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Post by sp17 on Aug 2, 2024 22:32:30 GMT
He’s saying what everyone else is thinking but won’t say. Do you think experienced engineering managers really believe electric buses are the future? This isn’t the same as switching from coal to diesel, there’s so many problems with electrics that no one would dare admit. Not being paid is also unprofessional; it’s a breach and causes distrust and a loss of respect. TfL clearly have no money but the son of a bus driver is insistent that every tender needs new buses, it’s ridiculous. Why are Volvo B9s with a shelf life of 20 years being withdrawn at 7 years old. Why are 2016 deckers leaving London? It’s all a joke really. Suited to the big corps who just shut up and play ball. What was the last low floor bus to make 20 years service on TfL routes in London? That’s my point; they aren’t being used as long as they could. |
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Post by overgroundcommuter on Aug 2, 2024 22:33:38 GMT
Uno are operating an emergency service on the 298 tomorrow during the day with the last bus from Arnos Grove at 1800. They mention that they're arranging staff cover for Sunday.
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Post by DT 11 on Aug 2, 2024 22:34:12 GMT
They are working their *ss off right now, in communication with UNO, Arriva, Stagecoach and GAL all at one. Has lead to some miscommunication here and there but they are pulling their weight. A statement is being written up right now at this time of day Contact was made prior to the announcement, this isn’t as last minute as it seems. It is still very short notice though. |
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Post by atb123 on Aug 2, 2024 22:36:53 GMT
So far we have: Route 549 to Stagecoach London | Garage: TBC Route W9 to Stagecoach London | Garage: TBC Route 299 to Go-Ahead London | Garage: NP Route 399 to Go-Ahead London | Garage: NP Route 389 to Go-Ahead London | Garage: NP Route 217 to Arriva London | Garage: AR - Using ex-W3 Enviro 400s. Route 298 to UNO | Garage: HF Route 327 TBC and School routes TBC. Best place for both 549 and W9 would b Walthamstow Avenue not too far from either of its terminuses |
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Post by vjaska on Aug 2, 2024 22:40:53 GMT
What was the last low floor bus to make 20 years service on TfL routes in London? That’s my point; they aren’t being used as long as they could. I’m aware of your point and I actually agree with it (it’s something I’ve said for years) but that particular aspect isn’t something that’s started under Khan - it happened under Boris and Ken too - remember the early low floor single deckers that didn’t make 10 years old? |
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Post by VMH2537 on Aug 2, 2024 22:41:59 GMT
Sullivan proving how useless they are with only E48 and E50 on the 217 bunching each other at exactly 23:40 in the evening. Meanwhile only DS54 is the only bus tracking on the 298. The plug has been pulled. What an ending for a cowboy operator!
Edit: It's 00:10 E48 and E50 are continuing the art piece.
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Post by vjaska on Aug 2, 2024 22:47:53 GMT
Sullivan proving how useless they are with only E48 and E50 on the 217 bunching each other at exactly 23:40 in the evening. Meanwhile only DS54 is the only bus tracking on the 298. The plug has been pulled. What an ending for a cowboy operator! You have every right to feel aggrieved by them and even celebrate them going but I’m afraid you’re seriously wrong if you think they’re a cowboy operator. There has been no such thing in London for the last 15+ years and even then, it’s only the TfL side of the business that’s been struggling as the provincial side & railway replacement sides have carried on without little issue. |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 2, 2024 22:56:30 GMT
This is big. Who will take on the routes at such short notice? "Back in the day" Blue Triangle would probably have been parachuted in, along with First Capital to take over the routes. As it's School Holiday time, perhaps Uno could step in to assist. I have to say, whilst its sad to see an operator leave London, Sullivans haven't exactly covered themselves in glory in recent times in terms of service delivery, vehicle presentation etc. Not all of that is TfLs fault. I agree, but I cannot blame Sullivans entirely. A lot of it is down to TfL and the buck ends with Khan and his political games. The pinch has been felt by large operators also, hence routes being thrown back, lack of bids for many routes. Also operators not bothering to bid for routes they already operate when it comes to tender renewal. Around 10+ years ago TfL were bringing back the style of London Transport from the 80's with vehicles looking excellent that put many of the large operators to shame. Now it is the complete opposite. They cannot get the staff or pay the wages as other companies. A lot of backroom staff has left the industry as well as drivers going into HGV and other high profile delivery click & collect companies. It was a matter of when this was going to happen as I expected it in June. |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 2, 2024 22:57:21 GMT
Wonder if there was an contingency plan discussed or in motion from TfL side for others to pick up work at such short notice? Seems this was on cards for an while? I am not familiar with Sullivans work on the TfL side. Strikes me as strange to make comments that they “were an unwelcome partner”. They couldn’t meet the low costs unlike other operators that ate going through simular motions? In short effectively pushed out. 😕 There was contingency plans shhhh....  |
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Post by VMH2537 on Aug 2, 2024 22:59:46 GMT
AE23 should be the last operating bus on the W9 under Sullivan
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Post by Red Dragon on Aug 2, 2024 23:13:46 GMT
