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Post by ServerKing on Sept 3, 2014 18:04:45 GMT
I think they were too hasty to get rid of them off the island, if this clip is anything to go by... www.liveleak.com/view?i=dc2_1409662194Driver's steering wheel comes OFF completely whilst in motion  What's Maltese for PG9 or MOT?  |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2015 10:01:58 GMT
I remember Malta's buses when they were like this. I've seen holes in the floor, people hanging out the back. Classic I miss those days ex London swifts, Bedford coaches etc
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Post by 6HP502C on Jan 29, 2015 23:38:56 GMT
I think some rigid Citaros are heading to Malta to go in service. I might get the chance to drive one as far as Genoa where it'll be taken forward by Italy based crew!
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Post by M1199 on Jun 27, 2015 21:03:13 GMT
I think some rigid Citaros are heading to Malta to go in service. I might get the chance to drive one as far as Genoa where it'll be taken forward by Italy based crew! I'm guessing you meant these Citaro's?  Unfortunately I didn't get to sample one. From what I saw of them, they were/are mainly allocated to the X* Airport routes, although, I did see a few pop up on the 12 late evening time. The 12 is a manic route, I can see why Arriva put the Bendies on it as I never saw an empty one, all were crush loaded right up to the drivers cab, spending an hour with a sweaty armpit in your face isn't the kind of thing you want whilst your on holiday!! Must of been an experience riding on a bendy though some of the tight turns en route. Only got to ride the King Long XMQ6127J's and the Volvo B7RLE(?) Wrightbus's, of which, most still had legals for Volvo in Warwickshire!. I preferred the King Longs, I thought they were quite interesting and had decent Air Con, whereas the Volvo's were boring and had naf Air Con. Also got to spend the day in Gozo riding around on former National Express DAF Van Hool Alizee Y322 HUA, which still had a 2010 Tax disk and its Cambridge bus permit in the front window. Still sounded good for a 15 yr old coach and the interior was immaculate! |
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2016 23:02:59 GMT
Just thought I'd update everyone on Malta happenings since this thread has been quiet for a while.
The leased Citaros are still in service despite originally only meant to be in the fleet for a year (though many are now looking somewhat battered after more than a year in service here, typical for Malta really) and are no longer mostly allocated to the airport routes The X routes now mostly see the 2011 King Longs (usually the XMQ6127Js but sometimes, during winter saw some XMQ6900J allocated also), instead the daily overloaded 13 (which was extended as far as the Splash n Fun waterpark to partly replace the axed 12) sees only Citaros while the 43, 44 and 45 see a number of Citaros alongside XMQ6127Js daily, usually. A number of other routes also see Citaros each day but the less frequent replacement to the 12, the 212 (Qawra to Silema (instead of Valletta as was the 12)) sees only XMQ6127Js.
The Citaros are excepted to remain for the summer, at least, possibly into 2017.
The leased WrightBus Volvos and Optare Solo SRs were returned to the UK during last summer following deliveries of dual door Otokar Vectio Cs during July to September, numbering 143 in total. A further order for 33 Otokars is expected to be completed by early summer, this time for 12 metre Kent Cs which are expected to be used to replace XMQ6127Js in Northern Malta to allow the permanent withdrawal of the remaining (and frankly hideous, IMHO) XMQ6113GMC King Longs and other non-standard former ATP buses still in use (the BUS4xx group, such as the SCARNIF bodied MANs etc). I'm lead to understand that the XMQ6113GMCs are particularly disliked by MPT's new owners hence they are being replaced somewhat earlier than the contract actually requires them to be.
All buses bar the 4xx and 5xx registered buses that are no longer in service are now in MPT revised livery of green and white but most are still lacking logos and fleetnames at least 5 months after repainting.
The Optare Solo hybrids are still in service (albeit looking pretty much life expired already in some cases, such has been the battering they've endured here) though I'm lead to understand also that these are not much liked by MPT's new owners either, so I would expect them to be replaced within the next couple of years although nothing has been annouced yet.
