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Post by VPL630 on Sept 4, 2012 18:38:22 GMT
I thought this would happen I wonder how long things will be on ice for until the franchise is sorted out? I know Virgin are upset for missing out by a couple of billion on the bid - they claim First over-bid and won't be able to deliver the service for the duration of the franchise.... saying that, First are selling off bus operations around the country (I know stuff in Devon went, as well as NPK : , and apparently they issued a profit warning earlier in the year.... hmmm... doesn't sound too promising. I guess we'll wait and see... I never knew 160,000 signed a petition to keep things as they are 1 of them was me
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2012 18:45:04 GMT
I thought this would happen I wonder how long things will be on ice for until the franchise is sorted out? I know Virgin are upset for missing out by a couple of billion on the bid - they claim First over-bid and won't be able to deliver the service for the duration of the franchise.... saying that, First are selling off bus operations around the country (I know stuff in Devon went, as well as NPK : , and apparently they issued a profit warning earlier in the year.... hmmm... doesn't sound too promising. I guess we'll wait and see... I never knew 160,000 signed a petition to keep things as they are 1 of them was me Even though I have read countless reports and used Virgin rail services a handful of times, I cannot see what the issue is? Unless there is concrete proof that there is an utright problem I can only see it that a case of toys being thrown out the pram because Virgin havent got their way!
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Post by vjaska on Sept 4, 2012 20:46:31 GMT
1 of them was me Even though I have read countless reports and used Virgin rail services a handful of times, I cannot see what the issue is? Unless there is concrete proof that there is an utright problem I can only see it that a case of toys being thrown out the pram because Virgin havent got their way! The problem is that time and time again, a operator who has made a success of the contract it was on has then lost out due to money rather than who benefits the passengers that actually use the service. Virgin should be allowed to continue with the contract for the excellent performance they have done on the WCM line. Since they took it on, passenger numbers have soared. The same thing happened when Sullivan Buses were first in the TfL market. They lost a route to Metroline despite the fact it was one of the best performing routes in London at the time. This sort of thing should be rewarded.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2012 21:30:52 GMT
Even though I have read countless reports and used Virgin rail services a handful of times, I cannot see what the issue is? Unless there is concrete proof that there is an utright problem I can only see it that a case of toys being thrown out the pram because Virgin havent got their way! The problem is that time and time again, a operator who has made a success of the contract it was on has then lost out due to money rather than who benefits the passengers that actually use the service. Virgin should be allowed to continue with the contract for the excellent performance they have done on the WCM line. Since they took it on, passenger numbers have soared. The same thing happened when Sullivan Buses were first in the TfL market. They lost a route to Metroline despite the fact it was one of the best performing routes in London at the time. This sort of thing should be rewarded. The wider attitude in transport provision has become who can do everything at the least expense - usually resulting in the least quality. First Capital Connect is one of the most awful train services I've ever had the displeasure of using and I often hear negative comments about their provision of regional bus services. Of course times are tough in terms of the economy and funding for public services but the first targets when money is short shouldn't be the things that work best - otherwise you're cutting away the good to save the rot...
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2012 22:17:26 GMT
Even though I have read countless reports and used Virgin rail services a handful of times, I cannot see what the issue is? Unless there is concrete proof that there is an utright problem I can only see it that a case of toys being thrown out the pram because Virgin havent got their way! The problem is that time and time again, a operator who has made a success of the contract it was on has then lost out due to money rather than who benefits the passengers that actually use the service. Virgin should be allowed to continue with the contract for the excellent performance they have done on the WCM line. Since they took it on, passenger numbers have soared. The same thing happened when Sullivan Buses were first in the TfL market. They lost a route to Metroline despite the fact it was one of the best performing routes in London at the time. This sort of thing should be rewarded. How do you measure success? Virgin have one of the highest number of complaints .... so should they be allowed to continue ... Mt bearded man or not?
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Post by vjaska on Sept 4, 2012 23:14:43 GMT
The problem is that time and time again, a operator who has made a success of the contract it was on has then lost out due to money rather than who benefits the passengers that actually use the service. Virgin should be allowed to continue with the contract for the excellent performance they have done on the WCM line. Since they took it on, passenger numbers have soared. The same thing happened when Sullivan Buses were first in the TfL market. They lost a route to Metroline despite the fact it was one of the best performing routes in London at the time. This sort of thing should be rewarded. How do you measure success? Virgin have one of the highest number of complaints .... so should they be allowed to continue ... Mt bearded man or not? So do First and judging by the comments from others on here (I've only seen the state of the trains myself), they can't even run the services they currently run elsewhere. So why should First have it then? 160,000 people must think Virgin do a good job. Although unrelated, First leave a lot to be desired about with their bus operations outside London as well.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2012 23:32:03 GMT
How do you measure success? Virgin have one of the highest number of complaints .... so should they be allowed to continue ... Mt bearded man or not? So do First and judging by the comments from others on here (I've only seen the state of the trains myself), they can't even run the services they currently run elsewhere. So why should First have it then? 160,000 people must think Virgin do a good job. Although unrelated, First leave a lot to be desired about with their bus operations outside London as well. Vj ... I am up in the Halifax/Huddersfield area ... First are the main company up here ... and I have to say I have been pretty impressed.
