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Post by SILENCED on Sept 5, 2018 17:36:45 GMT
My journey to work currently means getting the third bus of the day on the 386 towards Blackheath Village. The driver this week has run 2 minutes early every day so far this week. Whilst 2 minutes early is acceptable to TfL to allow for varying traffic conditions I find his attitude annoying. Early morning passengers want to get to work not miss an early running bus. Get to the bus stop 2 minutes earlier them ... solution seems simple |
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Post by sid on Sept 5, 2018 17:58:32 GMT
My journey to work currently means getting the third bus of the day on the 386 towards Blackheath Village. The driver this week has run 2 minutes early every day so far this week. Whilst 2 minutes early is acceptable to TfL to allow for varying traffic conditions I find his attitude annoying. Early morning passengers want to get to work not miss an early running bus. Get to the bus stop 2 minutes earlier them ... solution seems simple Are you serious? Intending passengers should get there before the advertised time just in case the driver decides to run early? With that sort of attitude is it any wonder bus usage is in steady decline? |
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Post by redbus on Sept 5, 2018 18:27:04 GMT
I am clearly in a minority here, but if I am going for a bus at a particular time, I always try to arrive a couple of minutes early (if possible), in case the bus is early. There's always the possibility of a couple of minutes difference between the clock the bus driver sees and the clock I am looking at. Nowadays I can make the timing closer thanks to iBus, so that's a definite improvement.
Having said the above I expect the bus driver to run to time and not be early.
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Post by 15002 on Sept 5, 2018 18:31:04 GMT
I am clearly in a minority here, but if I am going for a bus at a particular time, I always try to arrive a couple of minutes early (if possible), in case the bus is early. There's always the possibility of a couple of minutes difference between the clock the bus driver sees and the clock I am looking at. Nowadays I can make the timing closer thanks to iBus, so that's a definite improvement. Having said the above I expect the bus driver to run to time and not be early. I do that too, I’ve always liked to be early to places in general but I don’t think it’s fair that passengers are forced to leave early for the sake of a bus coming earlier than expected otherwise the timetable becomes obsolete imo, especially on lower frequency routes. |
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Post by redbus on Sept 5, 2018 18:34:03 GMT
Took the 13 this afternoon heading out the West End. I had just missed a 13, but there was another one a minute or two behind. Driver drove normally (no dawdling) to Alpha Close for a live changeover. As we arrived at Alpha Close there were two 13 buses already at the stop with their hazard lights on, presumably waiting for a live changeover, making us the third. As we arrived at the stop the first bus left, the passengers on the second were asked to leave to join my bus. Clearly something had happened to the second bus, perhaps no driver. We had our driver change and left.
My obvious observation is that three buses at the same stop at the same time (leaving aside the question of live changeovers) isn't going to provide a good service, no wonder the 13 has the poor reputation it has these days.    |
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Post by sid on Sept 5, 2018 18:54:11 GMT
I am clearly in a minority here, but if I am going for a bus at a particular time, I always try to arrive a couple of minutes early (if possible), in case the bus is early. There's always the possibility of a couple of minutes difference between the clock the bus driver sees and the clock I am looking at. Nowadays I can make the timing closer thanks to iBus, so that's a definite improvement. Having said the above I expect the bus driver to run to time and not be early. So would I normally but intending passengers should be able to roll up at the last minute and not find the bus has already been and gone. |
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Post by cl54 on Sept 5, 2018 19:08:08 GMT
My journey to work currently means getting the third bus of the day on the 386 towards Blackheath Village. The driver this week has run 2 minutes early every day so far this week. Whilst 2 minutes early is acceptable to TfL to allow for varying traffic conditions I find his attitude annoying. Early morning passengers want to get to work not miss an early running bus. Get to the bus stop 2 minutes earlier them ... solution seems simple You'll go far in customer service. Fortunately even at 64 I'm fit enough to run the last 100 yards and can hear an Enviro 200 engine in the distance. Why not let the driver determine the departure time on all routes? |
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Post by DT 11 on Sept 5, 2018 19:48:47 GMT
My journey to work currently means getting the third bus of the day on the 386 towards Blackheath Village. The driver this week has run 2 minutes early every day so far this week. Whilst 2 minutes early is acceptable to TfL to allow for varying traffic conditions I find his attitude annoying. Early morning passengers want to get to work not miss an early running bus. Get to the bus stop 2 minutes earlier them ... solution seems simple That is harsh. People shouldn’t have to arrive at the stop earlier at all. If the time is advertised on a low frequency route they expect it there at that time. Having done all the low frequency routes at DT sometimes waiting for a few minutes does make a difference and people do turn up and board whilst waiting at common key stops. I was told when starting to at least run 1-2 minutes late, running early your leaving people behind. On a high frequency route it is very different and the whole service can run early or late providing the headway is maintained, if a route with live changeovers needs to run on time as well as the headway. First buses a lot of people generally travel to make other connections so expect it to be on time and not early. I’m sure you wouldn’t be saying this if the last bus left 2 minutes early and left you to go take a Cab instead. |