The company has now completed fleetwide installation of new ticketing, GPS and communications equipment, with the ticketing systems done first in July 2015 to usher in the new prepayment Tallinja bus card. The ticketing and GPS system is based on a solution from GMV, replacing the previous THETIS sourced system that Arriva had installed. The card has seen a much higher uptake than Arriva were ever able to manage with reportedly getting on for about the population now holding a card. The fare stucture was completely revised with the only cash fares available on bus being a €2 single ticket which allows unlimited (but conditional) changes within 2 hours (the fare reduces to €1.50 during winter). Tallinja fares for adults however are €0.75, also for 2 hours. So a clear incentive now exists to get and use a card. While tourists can theorically get one of these cards also, the hassle of having to apply several weeks in advance, supply passport numbers and passport style photos via a website and pay a processing fee will put many off. There exists also therefore a "tourist" Tallinja card which comes in two disposable non-recharageable flavours for adults - a week's worth of unlimited travel for €21 (this contrasts painfully with the €6.50 that was charged for a weekly ticket prior to July) or 12 single trips for €15.
The ex-Arriva King Longs have had CCTV upgrades during winter to bring them into line with the Citaros and Vectios in that MPT's contract with Transport Malta now requires all buses to have remotely monitorable CCTV covering both the passenger seating area (which they already had) and the driver's cab (which they previously did not). The cheap "off licence" looking ceiling mounted dome camera that pointed at the door has been removed and replaced with a tamper proof proper enclosed dome camera in the corner of the drivers cab, to give images of both passengers boarding and the driver at the wheel. This has reportedly not gone down well with some drivers, who objected to management "spying" on them. However, industrial relations seem calm just now, following some strikes and disputes last summer. The Optare Solos have not had similar cab cameras fitted (perhaps this means their replacement is sooner than anyone expects?).
A substantially revised and rebooted route network was introduced during last December, following a prelude to it being brought in some weeks previously. Unfortunately the regulator - Transport Malta - whose job it is to ensure that bus stops show the correct route tiles and can display all the timetables, have been rather lacking. 5 months on from the changes and most stops still do not show all the numbers or timetables for the routes that stop there, causing some bemusement for locals but utter confusion for tourists. There are now vastly more routes departing from Valletta each hour and to cope with this the bus station there has effectively doubled in size by extending it around the corner into the ditch area which was formally unused.
Last month MPT launched the Tallinja phone app which provides extensive journey planning and - more importantly - real time arrival information along with an interactive map which shows every route that calls at any given stop. The app works well and has been generally well received (though it is a bit sluggish). The website too has now been redesigned and relaunched and is finally a genuinely useful and attractive resource.
While the bus service is still not of the standards you'd expect to see in much of the UK, it is now noticeably better and more professional than Arriva at their lowest point, just before they quit at the end of 2013 and that of MPT's first year of operation in 2014. The new owners - ALESA (part of the Spanish ALSA group) are making their mark quitely and discreetly by increasing staff supervision, setting up a driving academy in Malta with a simulator and negotiating with unions to revise pay and conditions (though that hasn't been agreed yet). Unlike Arriva however, ALESA is publicy "hands off", with MPT largely left to run things their own way and with no references to the parent company on bus or in public communications. You'd be forgiven for thinking that ALESA/ALSA group are conciously aware of how hated Arriva were and are trying to keep their names visibly out of what is still a very troubled and loss making operation.
Evidence of Arriva's former folly can still be found on the island, for one there are the BUS 5xx buses still in Arriva livery and for another, the withdrawn Arriva Citaro artics are still parked up in a scrapyard, unscrapped, in San Gwann - clearly visible to anyone who passes on the main road from Naxxar to San Gwann... It's not known why they are still there or for how much longer they will remain rusting away in that yard...
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Post by snoggle on May 22, 2016 19:41:02 GMT
Thank you for the interesting update. I've never been to Malta so my knowledge of the operation is not very great and what I have seen is largely via Flickr photos plus bits and bobs of newspaper info. The suprising aspect is the way in which modern vehicles seem unable to cope with the working conditions in Malta. Is this down to them being low floor, the quality of the road surfaces, the driving standards, the scale of demand or something else? It always feels like the entire operation is below par regardless of who is running it and what regulatory regime there is.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2016 23:16:56 GMT
IMHO it's down to a number of factors, including but not limited solely to:
- The Maltese, culturally, have a "zero maintenance" mindset. They simply do not understand the need or purpose of maintenance and perceive it as being a waste of money and time, when something breaks then - and only then - do you fix it. And by break, I mean break down totally. Arriva had sub contracted the maintenance of the fleet here (for cost reasons, as I understood it) which meant that standards were even lower as Arriva had little control over the quality of maintenance work.
