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Post by snoggle on Sept 10, 2015 16:15:39 GMT
If you remember after bus number so and so from Wrights other builders are allowed into the market. I think it would be a very brave company that would not leave most of Boris's designs in their product given the high profile of the Borismaster and LT Buses love affair with Wrights I think it would be a very brave company that was stupid enough to incorporate design features that don't work and which attract massive public criticism. I also question the value / need for every bus to conform to some botched, over stylised design based on some warped cross breeding of a 1960s Leyland Atlantean / Alexander and the Routemaster. What on earth is the point? I find it somewhat concering that TfL are now possibly trying to insist that buses all look the same. There is plenty of value in variety and ensuring choice given the bus purchasing decisions rest with the operator. The more that buses become "London centric" the greater the risk there is of no resale value or extensive modification at the end of London service life. We already have that with dual door buses - necessary for London - but surely we do not want more cost and less residual value if the point is about getting maximum value for money from the budget that TfL does have?
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Post by Green Kitten on Sept 10, 2015 17:40:25 GMT
Looks interesting enough but doesn't beat the original MMC.
Hopefully operators won't be forced to have that drab LT interior.
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Post by snoggle on Sept 11, 2015 21:47:06 GMT
Apparently this design is on order for route 78 and one of the batch will be at the NEC in October.
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Post by LX09FBJ on Sept 11, 2015 22:13:43 GMT
Not a fan of the glass staircase on any bus to be honest. Doesn't look too bad. Still at least they haven't removed the openable windows! I also notice the E200 front end being used. It still looks nicer than the 'angular' Gemini 3 Wonder if Metroline will buy some for the 390... ...I wish it was these NB4Ls on order for the 159.
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Post by ilovelondonbuses on Sept 11, 2015 23:28:28 GMT
I do wonder if TfL will be pushing for operators to take on this model specifically for their central routes. Seems like Arriva were convinced after their usual orders are Wright Geminis. Not a fan of the glass staircase on any bus to be honest. Doesn't look too bad. Still at least they haven't removed the openable windows! I also notice the E200 front end being used. It still looks nicer than the 'angular' Gemini 3 Wonder if Metroline will buy some for the 390... ...I wish it was these NB4Ls on order for the 159. Definitely would have preferred these buses over the LTs for route 159.
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Post by marlon101 on Sept 12, 2015 9:13:09 GMT
Why bother? The standard MMC is perfectly fine. I don't understand this ludicrous obsession with glass sided staircases. I assume this is going to cost more than a standard bus to what gain / benefit? < rolls eyes > I also presume this costs more than the standard version. A cynic might also read into the LT badge on the front that this is for TfL purchase for lease to bus operators. That does require quite a leap of imagination mind.
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Post by Red Dragon on Sept 12, 2015 10:46:51 GMT
Apparently this design is on order for route 78 and one of the batch will be at the NEC in October. Oh no . Earth to Arriva- get a standard MMC and stick a roundel on it.
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Post by M1104 on Sept 12, 2015 11:20:55 GMT
Why bother? The standard MMC is perfectly fine. I don't understand this ludicrous obsession with glass sided staircases. I assume this is going to cost more than a standard bus to what gain / benefit? < rolls eyes > A cynic might also read into the LT badge on the front that this is for TfL purchase for lease to bus operators. That does require quite a leap of imagination mind. Assuming this were to be the case ('leap of imagination') could this mean TfL may spec these for routes that failed the LT evaluation, eg the 45?
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Post by twobellstogo on Sept 12, 2015 13:02:48 GMT
Hopefully operators won't be forced to have that drab LT interior. I do : the LT interior colours I think are very classy. I have never understood this fixation with blue that many operators have. I look forward to seeing these on the 78 : this is one of the most distinctive looking vehicles we've had since...well...the LT!
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Post by astock5000 on Sept 12, 2015 15:25:19 GMT
I'm looking forward to seeing these buses in service too. Overall I quite like the design. While the headlight arrangement is similar to the Enviro200 MMC, I think it looks better on this bus as it matches the design of the glazed staircase. The join between the upper deck front window and the slightly taller side windows does seem slightly odd though. This article on busandcoach.com has some more information:
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Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2015 17:29:07 GMT
This new design has left me scratching my head... The MMC looks good enough, so there really is no need for a routemaster lookalike. Don't get me wrong, I love the idea of new designs running on london's streets, just like the new-look gemini 3 (sorry for the off-topic). It just begs the question... if ADL made the routemasters using the technology and systems in their E400H's, would there be any problems at all with them? Oh yeah, the bus looks great
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Post by snoggle on Sept 12, 2015 17:49:08 GMT
This new design has left me scratching my head... The MMC looks good enough, so there really is no need for a routemaster lookalike. Don't get me wrong, I love the idea of new designs running on london's streets, just like the new-look gemini 3 (sorry for the off-topic). It just begs the question... if ADL made the routemasters using the technology and systems in their E400H's, would there be any problems at all with them? Oh yeah, the bus looks great There is nothing wrong with a design of bus if it works and if it represents value for money. I don't greatly care who makes the buses provided simple criteria are met - it's safe, it's comfortable to ride in, it's smooth riding, quiet, the interior doesn't cause nausea, there is decent ventilation and heating for the requisite seasonal weather we get. No half decent manufacturer left to their own devices would struggle to provide a bus that meets those criteria in an acceptable "blend" or balance of attributes. Half the problems we have in London are from excessive "fiddling" by the client resulting in buses that don't work and no I'm not just thinking of one certain design.
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Post by marlon101 on Sept 12, 2015 18:31:20 GMT
This new design has left me scratching my head... The MMC looks good enough, so there really is no need for a routemaster lookalike. Don't get me wrong, I love the idea of new designs running on london's streets, just like the new-look gemini 3 (sorry for the off-topic). It just begs the question... if ADL made the routemasters using the technology and systems in their E400H's, would there be any problems at all with them? Oh yeah, the bus looks great There is nothing wrong with a design of bus if it works and if it represents value for money. I don't greatly care who makes the buses provided simple criteria are met - it's safe, it's comfortable to ride in, it's smooth riding, quiet, the interior doesn't cause nausea, there is decent ventilation and heating for the requisite seasonal weather we get. No half decent manufacturer left to their own devices would struggle to provide a bus that meets those criteria in an acceptable "blend" or balance of attributes. Half the problems we have in London are from excessive "fiddling" by the client resulting in buses that don't work and no I'm not just thinking of one certain design. I also like buses that nudge total capacity up, rather than down, and that are built in their entirety in Britain.
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Post by vjaska on Sept 13, 2015 0:24:57 GMT
I'm looking forward to seeing these buses in service too. Overall I quite like the design. While the headlight arrangement is similar to the Enviro200 MMC, I think it looks better on this bus as it matches the design of the glazed staircase. The join between the upper deck front window and the slightly taller side windows does seem slightly odd though. This article on busandcoach.com has some more information: Sorry but since when is a glazed stairwell & a wrap over rear saloon windscreen the London look. I think they've been watching too many Rimmel adverts. Regardless of likes/dislikes of this bus, I'm no closer as to the purpose of this bus. It's as if ADL are ashamed to see loads of MMC's running around in London. There's that famous saying - "If it ain't broke, don't fix it"
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Post by MetrolineGA1511 on Sept 26, 2015 23:27:09 GMT
It is better than LTs and the "Streetdeck" Gemini style as per GA routes 119 & 202.
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