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Post by capitalomnibus on Dec 30, 2020 12:35:29 GMT
What are companies / TfL doing to provide staff appropriate places to rest, if their break point formerly relied upon using public venues for places to sit down, drink, eat and use welfare facilities ? We could be in a situation in a few days where no take aways will be open together with hardly any welfare facilities. An hour sat on a cold bus in Harrow Bus Station is far from ideal as a break. Coupled with tier 4, I hope TfL will allow companies to reschedule their routes to allow all drivers a proper break somewhere warm and safe. Even if it means reducing frequencies or putting more buses out overall ( to allow drivers to take their bus to the garage for relief) They have provided redundant buses to be used as meal relief buses, been happening over the past few months. Also in places where the bus station staff rooms can only accommodate a limited amount of drivers to ensure safe social distancing rules in place. Re-scheduling buses costs a hell of a lot of money, time and resources; so cannot see that happening just to accommodate a 'short term' tier 4.
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Post by martynl on Dec 30, 2020 23:34:20 GMT
Following a discussion elsewhere about the 135 tender got me thinking about garage locations and tender awards. Sometimes you see too different views here about garage locations.
Do garages need to be close to a terminal?
Dead running is usually at the start and end of a day so shouldn't have too much impact?
I remember talk about garages at southern or northern end not always working if TfL scheduled most journeys from the opposite end (Lke the 19 for example) Would TfL every consider adjusting this if a tender is more competitive from the north say?
Garages do not need to be close to terminal. This is something that stemmed from LT days and then enthusiasts seem to be hung up on this. There is no obvious need for this. Most dead mileage doesn't take long whether on or off route. Also dead running would not have a bus doing start/stop so would be increased mpg on this front. Also as dead running is done mainly at the start and end of the day there is not as much traffic to contend with. Although crew changes being further from the garage during the day could pose a problem, whether using ferry vehicles, buses, trains etc especially if there is traffic etc. Garages at both ends of the route is not a problem for TfL as long as it doesn't pose operational problems to the service. Lots of good points being made here but one thing to add is that a bus dead running earns no revenue and back in LT days that was not a good thing! Positioning runs from the garage to the nearest line of the route were common as were buses running in when their current stint was over. TB had the majority of its routes away from the garage but it was commonplace to see buses on the 119, 126, 138, 146 and 227 all running back home in service. No doubt TfL think such instances would be 'confusing' for its 'customers' as it did with via points and suffix routes. Incidentally is it known what the furthest distance a route terminates away from its home garage it doesn't call at in normal service? I would've thought that until recently 202's running dead back to C from Blackheath was a fair distance until Arriva won the route.
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Dec 30, 2020 23:41:29 GMT
Garages do not need to be close to terminal. This is something that stemmed from LT days and then enthusiasts seem to be hung up on this. There is no obvious need for this. Most dead mileage doesn't take long whether on or off route. Also dead running would not have a bus doing start/stop so would be increased mpg on this front. Also as dead running is done mainly at the start and end of the day there is not as much traffic to contend with. Although crew changes being further from the garage during the day could pose a problem, whether using ferry vehicles, buses, trains etc especially if there is traffic etc. Garages at both ends of the route is not a problem for TfL as long as it doesn't pose operational problems to the service. Lots of good points being made here but one thing to add is that a bus dead running earns no revenue and back in LT days that was not a good thing! Positioning runs from the garage to the nearest line of the route were common as were buses running in when their current stint was over. TB had the majority of its routes away from the garage but it was commonplace to see buses on the 119, 126, 138, 146 and 227 all running back home in service. No doubt TfL think such instances would be 'confusing' for its 'customers' as it did with via points and suffix routes. Incidentally is it known what the furthest distance a route terminates away from its home garage it doesn't call at in normal service? I would've thought that until recently 202's running dead back to C from Blackheath was a fair distance until Arriva won the route. I think the longest dead run has to have the 66 as a contender, 18.1 miles from Grays garage to Leytonstone station running via the A13 to Beckton, A406 to Redbridge and then line of route to Leytonstone, funnily enough this dead run also takes the route past DX. The shortest distance from GY to Romford Station is still 11 miles long which dwarfs the 5.8 miles the 202 had from C to Crystal Palace. However sticking with C, if you include a dead run all the way from Heathrow then it's 23 miles which is one of the longest I could find on route X26, however if you only include closest termini then the X26 is very close to its Croydon end.
