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Post by routew15 on Nov 9, 2015 12:29:26 GMT
TfL has launched a consultation today on the changes to buses in Hounslow Hounslow, Ealing and Twickenham consultation pageThis consultation is very detailed (as expected) haven't even read half of it. (Cheeky side note: Still waiting for the 424 & 485 consultation)Consultation closes Friday 18 December 2015 , the same day as the 481 consultation [/b]
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Post by snoggle on Nov 9, 2015 12:49:04 GMT
Pity they are referring to "existing route E8" on the H28's map. Sack the proof reader. Quite surprised that they are changing the H28 but not a route I'm familiar with. I wonder if people losing their service will object in great numbers. EDIT - one other thought is I'm slightly surprised they're not taking the opportunity to provide some new links with the 110 rerouting. It could do something a bit more involved by running down Whitton Road, along the A316 and then via the H37 and up to the hospital. I know the A316 gets very busy but there are quite a lot of houses down there, there are a couple of recessed bays which a single deck bus could use and it would give new links from parts of St Margarets to both Twickenham and the hospital. The 267 provides a decent enough service along Twickenham Road and the 481 is being enhanced so perhaps slightly less need to route another route that way.
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Post by southlondonbus on Nov 9, 2015 13:06:51 GMT
When it said ealing aswell I thought it my have detailed the 83 changes.
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Post by vjaska on Nov 9, 2015 13:19:05 GMT
The changes seem sensible enough although wonder how happy Wood Lane residents will be to lose their only bus service. Also, does Hounslow have space for two more routes to stand?
On a less serious note, this consultation also means I need to finish off that section off the H28 I didn't get to do as that diversion was on at the time.
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Post by lonmark on Nov 9, 2015 14:29:11 GMT
Page say there is updated and will be back in few minutes.
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Post by snoggle on Nov 9, 2015 14:39:24 GMT
Page say there is updated and will be back in few minutes. Blame me! I sent them an E Mail pointing out the "existing E8 route" ref on the H28 map key. Now changed to H28.
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Post by snowman on Nov 9, 2015 15:07:40 GMT
Whats the point of keeping the rerouted 110, it is an overlap with the double deck 267 (except the termini), would it not have been easier to tweak the 267 frequency (or give the 267 longer buses than the aging SLEs), however this section is often quiet, why don't they divert it from Ivybridge direct to Whitton to infil some of the gaps in the network
The 635 school bus also gets cut between Brentford and Hounslow, this is an oddity as St Pauls school isn't in London, but in Surrey (its usually 3 TLAs but sometimes SPs are used)
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Post by snoggle on Nov 9, 2015 15:17:33 GMT
Whats the point of keeping the rerouted 110, it is an overlap with the double deck 267 (except the termini), would it not have been easier to tweak the 267 frequency (or give the 267 longer buses than the aging SLEs) The 635 school bus also gets cut between Brentford and Hounslow, this is an oddity as St Pauls school isn't in London, but in Surrey (its usually 3 TLAs but sometimes SPs are used) I think TfL are keeping the 110 going to WM Hospital purely to avoid a massive backlash about removing access to the Hospital. The E8 won't go to the hospital front door and the H28 is being removed so taking a third route away is probably politically unacceptable. Hospital access by bus = votes from a cross section of people so TfL will not want to go out of its way to completely alienate local and borough councillors, MPs and Assembly members. I expect the E8 change will be welcomed and the 110 may be neutral but I see the H28 as being a bit controversial. I agree that just overlapping the 267 seems a waste of an opportunity hence my earlier comments about twiddling with the 110's route to give some new options for people. I've not used the 267 very much but when I did it was fairly quiet down that section of route but I accept that may not be typical.
