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Post by danorak on Mar 3, 2015 19:10:50 GMT
The 13 has always been a difficult route to find a home for. For many years, it had allocations south of the river and I seem to recall TfL once had to ask for further tenders as no acceptable bids had been received.
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Post by rmz19 on Mar 3, 2015 19:12:04 GMT
Wow ....I can't begin to imagine how crowded the 139 will be as a result, as if to and from Waterloo in the peaks isn't bad enough. The 82 is also oftenly crowded along Finchley Road, so withdrawing the 13 will place more pressure on the 82 as it'll be the only route between Golders Green and Marble Arch along that corridor. What I like is the return of the 113 to OC as it used to be, I also like a 24 hour 82....alot . An N189 with a tiny extension at night to OC seems quite silly, so I'd rather extend it to Trafalgar Square to provide new links at night.
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Post by Connor on Mar 3, 2015 19:22:09 GMT
Very happy seeing these proposed changes! (don't shoot me ) But rather than convert the 82 into a 24 hour service, I'd create a new night route, N82; Victoria Station to Mill Hill Broadway Station. Victoria to Finchley Central (via the normal 82), then to Mill Hill East (via the 382), then to Mill Hill Broadway Station (via the 240). As the Mill Hill area lacks a night bus (the N113 sort of bypasses it..) and it won't benefit from the Night Tube either. And I'd extend the new N189 to Trafalgar Square for better links to other night buses. Only if demand is there for my ideas of course.
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Post by sid on Mar 3, 2015 19:26:55 GMT
Wow ....I can't begin to imagine how crowded the 139 will be as a result, as if to and from Waterloo in the peaks isn't bad enough. What I like is the return of the 113 to OC as it used to be, I also like a 24 hour 82....alot . I'm indifferent to an N189 at the moment but why not?, I suppose time will tell. Returning the 113 to OC is good but it's at the expense of the 13, no service to Aldwych anymore. The 24hr 82 replaces the N13 so there is nothing gained. The 189 already has a night service so nothing gained there either. The more I think about this the worse it seems.
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Post by sid on Mar 3, 2015 19:28:48 GMT
Very happy seeing these proposed changes! (don't shoot me ) But rather than convert the 82 into a 24 hour service, I'd create a new night route, N82; Victoria Station to Mill Hill Broadway Station. Victoria to Finchley Central (via the normal 82), then to Mill Hill East (via the 382), then to Mill Hill Broadway Station (via the 240). As the Mill Hill area lacks a night bus (the N113 sort of bypasses it..) and it won't benefit from the Night Tube either. And I'd extend the new N189 to Trafalgar Square for better links to other night buses. Only if demand is there for my ideas of course. Consider yourself shot!!!
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Post by westhamgeezer on Mar 3, 2015 19:29:59 GMT
I've known about this for quite a while (albeit the version I heard was the 139 being renumbered 13, 139N to be renumbered N13 as well), and I have a massive feeling that TfL will go ahead no matter what. At this rate, RATP set to lose quite a lot and Metroline will gain a tad. The 10 afaik was withdrawn after it dwindled down and it was already single deck by when it was withdrawn! At this rate, this just seems to be a ploy of removing more buses off Oxford Street, forcing more crowding on the 82 (which can get very busy when a 13 takes some time to arrive) and at the same time, converting the 139 to LT. The forced paying of two fares for anyone going to the West End from the 189 Brent Cross and the extended journey times for West End-Golders Green (by bus) journey times will not be liked. TfL may have some passenger figures that may say that people on the 13 may like longer journey times(!) (or flow means that the Northern line exists, these changes may warrant some to move to the already overcrowded Northern line!). Watch the amount of confusion when this change takes place all around NW London, and tourists within London. Technically 139 barely serves Aldwych, so that's slightly less worrying(!) Looking at the 292 contract, this change would probably be by December this year at this rate. Absolutely, the 10 had dwindled to a shaddow of its former self in an era when passenger numbers were generally falling. The 13 has healthy passenger numbers as it is and hasnt carried on for 80+ years for no reason......why not even extend it to its old terminus of London Bridge and let it help out with the problems there ;-) Seriously though, the only reason for this is to A. Continue the pointless chopping of buses from Oxford Street (wont/hasnt made a blind bit of difference to anything unless you ban those *IMO dangerous* cycle-taxi's and taxi's) and B. to potentially get LT's on to the 139 (why not just stick them on routes that can take them). Possibly one of the most ridiculous proposals of recent times, and I do not believe in the slighted that this is proposed because of "changing travel patterns"
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Post by routew15 on Mar 3, 2015 19:31:32 GMT
Recently there has been a lot of discussion about these routes. TfL are proposing to make changes to bus services on routes 13, 82, 113, 139, 189, N13 and N113. ~ Routes 13 and N13 would no longer run ~ Route 82 would run 24 hours a day ~ Route 113 would be extended to Oxford Circus ~ Route 139 would be extended to Golders Green ~ Route 189 would run between Brent Cross and Marble Arch. ~ New night route N189 would run between Brent Cross and Oxford Circus ~ Frequencies would be changed on route 113Image of proposed changes (from consultation page)To have your say or view more details click here for the Consultation page A lot of negatives and I'm struggling to see any positives, the 24hr 82 will only be replacing the N13, does the daytime 82 get a frequency increase? And as others have said the 13 is only a year or so into a new contract, won't there have to be some compensation pay out? Extending the 139 to Golders Green serves no real purpose with the 328 already covering that section. The reason the 139 is being extended is so passengers can maintain connections between Golders Green and the West End, it's not necassarily for those who are travelling between West Hampstead and Golders Green. The consultation says "There would be with no changes to the day 82 service" this is a bit ambigous, so it's unclear whether or not there will be an increase. On another note, I think the N189 has a northern extenstion potential... maybe via the 142 or 326 to Mill Hill East?
