs to use on the N20 if their bid is successful.
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Post by ThinLizzy on Oct 6, 2019 9:48:17 GMT
Not quite, they have LTs on the 76, and soon to be route 67 which are conventional hybrids By the phrase no conventional hybrids I meant no two door conventional hybrid buses. I think the phrase "first garage to have no conventional hybrid or diesel 2 door double deck buses only electric" is a bit of a mouthful
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