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Post by snowman on Nov 9, 2015 15:46:18 GMT
Whats the point of keeping the rerouted 110, it is an overlap with the double deck 267 (except the termini), would it not have been easier to tweak the 267 frequency (or give the 267 longer buses than the aging SLEs) however this section is often quiet, why don't they divert it from Ivybridge direct to Whitton to infil some of the gaps in the network. The 635 school bus also gets cut between Brentford and Hounslow, this is an oddity as St Pauls school isn't in London, but in Surrey (its usually 3 TLAs but sometimes SPs are used) I think TfL are keeping the 110 going to WM Hospital purely to avoid a massive backlash about removing access to the Hospital. The E8 won't go to the hospital front door and the H28 is being removed so taking a third route away is probably politically unacceptable. Hospital access by bus = votes from a cross section of people so TfL will not want to go out of its way to completely alienate local and borough councillors, MPs and Assembly members. I expect the E8 change will be welcomed and the 110 may be neutral but I see the H28 as being a bit controversial. I agree that just overlapping the 267 seems a waste of an opportunity hence my earlier comments about twiddling with the 110's route to give some new options for people. I've not used the 267 very much but when I did it was fairly quiet down that section of route but I accept that may not be typical. I don't really understand why these proposals didn't involve the 117, 267 and 235 as well. Could have diverted the E8 along the Great West Road, why did they keep the part shared with E2, London Road has the 235 and 267, doesn't need another bus. The 117 was extended from Hounslow a few tears ago, now this section of the 110 is being withdrawn. All a bit too piecemeal. In my view if going to change 3 routes, may as well have done all of them in the Osterley-WM Hospital-Mogdon area. I'm not sure many will see Brentford as a main shopping centre. The proposed new loop on the H28 serves mainly countryside, yes there is a Tesco (and the proposed one near Hounslow bus station has been killed), but also one near the Rugby ground if there is a desperate need to serve a Tesco store (and I'm aware the Morrisons (ex Sommerfield) in Brentford is closing to become more apartments. Its a poor solution if aim was to get people from Brentford to a supermarket.
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Post by snoggle on Nov 9, 2015 15:54:22 GMT
I think TfL are keeping the 110 going to WM Hospital purely to avoid a massive backlash about removing access to the Hospital. The E8 won't go to the hospital front door and the H28 is being removed so taking a third route away is probably politically unacceptable. Hospital access by bus = votes from a cross section of people so TfL will not want to go out of its way to completely alienate local and borough councillors, MPs and Assembly members. I expect the E8 change will be welcomed and the 110 may be neutral but I see the H28 as being a bit controversial. I agree that just overlapping the 267 seems a waste of an opportunity hence my earlier comments about twiddling with the 110's route to give some new options for people. I've not used the 267 very much but when I did it was fairly quiet down that section of route but I accept that may not be typical. I don't really understand why these proposals didn't involve the 117, 267 and 235 as well. Could have diverted the E8 along the Great West Road, why did they keep the part shared with E2 The 117 was extended from Hounslow a few tears ago, now this section of the 110 is being withdrawn. All a bit to piecemeal. In my view if going to change 3 routes, may as well have done all of them in the Osterley-WM Hospital-Mogdon area Understand your point but remember the words of Chairman Daniels about TfL not wanting to do big area schemes because of the dislocation they can cause. This scheme is one of the largest for a fair while and note the reference to Crossrail being a factor despite being years away. I think TfL have adopted a new strategy which is to construct a massive scheme of changes but then only take it forward in chunks. In the Ealing / Hounslow area we currently have 3 consultations - E9, E8/110/H28 and 481. We suspect there may be a 83/483 one due at some point. When you add it all together it's pretty large in scale but it's the old "smoke and mirrors" routine. I expect we will soon see similar exercises in East London and South East London where we know TfL are reviewing services because of Crossrail. Don't expect one big consultation if the Ealing example is anything to go by. We already know some East London routes are being double decked and will have better frequencies.
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Post by routew15 on Nov 9, 2015 17:40:03 GMT
I don't really understand why these proposals didn't involve the 117, 267 and 235 as well. Could have diverted the E8 along the Great West Road, why did they keep the part shared with E2, London Road has the 235 and 267, doesn't need another bus. The 117 was extended from Hounslow a few tears ago, now this section of the 110 is being withdrawn. All a bit too piecemeal. In my view if going to change 3 routes, may as well have done all of them in the Osterley-WM Hospital-Mogdon area. I'm not sure many will see Brentford as a main shopping centre. To be honest I think these proposals could of easily of included the 481, more than the routes you've mentioned. In recent consultations we've had many extensions and frequency changes introduced together. Not complaining just saying. On the point about the 117 and 110, I think removing hospital links is not always a good thing. I personally believe the 110 should do a double run to the hospital grounds then serve Amhurst Gardens and Wood Lane possibly continuing to Norwood Green, Osterley Station or Osterley Tesco.