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Post by busaholic on Sept 5, 2018 20:57:47 GMT
Get to the bus stop 2 minutes earlier them ... solution seems simple That is harsh. People shouldn’t have to arrive at the stop earlier at all. If the time is advertised on a low frequency route they expect it there at that time. Having done all the low frequency routes at DT sometimes waiting for a few minutes does make a difference and people do turn up and board whilst waiting at common key stops. I was told when starting to at least run 1-2 minutes late, running early your leaving people behind. On a high frequency route it is very different and the whole service can run early or late providing the headway is maintained, if a route with live changeovers needs to run on time as well as the headway. First buses a lot of people generally travel to make other connections so expect it to be on time and not early. I’m sure you wouldn’t be saying this if the last bus left 2 minutes early and left you to go take a Cab instead. Seeing your connection with the 160, I'll mention my experience with that route as a schoolboy, travelling from Westmount Road in Eltham, its old routeing, to Catford, as I did it for seven years. The peak buses were every ten minutes, came along pretty full but, unless there'd been a gap, didn't usually go sailing past. The crews were mostly of more mature years, but there was one regular crew who didn't fit this stereotype. I called the driver Elvis Presley, because he clearly modelled his style on the then-extraordinarily -popular singer. His clippie, young 20s I would say, positioned herself on the front nearside seat from where she could exchange amatory glances with the driver. Their aim was never to pick up passengers, as they always ran seven or eight minutes early, one stop behind the bus in front. On the rare occasion when I got on their bus (they only ever seemed to do the a.m. and not the p.m. peak), as it was near if not completely empty, I always went to a front seat upstairs in the knowledge that eventually the clippie would have to stir herself to come and check my bus pass. They were the only crew who regularly did this, and, as I always monitored the service going the other way towards Welling, I always knew which bus was theirs: needless to say, they never passed the bus ahead of them. I think I indirectly put paid to their jinx, though, as one of my school friends with no interest in buses himself had a father who was the inspector at Well Hall Station in Eltham, an important bus terminal then . I got my friend to mention the situation to his father, and for a while after that down at Eltham Green/Yorkshire Grey most days at school times a very prominent roving inspector's Anglia van with a huge LT roundel on top was stationed. I never saw that crew again!  |
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Post by snoggle on Sept 5, 2018 22:47:43 GMT
I am clearly in a minority here, but if I am going for a bus at a particular time, I always try to arrive a couple of minutes early (if possible), in case the bus is early. There's always the possibility of a couple of minutes difference between the clock the bus driver sees and the clock I am looking at. Nowadays I can make the timing closer thanks to iBus, so that's a definite improvement. Having said the above I expect the bus driver to run to time and not be early. I would broadly agree with you for services in the peak or daytimes when many services are frequent enough. However early and late or on low frequency routes people should be able to rely on the timetable and buses should not be running early. As someone else has said people going to work may have finely tuned schedules to get up, ready and out of the door and then they have other connections to get them to work on time. Although the numbers travelling may be lower it's even more critical at weekends where headways are understandably much wider and connections even more critical because intervals on those services are also wider. I know my schedule for getting to work was always pretty finely tuned even in the days before Countdown because headways were wider and, back then, the 212 / 275 and 123 all turned up within 3 mins of each other with a 20 min wait for the next bus. In that case poor timetables and wide headways were not helpful. The converse is also true for people trying to get home - who wants to be stuck waiting 20-30 mins for the final bus home because it ran early? No one. On other occasions that first bus may be the start of a long line of connections that take you across the world. While no one in their right mind cuts things down to 1-2 mins leeway on such a trip it's all too easy for things to go astray at the start and you end up with a mad dash through the airport to reach your plane. The final point in all of this is that TfL's evident "hopper ticket" obsession makes connections and aligned headways ever more important. There is very little sign of any understanding of this in their emerging proposals which force people to change buses or use a rail based mode. It's fine in theory if buses are every few minutes but when you are alighting from a low frequency service to try to catch another one when, in the past, you had a through bus you are not going to be best pleased to see your connecting bus rolling off into the distance because drivers were not keeping to time nor had the wit to wait for the connection to be made. I fear TfL are creating a rod for their own back with their desire to smash routes to pieces and they are not properly considering the consequences for passengers including passenger safety and security, ease of interchange, information at the interchange point and also on bus itself. It will only take one or two assualts or vulnerable people being left stranded for their lack of consideration of these issues to turn toxic. |