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Post by DT 11 on Mar 3, 2015 19:39:23 GMT
Well I was sort of on the lines yesterday with that post. This goes back to 2013 when I heard rumours of the 13 being withdrawn.
Just looked at the Consultation and now time to Criticize.
It is a shame that 13/N13 is to be withdrawn because now London Sovereign loose quite a lot of work. The 139 should be withdrawn just so that BT can keep the 13 Contract as Metroline are taking over the 168. BT they gain the 326, but this PVR does not match the 13 so some staff will probably be sent elsewhere or lose their jobs possibly.
Why Divert the 189 Day Service to Marble Arch and have an N189 to Oxford Circus, so add an N Prefix just to have the route go to Oxford Circus 3 Bus Stops at Night? New Blinds just for a N189!?!?
The 113 diverted back to Oxford Circus, extend it to Trafalgar Square and make the service 24 Hour and leave the 189 as a 24 Hour Service.
Overall the 82 & 113 are going to Struggle without the 13.
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Post by mondraker275 on Mar 3, 2015 19:53:34 GMT
There is no doubt, this will go ahead. They will probably get a lot of negative responses, but will come up with clever answers. What I hate about the consultation is the reasoning given. tube lines have been improved...?? So what, have you dropped the fares to the same level of the bus? Nonsense. I just hope this is not the beginning of more 'reviews'.
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Post by COBO on Mar 3, 2015 20:08:48 GMT
What they should have done is discontinued the 139, extend the 113 to Trafalgar Square and turn into a 24 hour service, extend the 13 from Aldwych to Waterloo, reroute the 13 between Baker Street and Golders Green via Fortune Green Road, West End Lane, West Hampstead Stations, West End Lane, Abbey Road, St John's Wood, Grove End Road, Lisson Grove and Rossmore Road instead of via Finchley Road.
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Post by vjaska on Mar 3, 2015 20:17:06 GMT
Take a bow 'david21' lol.
One things for sure, the 13 won't be getting NBfL's unless re-introduced elsewhere lol.
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Post by Connor on Mar 3, 2015 20:27:43 GMT
What they should have done is discontinued the 139, extend the 113 to Trafalgar Square and turn into a 24 hour service, extend the 13 from Aldwych to Waterloo, reroute the 13 between Baker Street and Golders Green via Fortune Green Road, West End Lane, West Hampstead Stations, West End Lane, Abbey Road, St John's Wood, Grove End Road, Lisson Grove and Rossmore Road instead of via Finchley Road. When you put it like that, TFL is absolutely doing the right thing. You've just taken their idea and renamed it the 13 LOL. Any reason why the 82, 113, 139, 189, N113 and N189 can't be converted to NBfLs? They have to go somewhere!
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Post by COBO on Mar 3, 2015 20:34:01 GMT
What they should have done is discontinued the 139, extend the 113 to Trafalgar Square and turn into a 24 hour service, extend the 13 from Aldwych to Waterloo, reroute the 13 between Baker Street and Golders Green via Fortune Green Road, West End Lane, West Hampstead Stations, West End Lane, Abbey Road, St John's Wood, Grove End Road, Lisson Grove and Rossmore Road instead of via Finchley Road. When you put it like that, TFL is absolutely doing the right thing. You've just taken their idea and renamed it the 13 LOL. Any reason why the 82, 113, 139, N113 and N189 can't be converted to NBfLs? They have to go somewhere! I feel like the older 13 should stay and the people at BT who drive routes 13/N13 could keep there jobs. The current 139 can't take NBfLs because of it's stand at West Hampstead.
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Post by DT 11 on Mar 3, 2015 20:37:09 GMT
What they should have done is discontinued the 139, extend the 113 to Trafalgar Square and turn into a 24 hour service, extend the 13 from Aldwych to Waterloo, reroute the 13 between Baker Street and Golders Green via Fortune Green Road, West End Lane, West Hampstead Stations, West End Lane, Abbey Road, St John's Wood, Grove End Road, Lisson Grove and Rossmore Road instead of via Finchley Road. When you put it like that, TFL is absolutely doing the right thing. You've just taken their idea and renamed it the 13 LOL. Any reason why the 82, 113, 139, N113 and N189 can't be converted to NBfLs? They have to go somewhere! Can't agree, at the very least if TFL wanted to withdraw the 13 it should have been done in 2013. Indeed they will have to go somewhere, more Free Services Everywhere now lol. Seventy Free, 11 Free, 1 Free9.
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Post by COBO on Mar 3, 2015 20:42:31 GMT
Not related but I wonder what they are going to do with the 7, 23 and 94 to convert them into NBfL.
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