- The roads are hideous, there are a few roads that are recently laid and are smoothish but even those won't stay good for long. In a few months utilities will come along and dig them up and do horrendous trenching and patch repairs on them as a result. It's not uncommon to see the transport authority relay an entire stretch of road only for a utility to come along a few weeks later and totally rip it up and fill in their handywork with poor uneven cement and/or loose chippings. There are main roads that resemble bumpy bouncy country lanes you'd find in the UK. There are country and village roads here that resemble dirt tracks you'd see in africa that you really need 4WD vehicles for. The buses are basically be shaken apart on a daily basis.
- The King Longs are of noticeably lower quality and durability compared to British or German built buses. Given that they reportedly cost around €90k each when new, you can only imagine where the cost savings came from. Sure they look modern and on a par with British buses when they were new (even if they do sort of resemble the first generation of low floor buses internally) but they don't exactly sound sophistcated. The 2011 built King Longs have run of the mill Cummins engines and (I believe) ZF gearboxes (Arriva insisted on this so at least in terms of drive train they'd have some similarity with buses they are experienced in operating) yet sound little like anything you'd ride on from ADL or WrightBus etc. They make an appalling level of noise most of the time, I live close to a steep winding hill in Xemxija and daily you can hear the under powered King Longs wheezing their way up the hill, sometimes only managing no more than 5mph with the accelerator fully down when fully loaded. The noise they make is akin to a giant bathroom hand drier going at full wack (I assume it's the sound of the turbo fan) and is not unlike the sound of a B20 fleetline with their original engines (yes, they sound *that* unsophisticated!). Also the axles on these things make the most horrific noise half the time though they seem to be quieter lately, as though MPT have finally worked out how to maintain them correctly. The UK is thankfully relatively free of these buses though the now defunct Tates Travel had several of them, built to the same specification and sounding similar to the fleet here (you can find some videos of them on you tube). Lastly, they are already showing signs of corrosion problems, after nearly 5 years of service.
- The standard of driving here is abysmal, because the drivers no longer own the bus they are driving, they don't care about looking after it. So what if you scrape on the side of a building or another vehicle as you negotiate a tight turn, so what if you manage to break one of the mirrors off or clip the curb and damage the front when you pull up to a stop at an angle, it's not your bus so not your problem. That's largely the thinking here.
That said, it's definitely worth a visit here. The King Longs, for all their faults, are distinctive and have character - it's just a shame they've been so badly maintained (you'll not see, for example, a single one that doesn't have the "engine fault" light lit on the dashboard - again, the Maltese just do not understand modern tech and so to them, a light on the dashboard is just a light on the dashboard, if the bus starts up and doesn't blow up or belch excessive smoke (and I mean power station levels of smoke, a lot of smoke is still ok here!), it's probably ok to drive it).
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2016 5:21:58 GMT
Further to previous post, in 2012, Arriva actually had a XMQ6127J demonstrator in service for a little while, built to Malta specification. Not sure where it ended up (it most certainly didn't remain with Arriva and we know Arriva never bought any further King Long so they couldn't have been happy overall with their performance) but you can see a video of it here: www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFx-jZbCQUsThis one sounds in much better condition than much of the Maltese fleet - though, when they were also knew they did sound like this! |
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Post by snoggle on May 23, 2016 11:25:14 GMT
That said, it's definitely worth a visit here. The King Longs, for all their faults, are distinctive and have character - it's just a shame they've been so badly maintained (you'll not see, for example, a single one that doesn't have the "engine fault" light lit on the dashboard - again, the Maltese just do not understand modern tech and so to them, a light on the dashboard is just a light on the dashboard, if the bus starts up and doesn't blow up or belch excessive smoke (and I mean power station levels of smoke, a lot of smoke is still ok here!), it's probably ok to drive it). Thanks for the extra comments and answers. Based on the above para it sounds like Abellio's Walworth Garage are following the Maltese model of vehicle checks and maintenance.   I did see the King Longs with Tate's Travel not long before they went bust. 
Tates Travel 1632 485 Wakefield by plcd1, on Flickr |
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2016 12:28:30 GMT
Based on the above para it sounds like Abellio's Walworth Garage are following the Maltese model of vehicle checks and maintenance. I did see the King Longs with Tate's Travel not long before they went bust.