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Post by ronnie on Dec 31, 2020 0:08:01 GMT
Lots of good points being made here but one thing to add is that a bus dead running earns no revenue and back in LT days that was not a good thing! Positioning runs from the garage to the nearest line of the route were common as were buses running in when their current stint was over. TB had the majority of its routes away from the garage but it was commonplace to see buses on the 119, 126, 138, 146 and 227 all running back home in service. No doubt TfL think such instances would be 'confusing' for its 'customers' as it did with via points and suffix routes. Incidentally is it known what the furthest distance a route terminates away from its home garage it doesn't call at in normal service? I would've thought that until recently 202's running dead back to C from Blackheath was a fair distance until Arriva won the route. I think the longest dead run has to have the 66 as a contender, 18.1 miles from Grays garage to Leytonstone station running via the A13 to Beckton, A406 to Redbridge and then line of route to Leytonstone, funnily enough this dead run also takes the route past DX. The shortest distance from GY to Romford Station is still 11 miles long which dwarfs the 5.8 miles the 202 had from C to Crystal Palace. However sticking with C, if you include a dead run all the way from Heathrow then it's 23 miles which is one of the longest I could find on route X26, however if you only include closest termini then the X26 is very close to its Croydon end. 66 is a good one I must say. Another long one is 340 - 13 miles from palmers green to Harrow and 9.6miles from palmers green to edgware
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Post by Catford94 on Dec 31, 2020 0:28:17 GMT
Lots of good points being made here but one thing to add is that a bus dead running earns no revenue and back in LT days that was not a good thing! Positioning runs from the garage to the nearest line of the route were common as were buses running in when their current stint was over. TB had the majority of its routes away from the garage but it was commonplace to see buses on the 119, 126, 138, 146 and 227 all running back home in service. No doubt TfL think such instances would be 'confusing' for its 'customers' as it did with via points and suffix routes. a few angles on this yes it was / would be mildly confusing (to passengers who take any notice of what's on the front of the bus) if occasional (for example) 227's run through from the Penge direction to (say) Bromley garage but then there wasn't one the next time they wanted to make that journey. it's also more work for TFL to add timetables and whatever e-plates are called now to bus stops for these garage journeys. then what if an operator decides to move a route to a different garage (Metrobus moved the 119 from Orpington to Croydon for example, presumably to balance work between the two garages)- which will generate more work and complaints from people who had just got used to one set of garage journeys (wasn't there a lot of fuss when the 73 was routed away from Tottenham, which had effectively been a live garage run?) Or even if a revised duty schedule meant different garage runs on a route where buses go back to garage at certain times for meal breaks or change-overs. And more so if a route's re-tendered and changes operator. the other angle is that it would add a bit of travel time for the bus working (especially when running dead to the 'wrong' end of the route) which in turn would add driver duty time and therefore cost. It could easily add a duty or two to many routes, as you might have a driver duty spell now that is just inside a drivers hours / local agreement limit, but the additional time to run in service would push that duty over the edge. It doesn't sound a lot, but an extra driver duty or two, per day, on hundreds of routes would add up a bit...
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Post by capitalomnibus on Dec 31, 2020 2:49:05 GMT
Lots of good points being made here but one thing to add is that a bus dead running earns no revenue and back in LT days that was not a good thing! Positioning runs from the garage to the nearest line of the route were common as were buses running in when their current stint was over. TB had the majority of its routes away from the garage but it was commonplace to see buses on the 119, 126, 138, 146 and 227 all running back home in service. No doubt TfL think such instances would be 'confusing' for its 'customers' as it did with via points and suffix routes. Incidentally is it known what the furthest distance a route terminates away from its home garage it doesn't call at in normal service? I would've thought that until recently 202's running dead back to C from Blackheath was a fair distance until Arriva won the route. I think the longest dead run has to have the 66 as a contender, 18.1 miles from Grays garage to Leytonstone station running via the A13 to Beckton, A406 to Redbridge and then line of route to Leytonstone, funnily enough this dead run also takes the route past DX. The shortest distance from GY to Romford Station is still 11 miles long which dwarfs the 5.8 miles the 202 had from C to Crystal Palace. However sticking with C, if you include a dead run all the way from Heathrow then it's 23 miles which is one of the longest I could find on route X26, however if you only include closest termini then the X26 is very close to its Croydon end. It may be 18 miles to leytonstone, but it if you are looking at cost, you need to work it out by mpg, as it would take a dead run on the roads the 66 less fuel, than say a 158 running to Stratford from Edmonton if going on roads via Leyton etc.