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Post by Jack on Nov 9, 2015 18:17:02 GMT
Firstly...Wow! I was not expecting the H28 to get involved in these changes so that was a surprise. I'll go through route by route with some comments. 110If you are at West Mid and wanted to get to Hounslow, you are now only left with the 117 (which sees no changes - should have re-routed and deckered and left the H28). There is no way in hell you are going to get the 110 from West Mid to Hounslow as it now goes even more around the houses. 635Tend to agree - it gets to Hounslow too late to provided any really benefit as the 235/7 have taken the main hit by the time it arrives. Its only since London United have started running it that they pick "normal" passengers up. Under Metroline days it was pretty much an exit only service as the drivers refused to let any non school children on. E8No real issues with this - Will be interesting to see where it stands as you will not fit the E8 and H22 on the stand at Bell Corner. H28So the re-routed section of the route will serve absolutely no purpose whatsoever - its a narrow country road which you will not be able to put a stop in (H28 thrash becoming a thing - madness!! ) Wood Lane is a catch 22 situation. It is dominated with older residents and a newish housing estate and the top of the road but when the 528 was in operation is showed just how little the section is used. The problem is, for that minority, this will be a huge cut for them. If you live in the middle of Wood Lane and you are at Tesco, your nearest option is to walk under the Great West Road to get the H91, or get the H28 to Syon Lane, then a 235/7 to the bottom of Wood Lane - either way you are left with a walk which I do not think will go down to well. Extension to Brentford County Court - Again, serves little/or no purpose. For me personally it will probably see journey times cut between Osterley and Hounslow which is a plus, , but the re-routed section of road is prone to long queues of traffic in the evening rush hour.
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Post by ServerKing on Nov 9, 2015 18:45:59 GMT
I don't really understand why these proposals didn't involve the 117, 267 and 235 as well. Could have diverted the E8 along the Great West Road, why did they keep the part shared with E2 The 117 was extended from Hounslow a few tears ago, now this section of the 110 is being withdrawn. All a bit to piecemeal. In my view if going to change 3 routes, may as well have done all of them in the Osterley-WM Hospital-Mogdon area Understand your point but remember the words of Chairman Daniels about TfL like not wanting to do big area schemes because of the dislocation they can cause. This scheme is one of the largest for a fair while and note the reference to Crossrail being a factor despite being years away. I think TfL have adopted a new strategy which is to construct a massive scheme of changes but then only take it forward in chunks. In the Ealing / Hounslow area we currently have 3 consultations - E9, E8/110/H28 and 481. We suspect there may be a 83/483 one due at some point. When you add it all together it's pretty large in scale but it's the old "smoke and mirrors" routine. I think Mr Daniels would want to avoid any smoke, he has enough Euro3 plus defective LT buses to deal with as it goes As for the E8 going down the Gt West Road, the turn from Boston Manor Road onto Gt West Road, then using the special slip road for the U turn by Boston Park Road would add a bit of unnecessary time to the journey. Once turning onto Syon Lane by Homebase opposite Gillette Corner, the traffic can be a pain to reach Busch Corner and West Mid Hospital. The part shared by the E2 would still terminate at AH so there's no real overlap. Despite there being the 235, 237 and 267 along London Road, there can be times where there's a wait for any bus, especially during the late mornings. As for the H28 and Wood Lane, that road can clog up in the school run, especially at the top near the A4, not forgetting the level crossing at the other end near London Road
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Post by danorak on Nov 9, 2015 19:33:46 GMT
Not an area I'm familiar with at all, but the E8 via Amhurst Gardens looks an ambitious proposition - given the antipathy in some places to double deckers, felling three trees on a residential road to allow them looks 'courageous' in Yes Minister-speak.
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Post by danorak on Nov 10, 2015 11:27:25 GMT
Not an area I'm familiar with at all, but the E8 via Amhurst Gardens looks an ambitious proposition - given the antipathy in some places to double deckers, felling three trees on a residential road to allow them looks 'courageous' in Yes Minister-speak. Adding to my earlier thought, Amhurst Gardens will go from a single decker every 20 minutes to a double decker every 8 minutes - the letter specifically aimed at residents seems quite quiet on this point.
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