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Post by snowman on May 19, 2013 8:36:29 GMT
Dis agree with means tests for oap freedom passes. I don't see the problem with it. We means-test practically every other state benefit - why should we fund perks for wealthy pensioners? Silly idea. Why should a person who scrimps and saves for retirement be penalised because they have savings but a person who spends on cigarettes, booze & foreign holidays instead of saving get handouts. I save towards a pension because I consider it sensible so will effectively have assets the day I retire but it doesn't make me a millionaire who would decline the pass. Maybe 1% has big wealth and doesn't need it, but the admin of filtering them doesn't seem worth it. With oyster and ITSO would it be betterjust to give fixed amount say £1000 per year to use, any excess they have to top up themselves.
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Post by rambo on May 19, 2013 11:03:59 GMT
To take a feedom pass from a OAP because they have done well in life and saved for thier retirement is just another assult on people who have done well for themselves, IMO.
Where to make savings?
Free travel for kids mon-fri only, 6am-6pm. Abolish the half rate oyster, IME, very abused. Have a close look at the disabled freedom pass, alot of abuse with that. TFL's obbession with posters/stickers, etc etc, such as the 'what will you do' stickers on buses. Plus, i'm sure there are loads of other things.
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Post by snoggle on May 19, 2013 21:27:10 GMT
At a principle level I probably agree. Unfortunately the economic reality is that the London scheme is very lavish compared to elsewhere and will end up being unaffordable. Local authorities are being screwed into the ground while their responsibilities are being expanded (e.g. health prevention, ever expanding social care demands). Something has to give. At the moment the Mayor is simply stealing from the TfL budget to fund the 60+ pass, the Veterans Pass and to expand the Freedom Pass to 24 hour coverage. This cannot go on forever regardless of the political pressure and votes that are "in play" with the pensioner lobby. The situation outside London is far worse - the national concessionary scheme is under funded and is causing the removal of services from many areas because the mechanism is all wrong. Again LA funding cuts are just worsening the pressure. At some point a real crunch will arise where pensioners have passes but no services which is beyond daft. It is clear pensioners value the mobility the pass gives and that's fine. *However* there needs to be an informed debate with pensioners, local authorities, government and bus companies to explain what the heck is going wrong. It wouldn't be about blame, it would be working out a solution to the problem. I think some form of taxing these "universal" benefits is required as is a reform of the reimbursement mechanism for concessionary travel. I also think a small annual charge for the pass or a small notional fare would help improve the economics. This would not be popular with some pensioners but the real point is whether they want to keep their bus services and mobility or not. Nothing comes for free and bus operating costs are only ever going to go up. Snog ... another well reasoned post ... something has to give and those that lose out will not like it ....but a harsh decision needs to be made ... pensioners ...kids ... forces ... unemployed ... maybe it was fool harder giving the vote winning concessions in the first place!!!! So out of curiousity rambo ... where do you see the multi million pound savings being made ... I am assuming not off yours (and others) salary! I broadly support the child, student and income support / jobseeker concessions. You can easily frame these policies in good terms to support the current populist term of "hard working families". I know I am in a minority but I really do believe there is a long term policy benefit of encouraging children to become familiar with using public transport on a regular basis. We do actually need children to build confidence and independence and not be shuttled here and there in their parent's car. When I was a teenager I spent what pocket money I earned on a Travelticket. I think it drove my dad slightly mad but he did eventually see that my interest in transport and being independent (in part) got me my degree place and then subsequent jobs. Supporting people who are looking for work is also beneficial. I am going to be unpopular and say I am rather less supportive of things like the 24 hour Freedom Pass, the Veterans Pass and the 60+ Pass. These are London products and do cost tens of millions of pounds to fund and I question whether they are strictly necessary. I recognise they were political commitments from several Mayoral candidates in 2012 but I question whether they can be sustained on a medium to long term basis. The national concessionary pass is a valuable benefit. I've set out my concerns already. Unfortunately I can't see any national politician being brave enough to have a rational debate with the electorate about the problems. The Freedom Pass is also very valuable but I do think it faces problems in about 4-5 years time as some London Councils will demand changes in order to reduce their funding commitment. Lewisham Council have already trimmed entitlement for some disabled people in their borough.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2013 21:39:25 GMT
Interesting stats. Not a bad set of figures IMO - with London's geography providing bums on seats the provinces would kill for, London's bus network ought to pay for itself - of course loss-making journeys are needed in certain areas and at unsocial hours but these losses should be more than made up for by the generally profit making operation. A fall in subsidies is welcome and more work needs to be done to improve efficiency.
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