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Post by vjaska on Sept 5, 2012 0:53:59 GMT
So do First and judging by the comments from others on here (I've only seen the state of the trains myself), they can't even run the services they currently run elsewhere. So why should First have it then? 160,000 people must think Virgin do a good job. Although unrelated, First leave a lot to be desired about with their bus operations outside London as well. Vj ... I am up in the Halifax/Huddersfield area ... First are the main company up here ... and I have to say I have been pretty impressed. I have a mate who lives in the Huddersfield/Leeds area and he ain't impressed with them. He isn't the first person either to tell me that First outside London are poor. I've been told First in Scotland are awful as well.
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Post by VPL630 on Sept 5, 2012 19:27:46 GMT
Vj ... I am up in the Halifax/Huddersfield area ... First are the main company up here ... and I have to say I have been pretty impressed. I have a mate who lives in the Huddersfield/Leeds area and he ain't impressed with them. He isn't the first person either to tell me that First outside London are poor. I've been told First in Scotland are awful as well. First Essex are quite good, except Basildon Well Mainly Basildon Depot and Chelmsford Depot are ok, Southend has to be the best
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Post by joefrombow on Sept 5, 2012 23:20:01 GMT
I have a mate who lives in the Huddersfield/Leeds area and he ain't impressed with them. He isn't the first person either to tell me that First outside London are poor. I've been told First in Scotland are awful as well. First Essex are quite good, except Basildon Well Mainly Basildon Depot and Chelmsford Depot are ok, Southend has to be the best Hadleigh* I find them a good operator aswell drivers are always pleasant and welcoming most of the time alot of London drivers could learn a lesson or two, however train operation is a totally different kettle of fish I personally think the Virgin Trains experience is a brilliant compared with the Great Western I do think too Virgin should keep the franchise.
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Post by IanF on Sept 6, 2012 0:48:46 GMT
Capital connect services are a joke though if the trains via London Bridge are ever on time it would be classed as an odd observation
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Post by ajw on Sept 14, 2012 22:40:13 GMT
Time will tell how First West Coast will be, though I'm surprised they can walk away from Great Western, and just pick up another franchise just like that (and trouser £800mil in the process) - but that's our corrupt Tory Government for you They need to re-nationalise the railways - we spend 15% of our salaries on travelling to work by train, but this is on 35-year-old filthy rolling stock They haven't walked about from Great Western, what they did was not take up the optional extension. They are still in the bidding for the franchise.
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Post by ajw on Sept 14, 2012 22:46:17 GMT
It's interesting to read how many consider First Capital Connect to be representative of the way the company as a whole operates. Unless I am very much mistaken the issues with First Capital Connect relate to years of under investment by the government, not by First Capital Connect. The substandard service they provide is a direct result of this and the investment program that is now happening. As for the fleet unless I mistaken doesn't the Government (or more specifically DfT) allocate the vehicles etc, with the operator paying their leasing and maintenance fees as part of the contract?
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Post by john on Sept 16, 2012 13:05:22 GMT
It's interesting to read how many consider First Capital Connect to be representative of the way the company as a whole operates. Unless I am very much mistaken the issues with First Capital Connect relate to years of under investment by the government, not by First Capital Connect. The substandard service they provide is a direct result of this and the investment program that is now happening. As for the fleet unless I mistaken doesn't the Government (or more specifically DfT) allocate the vehicles etc, with the operator paying their leasing and maintenance fees as part of the contract? Pretty much, unless the operator feels that they can deal with the cost of upgrading the rolling stock themselves, as I believe was part of the case with the WCML?? It's part of the reason why people are calling for longer franchise agreements so that the TOC has more input into the operating of the line, such as investment of rolling stock etc.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2012 13:58:56 GMT
It's interesting to read how many consider First Capital Connect to be representative of the way the company as a whole operates. Unless I am very much mistaken the issues with First Capital Connect relate to years of under investment by the government, not by First Capital Connect. The substandard service they provide is a direct result of this and the investment program that is now happening. As for the fleet unless I mistaken doesn't the Government (or more specifically DfT) allocate the vehicles etc, with the operator paying their leasing and maintenance fees as part of the contract? Pretty much, unless the operator feels that they can deal with the cost of upgrading the rolling stock themselves, as I believe was part of the case with the WCML?? It's part of the reason why people are calling for longer franchise agreements so that the TOC has more input into the operating of the line, such as investment of rolling stock etc. Externally at FCC319 will be tatty, dirty, probably a bit of rust showing and generally unloved. Southern on the whole keep the 455 clean and presentable. Both these units of of a similar age and went through refurbs at roughly the same time ... so why should it be the case? Things definitely got worse when FCC took over and removed 319 maintenance from Selhurst ... I personally will be very disappointed if First retain FCC ... especially as it will then later control Southern services to
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