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Post by galwhv69 on Dec 31, 2020 19:09:33 GMT
Does anyone know if the 969 is running tomorrow? I know that the network is on a Sunday service whilst it's not a Sunday, and usually routes like the 969/507/X68 run to a special or weekday service.
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Post by kmkcheng on Dec 31, 2020 20:00:53 GMT
Does anyone know if the 969 is running tomorrow? I know that the network is on a Sunday service whilst it's not a Sunday, and usually routes like the 969/507/X68 run to a special or weekday service. I think it’s not running. It only runs on Good Friday and not any other public holidays
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Post by rugbyref on Jan 2, 2021 12:24:59 GMT
Presumably the maximum passenger figures include PCSOs? This morning on an 11 capacity vehicle there were 3 PCSOs. Almost 30%!
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2021 20:45:16 GMT
Hi all,
Quick question if anyone can help please! on LVF can you search by day for buses allocated to a route say for example route 115 on 1/1/21. I know you can do a history search of buses used on a route by I am looking for a days allocation.
Thanks
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Post by redexpress on Jan 10, 2021 21:20:21 GMT
Hi all,
Quick question if anyone can help please! on LVF can you search by day for buses allocated to a route say for example route 115 on 1/1/21. I know you can do a history search of buses used on a route by I am looking for a days allocation.
Thanks
Yes - for your example you would enter "history 115 01-01-2021" (without the quotes).
Bear in mind that will also give you buses from the previous day that were still in service beyond midnight.
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Post by YY13VKP on Jan 10, 2021 21:22:41 GMT
Hi all,
Quick question if anyone can help please! on LVF can you search by day for buses allocated to a route say for example route 115 on 1/1/21. I know you can do a history search of buses used on a route by I am looking for a days allocation.
Thanks
Yes - for your example you would enter "history 115 01-01-2021" (without the quotes).
Bear in mind that will also give you buses from the previous day that were still in service beyond midnight. You can also search the history for a day’s allocation as far back as 2012 by replacing “history” with “Fullhist”
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2021 21:29:29 GMT
Hi all,
Quick question if anyone can help please! on LVF can you search by day for buses allocated to a route say for example route 115 on 1/1/21. I know you can do a history search of buses used on a route by I am looking for a days allocation.
Thanks
Yes - for your example you would enter "history 115 01-01-2021" (without the quotes).
Bear in mind that will also give you buses from the previous day that were still in service beyond midnight. Thank you so much
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Post by rugbyref on Jan 13, 2021 14:38:03 GMT
Our 91 year old friend who lives in Halstead, Kent, has just been offered her Covid jab at the Excel centre. For a laugh, and I got one, I plugged this trip into the tfl journey planner. I input 9AM start time, so that she could use her freedom pass for part of the journey.
Do you think she should take either of these options?
1. Cycle for 2 hours 32 minutes. 2. Wait until 7.54 the following morning, use 4 separate buses to get to Sevenoaks Station, then South Eastern to LBR, Jubilee line, then DLR for a journey time of 2 hours 13 minutes.
Or perhaps wait and get her jab at the local GP?
But what idiot programmes the tfl journey planner?
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Post by vjaska on Jan 13, 2021 15:17:00 GMT
Our 91 year old friend who lives in Halstead, Kent, has just been offered her Covid jab at the Excel centre. For a laugh, and I got one, I plugged this trip into the tfl journey planner. I input 9AM start time, so that she could use her freedom pass for part of the journey. Do you think she should take either of these options? 1. Cycle for 2 hours 32 minutes. 2. Wait until 7.54 the following morning, use 4 separate buses to get to Sevenoaks Station, then South Eastern to LBR, Jubilee line, then DLR for a journey time of 2 hours 13 minutes. Or perhaps wait and get her jab at the local GP? But what idiot programmes the tfl journey planner? The TfL journey planner has always been poor, I'd rather google search other planners or use Google Maps own direction planner.
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