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Post by M1104 on Jan 16, 2014 14:45:57 GMT
WVL244 is a good bus, but it sounds different to the 607's VWs. No wheezing and it doesn't quite rev up to the full 2200rpm in 1st and 2nd at least. Thus I suspect the VWs will be marginally quicker. One must bear in mind however that if a bus (or vehicles in general for that matter) has an abundant amount of torque it can move faster at lower engine speeds.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2014 19:39:03 GMT
I Agree with you in regards to B7TL's that run on the 607. I was on board one going the opposite direction and it sounded great. I find these engines better suited to this body. The engines on the B7TL's that run on the 85 (E.g WVL60 - LF52ZPX) to me seem incredibly sluggish. Am I right to assume its a different engine all together? The ones on the 85 have had engine swaps as part of their refurbishment, the retrofitted units being the same engine block as before but with euro4 spec'd components and a 250 hp turbo, approx 14% increase over most of London's B7TLs (fitted with 215 hp turbos). However, AF's (and SW's) three speed Volvos seem to have a rather lazy ECU, their four speeders being a bit better. The engine, regardless of their power capabilities, will only do what the ECU settings dictate. The refurbished PVLs, especially the batch from A (r213) and Q (r45) perform a whole lot better. WVL244, the only GAL six speeder with both a good ECU setting and a 'proper' kickdown, would give the 607 Volvos a good run for their money. Ahh i see, thanks for explaining. Are the ECU settings set/dictated by the mechanics at the garage? Surely buses should be made to be as quick as possible for services?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2014 19:43:42 GMT
I Agree with you in regards to B7TL's that run on the 607. I was on board one going the opposite direction and it sounded great. I find these engines better suited to this body. The engines on the B7TL's that run on the 85 (E.g WVL60 - LF52ZPX) to me seem incredibly sluggish. Am I right to assume its a different engine all together? I've had some good rides on the 52 reg batch at AF on the 85 - maybe you were just unlucky in the examples you rode. Possibly. The only decent ones i have travelled on is the 05 Models 62 reg models and the occasional WHV on route.
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Post by VPL630 on Jan 16, 2014 19:56:27 GMT
The ones on the 85 have had engine swaps as part of their refurbishment, the retrofitted units being the same engine block as before but with euro4 spec'd components and a 250 hp turbo, approx 14% increase over most of London's B7TLs (fitted with 215 hp turbos). However, AF's (and SW's) three speed Volvos seem to have a rather lazy ECU, their four speeders being a bit better. The engine, regardless of their power capabilities, will only do what the ECU settings dictate. The refurbished PVLs, especially the batch from A (r213) and Q (r45) perform a whole lot better. WVL244, the only GAL six speeder with both a good ECU setting and a 'proper' kickdown, would give the 607 Volvos a good run for their money. Ahh i see, thanks for explaining. Are the ECU settings set/dictated by the mechanics at the garage? Surely buses should be made to be as quick as possible for services? Go-Ahead like to restrict there buses to save fuel, I wish buses were made to be as quick as possible but then I think there would be far more passenger complaints made
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Post by Ice Prxnce on Jan 16, 2014 20:13:21 GMT
Some of the Tridents on route 47 are really good and also have great kickdown. They're also really great to go on at night when there's less people aswell. I haven't particularly found my favourite Trident between 18481 and 18499 or 18455/18463/18464 but hope to soon.
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Post by M1104 on Jan 16, 2014 21:47:01 GMT
Some of the Tridents on route 47 are really good and also have great kickdown. They're also really great to go on at night when there's less people aswell. I haven't particularly found my favourite Trident between 18481 and 18499 or 18455/18463/18464 but hope to soon. I have noticed that since their refurbishments their 1st gear kickdown holds a bit longer. Beforehand they used to change earlier than their four speed versions.
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Post by Volvo on Jan 16, 2014 22:01:16 GMT
Stagecoach ZF euro 2 lwb tridents MAN E200s, Evolutions Euro 4 ZF E400s DB300s especially Firsts WNs
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Post by vjaska on Jan 16, 2014 22:27:24 GMT
Stagecoach ZF euro 2 lwb tridents MAN E200s, Evolutions Euro 4 ZF E400s DB300s especially Firsts WNs Speaking of Euro II ZF Tridents, the over revving Connex Y reg TA's & First Y reg Presidents had beasty kickdown.
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Post by M1104 on Jan 16, 2014 23:40:02 GMT
Ahh i see, thanks for explaining. Are the ECU settings set/dictated by the mechanics at the garage? Surely buses should be made to be as quick as possible for services? Go-Ahead like to restrict there buses to save fuel, I wish buses were made to be as quick as possible but then I think there would be far more passenger complaints made I tend to find that with Go Ahead the ECU settings vary a bit with some garages. For example, AL tend to allow a bit more performance in their Voith B7TLs in comparison to Stockwell, the main example being that Merton's 53 reg PVLs still have kickdown whereas Stockwells 53 reg WVLs were turned off within weeks after entering service back in 2003.
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Post by Volvo on Jan 17, 2014 20:10:11 GMT
Thats why I liked them, especially on the 56 at night time
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2014 8:35:23 GMT
Citaro's sound fantastic with kickdown, so do DAF DB250's, and Euro 3 Tridents. Euro 4 Enviro 400 Tridents sound wicked too.
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Post by smiler52 on Jan 19, 2014 16:22:52 GMT
I find stagecoach and Cardiff bus e300 transbus models have very good kickdown
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Post by capitalomnibus on Feb 12, 2015 1:52:42 GMT
VDL DB300 / Gemini 2 - DW401 Euro 4 E400 - DN33501 (Under First London) it's not as good now Go-Ahead have touched it... MAN 14.240/Enviro200 - 708 Euro 4 E200 - DML44074 DML44175 was a ferocious beast, it would hit the rev limiter, that bus just revved freely in every gear.
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