Tates Travel 1632 485 Wakefield by plcd1, on Flickr Wow I've not seen a king long in such good condition since July 2011 (When Arriva started... they rapidly got beaten up here within weeks). There is not a single King Long now without some kind of "battle scars" on them. Sure they've been repainted (but even that has been done badly, many have the odd streak of white or green paint bleeding over onto the windows (clearly masking tape is too high tech for the Maltese) and with some you can clearly see the brush strokes and even bristles that have come off the presumably poor quality brushes that were used and just left to dry into the paintwork!) but you can still see signs of damage since things are rarely fixed properly if at all. Does anyone know what happened to the Tates King Longs since? Are they parked up somewhere or were they sold on? I think the lowest point I've ever seen here was during the Arriva era (pronounced "error" for sure!) and I was on a Citaro G. The bus was winding it's way through Ta' Qali and we hit a series of large potholes. This caused some kind of alarm to go off in the drivers cab and a flashing spanner symbol began to appear on the dashboard. The driver clearly needed to respond to this and he did. He stopped the bus, turned his radio up loud and used his metal drinking flask to smash the flashing display showing the spanner symbol. Having done that with a shrug of his shoulders and proclamation to the passengers of "Mela, problem solved" we were on our way again. One of the things that ALSA group were big on from day one when they took over here Jan 2015 was maintenance, I'm lead to understand a number of engineering staff left within the first few weeks apparently unhappy with the new expectations upon them (i.e. that they actually fix things and not cock it up!), I've actually met the new Spanish owner once, Mr Cosmen and apparently he and his team were appalled by the state of the (what passed for) maintenance depot here. He described it as a "shambles" and said his team failed to understand why there bits of dead bus strewn all over the place and why no one seemed to know what any of it was for or which bus each bit originally came from. He told me that this was his team's first job, to get some kind of structure and order into the depot and show them how maintenance should be done and why it's so very important. I have to say, I think his team has gotten the point across now. Over the past 12 months I've seen a steady decline in the number of buses randomly dead on the roadside, broken down (with the King Longs it's a fairly regular occurrence anyway for reasons I've never really understood) so I think they have indeed got a handle on this now. There's other stuff he told me that I can't repeat in a public forum for legal reasons but suffice to say, ALSA group had been genuinely surprised by what they saw here when they took over and how they were treated initially by various players here both within the company and working with it. It's real hearts and mind stuff, they have to slowly, gently, change the mindset and get the Maltese to embrace change and a quality and accountability culture that thus far they find alien and - as a nation - are largely resistant to. |
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Post by snoggle on May 23, 2016 13:50:18 GMT
Wow I've not seen a king long in such good condition since July 2011 (When Arriva started... they rapidly got beaten up here within weeks). There is not a single King Long now without some kind of "battle scars" on them. Sure they've been repainted (but even that has been done badly, many have the odd streak of white or green paint bleeding over onto the windows (clearly masking tape is too high tech for the Maltese) and with some you can clearly see the brush strokes and even bristles that have come off the presumably poor quality brushes that were used and just left to dry into the paintwork!) but you can still see signs of damage since things are rarely fixed properly if at all. Does anyone know what happened to the Tates King Longs since? Are they parked up somewhere or were they sold on? I think the lowest point I've ever seen here was during the Arriva era (pronounced "error" for sure!) and I was on a Citaro G. The bus was winding it's way through Ta' Qali and we hit a series of large potholes. This caused some kind of alarm to go off in the drivers cab and a flashing spanner symbol began to appear on the dashboard. The driver clearly needed to respond to this and he did. He stopped the bus, turned his radio up loud and used his metal drinking flask to smash the flashing display showing the spanner symbol. Having done that with a shrug of his shoulders and proclamation to the passengers of "Mela, problem solved" we were on our way again. No idea what happened to Tates' former buses I'm afraid. I've read enough about that company and its related businesses to make my hair curl. I'm amazed they lasted as long as they did and had amassed the scale of work that they had. I love that story about the Citaro driver. When I was looking on a Malta bus Flickr bus group the other day there were a couple of photos of a Citaro G in service in Malta with the back all based to bits, bumper hanging off etc. And to think how hysterical everyone gets here when a bus crashes. People would be in the hospital A&E on a permanent basis if they had to cope with Maltese standards. I have to say that the more you tell me the less inclined I am to ever visit. I'm not sure I'd want to entrust my safety to such reckless drivers. Culture's one thing but really! |