Sullivan proving how useless they are with only E48 and E50 on the 217 bunching each other at exactly 23:40 in the evening. Meanwhile only DS54 is the only bus tracking on the 298. The plug has been pulled. What an ending for a cowboy operator! Looks like the last 298 each way won't run tonight. At least a DS will be doing the service - a very interesting vehicle type which you'd never have expected to end up on the 298. The 217 situation is very disappointing, but fits in with the way the operation has been run recently. As for the 299, it looks like AE15 is doing the honours on the last run from Cockfosters, and running on time! |
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Post by VWH1419 on Aug 2, 2024 23:19:07 GMT
Wonder if there was an contingency plan discussed or in motion from TfL side for others to pick up work at such short notice? Seems this was on cards for an while? I am not familiar with Sullivans work on the TfL side. Strikes me as strange to make comments that they “were an unwelcome partner”. They couldn’t meet the low costs unlike other operators that ate going through simular motions? In short effectively pushed out. 😕 There was contingency plans shhhh.... Well, it does look pretty awful on both sides and was also before Sullivan put out their own announcement to lessen the blow caused to passengers. Cheapness (contract wise and poor payout timescales) and TfL culture ruined things here for sure.  |
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Post by ThinLizzy on Aug 2, 2024 23:19:24 GMT
I do wonder at what point TfL say "no sorry, that's enough- we're terminating your contracts for failure to deliver" Looks like that point was today!! (Well sort of, but one could infer it was Sullivan jumping before they were pushed) What a mad day in TfL world today. First the entire Circle Line and western District Line goes down due to a catastrophic signal system failure at probably the biggest junction of the sub surface tube network, then a whole London operator goes down! While I’m absolutely shocked that Sullivan’s cessation happened so suddenly, we all knew they were slowing winding down TfL work. I suspect the biggest disruption will be the 217, a really key and busy artery route where passengers really will feel the squeeze if it doesn’t run. The 231 and 317 will get hammered tomorrow, but at least all of its stops are covered by other routes so passengers will be able to work around it, with a bit of patience. I guess we’ll never know what caused this dramatic breakdown of TfL/Sullivan’s relations, but looks like it’s a case of ‘six of one, half a dozen of the other’. In Sullivan’s case they were owed £200k of money TfL had to contractually pay to them. Having said that, £200k really is chump change to TfL who run a network and budgets of billions and billions, so I wonder if it’s a case of TfL begrudgingly putting off paying Sullivan’s this money rather than them not being able to afford it. In TfL’s point of view they might think ‘if the services aren’t being run to an acceptable standard, and the vehicles look like they’re fit for the scrap heap, not to mention treating us with general contempt, then why should we be dealing with Sullivan’s proactively and amicably’ It’s a shame all of this had to end so explosively and in such bitter terms. In complete contrast to First who were very careful to exit the TfL market on good terms, and even CT Plus who still managed to communicate with TfL and get arrangements in place for Stagecoach to take over the company. I have to say though, the very blunt notice saying the depot is now closed does give a bit of an indictment as to how the company was being ran, and could say something about the general management TfL certainly does have some mad days. To be fair, it's been a bit of a mad week, what with major issues on the Elizabeth Line as well. We'll never know the full story with what has happened between TfL and Sullivans, however, I do feel there's more to it. As we've seen over the years, there has been a certain pattern that every company that has "folded" or "left" the TfL network has followed- Harris Bus, Mitcham Belle, and others all grew to a point where they became unmanageable and to detriment of the quality of service provided. With all the companies, there was a loss of focus on the basics and failing to deal with the basics will ultimately lead to the failure of a business. Outside of transport, the same could be said for Wilko and Debenhams. Back in the day, Sullivans were a decent operator- I had many dealings with the company working with them, and on a two occasions for them, on Rail Replacement contracts in the early 00s before I joined the railways. I've said on many occasions, there was a real pride in the operation. Even when they had an old fleet of Titans, everything was turned out smartly, the drivers were smart and there was a certain standard expected from those who were employed by the company. I'd go as far to say that the 217 and W9 were probably a step too far for the LT side of the business, which ultimately lead to the small business becoming unmanageable. There's also a screenshot of a very blunt text message to a Sullivans driver on the CBW Facebook Page- I really hope the drivers who have been affected can find employment soon. |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 2, 2024 23:26:25 GMT
All the TfL routes have now been removed from the Sullivan website Wow, they really are making a statement  |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 2, 2024 23:28:46 GMT
I was always taught in business to never burn bridges with major customers. Whether or not Sullivans were hard done by TfL, I have no insight. But to cease operations at such short notice and publicly air grievances whilst simultaneously offering such a poor service on existing routes is not a good look. Even if TfL did offer opportunities for SMEs to win business, the way Sullivans have thrown their toys out of the pram makes it very difficult for TfL to ever work with them again. Surely if the economics were not right, Sullivans had the option to hand back the contracts and put their TfL work up for early as many other operators have done recently? Hopefully other operators are found for the remaining uncovered routes in time for tomorrow. Passengers deserve better. I do not think they would want to and I do not blame them. There are a lot of things going wrong within TfL behind the scenes that people just do not know about. It all started after Leon Daniels left. |
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