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Post by snoggle on Sept 5, 2018 22:50:10 GMT
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Post by met120 on Sept 6, 2018 17:26:36 GMT
My journey to work currently means getting the third bus of the day on the 386 towards Blackheath Village. The driver this week has run 2 minutes early every day so far this week. Whilst 2 minutes early is acceptable to TfL to allow for varying traffic conditions I find his attitude annoying. Early morning passengers want to get to work not miss an early running bus. And there is probably a good chance the driver departed early from the beginning  I have a similar issue with Metroline on the 120 in the evenings when the route is every 15 minutes. Leaving the first stop early should just not happen, we passengers don't care if the timetable is too tight further down the route. On Saturday the 2305 from Northolt departed 3 minutes early, which is bad enough, but when his leader was 3 minutes late at the time (and continued to lose time). Luckily the guy got regulated for 2 minutes and then lost another minute, so I didn't miss the bus at Southall Station as it was on time. Even earlier in the day many of the drivers seem to depart whenever they want, although as it is a high frequency route I can live with it around that time. London United drivers almost never departed more than a few seconds early. LU were just as bad in my opinion. At least with metroline there’s a guarantee your bus will show up. |
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Post by redbus on Sept 6, 2018 17:46:51 GMT
And there is probably a good chance the driver departed early from the beginning I have a similar issue with Metroline on the 120 in the evenings when the route is every 15 minutes. Leaving the first stop early should just not happen, we passengers don't care if the timetable is too tight further down the route. On Saturday the 2305 from Northolt departed 3 minutes early, which is bad enough, but when his leader was 3 minutes late at the time (and continued to lose time). Luckily the guy got regulated for 2 minutes and then lost another minute, so I didn't miss the bus at Southall Station as it was on time. Even earlier in the day many of the drivers seem to depart whenever they want, although as it is a high frequency route I can live with it around that time. London United drivers almost never departed more than a few seconds early. LU were just as bad in my opinion. At least with metroline there’s a guarantee your bus will show up. I agree LU were just as bad. As you mention Metroline, I do feel a little let down by them, their early morning service on the 46 has not been stellar. In two of the last five weeks the timetabled bus I was expecting has failed to turn up. Not sure why as normally they are pretty good, perhaps troubles with the bus. |
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Post by DT 11 on Sept 6, 2018 20:51:43 GMT
So today I did another day on the 428s. In general it was quiet most of the day other than rush hour. Twice during the day left Bluewater with probably 1 or 2 people as most people now wait for the 96. On one particular trip traffic was building up on Watling Street and when arriving at Bluewater I still had 1 passenger left, she came up to me and said "Why don't you use that Bus Lane it's taken 12 minutes longer to get here". So I said the 428 isn't allowed to use the Fastrack Lanes, the 96 is the only red bus that can use it, the 96 was re-routed to serve Darent Valley Hospital in December 2017 using the Fasttrack Lane. She then asked me about the 428 & 492 no longer going to Bluewater. So I said the 428 will no longer be coming here from 2019 anyways so they won't send it through the Fasttrack, it will run from Erith - Crayford and mentioned an online petition. So I said online petitions won't stop anything from going ahead because Kent County Council is not a London Borough.
Overall if the 492 did become reality. Would make sense to run the 428 between Erith - Dartford from Crayford via the Station Road, Chastillion Road, Princes Road & Shepherds Lane.
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Post by busaholic on Sept 6, 2018 21:06:06 GMT
They were the only crew who regularly did this, and, as I always monitored the service going the other way towards Welling, I always knew which bus was theirs: needless to say, they never passed the bus ahead of them. I think I indirectly put paid to their jinx, though, as one of my school friends with no interest in buses himself had a father who was the inspector at Well Hall Station in Eltham, an important bus terminal then . I got my friend to mention the situation to his father, and for a while after that down at Eltham Green/Yorkshire Grey most days at school times a very prominent roving inspector's Anglia van with a huge LT roundel on top was stationed. I never saw that crew again!    Great story. Thank you. Quick postscript - while I never came across the crew again (I suspect the clippie left 'to pursue other interests') the driver got paired with an older, no-nonsense conductor, I seem to remember, one who controlled exactly when his bus left any given stop. Crews who ran perennially early were most unpopular at their garages because it meant extra work/ fares to collect for the following bus, in the days before bus passes (other than for scholars) and bonuses or other incentives. I believe the driver lasted until the 36b became not only Catford's last crew (Routemaster) route but Selkent's last non-opo route, way before any of the other companies entirely lost crew routes. |
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