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2016 19:30:08 GMT
I love that story about the Citaro driver. When I was looking on a Malta bus Flickr bus group the other day there were a couple of photos of a Citaro G in service in Malta with the back all based to bits, bumper hanging off etc. And to think how hysterical everyone gets here when a bus crashes. People would be in the hospital A&E on a permanent basis if they had to cope with Maltese standards. I have to say that the more you tell me the less inclined I am to ever visit. I'm not sure I'd want to entrust my safety to such reckless drivers. Culture's one thing but really! What exactly did happen at Tates that made your hair curl then? I know very little about them other than they were a small company that got bought out by a Chinese brass plate company and there after things rapidly went down the pan (and I presume the Chinese company was something to do with the King Long franchise holder in the UK hence why they started getting King Long buses?). What else happened? Don't worry, driver standards have much improved now, a combination of staff training - including this new simulator launched today: www.timesofmalta.com/articles/view/20160523/local/250000-bus-simulator-keeps-drivers-on-their-toes.613040and in-cab CCTV which cab be remotely monitored in real time by control staff is starting to help raise standards. Drivers are starting to "get it" that bad practice will no longer be tolerated. By the time they were taken out of service, many of the Citaro Gs were in very poor condition and most certainly did not cope well with the lunar surface that passes for roads here. Non operational door CCTV monitors were the least of the defects I spotted on most of them (it's something of a puzzle actually how the door CCTV systems became defective, at the time Arriva Malta claimed they were not working for such long periods as they were awaiting spare parts... you'd have thought Mercedes would have been able to supply whatever spares were needed pretty quickly, even to Malta). If you want to see the Citaro graveyard, thanks to google maps you can (sort of): www.google.com.mt/maps/@35.9127102,14.4656014,56a,20y,188.7h,75.68t/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en BTW, I got an email from Mr Cosmen tonight, he's just told me that the first of the 33 Otokar Kents due for July has actually been offloaded from the ship in Malta this afternoon as ALESA has been pressing Otokar to speed up production. As with the Vectios, they are expected to be put into service as quickly as humanly possible (in the case of the Vectios I believe they were offloaded in the morning and were all in service by the evening, that is how desparate they are for additional buses here!), so they should be in service within the next day or so at the latest... You should definitely come over for a visit, if not to see the MPT fleet, to get some sun and sample the quirkiness of Maltese life also - where else in the med can you find a pastizzi (a kind of pasty) filled with nutella as the latest craze food?!  Or if that doesn't grab you there's a good number of ex UK 'deckers here on sightseeing work. Often see the odd Titan and it makes me feel strange knowing that in all probabilty it's a bus that I might have got on as a child (I was born and lived 30 years in Greenwich area in London). |
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2016 19:33:59 GMT
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Post by snoggle on May 24, 2016 19:38:16 GMT
What exactly did happen at Tates that made your hair curl then? I know very little about them other than they were a small company that got bought out by a Chinese brass plate company and there after things rapidly went down the pan (and I presume the Chinese company was something to do with the King Long franchise holder in the UK hence why they started getting King Long buses?). What else happened? Well you've sort of hit the nail on the head. See www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=126626 and also search for "Island Fortitude" and see the companies destroyed by that outfit. Dreadful stuff.  |
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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2016 20:41:40 GMT
Thanks! And I spoke to soon about standards improving, well for everyone at least. Overall it's still better than it was. But part of Malta was at a standstill today after a Citaro hit a taxi and then a XMQ6127J crashed straight into the back of said stopped Citaro... I wouldn't like to be in either driver's shoes right now, especially the one driving the King Long... www.tvm.com.mt/en/news/watch-four-persons-hospitalised-sliema-incident/I suspect the 3 Kent Cs that arrived early yesterday will be pressed into service tomorrow now, the operation really can't be doing with having another 2 12 metre buses out of service. |
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Or if that doesn't grab you there's a good number of ex UK 'deckers here on sightseeing work. Often see the odd Titan and it makes me feel strange knowing that in all probabilty it's a bus that I might have got on as a child (I was born and lived 30 years in Greenwich area in London). 