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Post by TB123 on Jan 12, 2021 19:34:30 GMT
Now its been shortened to Kings Cross, we could see the 476 extended further into the Northumberland Park/Meridian Water area. The preference before was the 341 but the 476 could be a contender. Wonder whether the 341 and 476 could swap routings? Though many links may be broken |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2021 20:08:02 GMT
I personally think the 104 and 129 covering pretty much the same route to Beckton via the Royal docks is over bussing that area along with the proposed 474 and 325 changes happening. Think the 241 was also proposed to be extended around Silvertown too at somestage.
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Post by TB123 on Jan 12, 2021 20:10:54 GMT
I personally think the 104 and 129 covering pretty much the same route to Beckton via the Royal docks is over bussing that area along with the proposed 474 and 325 changes happening. Think the 241 was also proposed to be extended around Silvertown too at somestage. That draft of possible bus services through the tunnel is 7 years old so I suspect it'll be tweaked quite substantially when it gets closer to the time. I fully expect the 104 to be extended through - maybe even to Eltham? 335 probably extended through, as well as some other stuff like the 129, 323 etc |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2021 20:17:18 GMT
I personally think the 104 and 129 covering pretty much the same route to Beckton via the Royal docks is over bussing that area along with the proposed 474 and 325 changes happening. Think the 241 was also proposed to be extended around Silvertown too at somestage. That draft of possible bus services through the tunnel is 7 years old so I suspect it'll be tweaked quite substantially when it gets closer to the time. I fully expect the 104 to be extended through - maybe even to Eltham? 335 probably extended through, as well as some other stuff like the 129, 323 etc The 104 can suffer so horrid traffic in the Upton Park / East Ham area I dread to think what the reliability would be like if extended to Eltham.
One thing I have been thinking is how would Cars / Buses approach the new tunnel - I am guessing some major layout changes would need to be made if approaching from Silvertown Way. The the area near the tunnel was traditionally industrial until recently and is now very much residential so do feel for the people just moving in.
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Post by TB123 on Jan 12, 2021 20:19:32 GMT
That draft of possible bus services through the tunnel is 7 years old so I suspect it'll be tweaked quite substantially when it gets closer to the time. I fully expect the 104 to be extended through - maybe even to Eltham? 335 probably extended through, as well as some other stuff like the 129, 323 etc The 104 can suffer so horrid traffic in the Upton Park / East Ham area I dread to think what the reliability would be like if extended to Eltham.
One thing I have been thinking is how would Cars / Buses approach the new tunnel - I am guessing some major layout changes would need to be made if approaching from Silvertown Way. The the area near the tunnel was traditionally industrial until recently and is now very much residential so do feel for the people just moving in.
Don't forget the 104 is supposed to be restructured soon and I daren't say that the new structure may well have been done based on a future extension trhough the tunnel |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2021 20:26:35 GMT
The 104 can suffer so horrid traffic in the Upton Park / East Ham area I dread to think what the reliability would be like if extended to Eltham.
One thing I have been thinking is how would Cars / Buses approach the new tunnel - I am guessing some major layout changes would need to be made if approaching from Silvertown Way. The the area near the tunnel was traditionally industrial until recently and is now very much residential so do feel for the people just moving in.
Don't forget the 104 is supposed to be restructured soon and I daren't say that the new structure may well have been done based on a future extension trhough the tunnel The restructured route would still serve Upton Park (Green Street) and Portway which is a nightmare on occasions. Also if proposed for extension to the tunnel it would be difficult to serve Custom House Station unless extended via Keir Hardie towards Canning Town, this would over bus this section as it would have 474 (If changes ever go ahead or 241) , 147 and 104 which would be too much for the back roads. Edit ignore me a I'm forgetting the 304 goes to Custom House not the proposed 104 change via the tunnel. |
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Post by LD71YLO (BE37054) on Jan 12, 2021 20:26:51 GMT
I like Ideas 2 and 3 from the Uxbridge plans and the night service to Harrow. I think that the Uxbridge to Heathrow express bus could be better done by converting the A10 to express and routing the U7 to run via route A10 to Cherry Lane, via Holloway Lane and via route 350 to Terminal 5. The A10 would see a reduction in frequency to every 20 minutes.
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Post by Busboy105 on Jan 12, 2021 23:24:20 GMT
I think the issue with the 192 is that Edmonton Green to Tottenham Hale is a really popular flow, but obviously inappropriate for an 8.9 or 9m single decker bus. I do always think that at Edmonton Green the 192 should swap with the W8 running to the Leisure complex while the W8 takes over the bit to Tottenham Hale. I had that idea a long time ago. It makes perfect sense to me. There was consideration given a while back to extending the W8 to Tottenham Hale and potentially Walthamstow, with the W6 being diverted to the Leisure centre. Alongside the 192 instead of replacing it. Walthamstow’s a bit of a stretch considering the 230 already does that from Tottenham Hale but it would give parts of Forest Road a day link to Walthamstow. |
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Post by enviroPB on Jan 13, 2021 19:15:14 GMT
The 104 can suffer so horrid traffic in the Upton Park / East Ham area I dread to think what the reliability would be like if extended to Eltham.
One thing I have been thinking is how would Cars / Buses approach the new tunnel - I am guessing some major layout changes would need to be made if approaching from Silvertown Way. The the area near the tunnel was traditionally industrial until recently and is now very much residential so do feel for the people just moving in.
Don't forget the 104 is supposed to be restructured soon and I daren't say that the new structure may well have been done based on a future extension trhough the tunnel It may be a few years but I hope time is the healer to some of these half-baked ideas TfL had (has) for south Newham. One example of one such ill-thought out idea is having the 104 turn right onto High Street South from Lonsdale Avenue. It's a very well known traffic hotspot on the route and at present, the junction just isn't suitable for a high frequency bus service to turn right. The start of Lonsdale Avenue is very close to the A13 junction, so putting traffic lights at that junction is near impossible. Yellow boxes will only add to the A13 queues and make traffic flow worse in the long run. I'm a fan of the 304 being introduced but not at the cost of digging up High Street South. |
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Jan 13, 2021 19:49:06 GMT
Don't forget the 104 is supposed to be restructured soon and I daren't say that the new structure may well have been done based on a future extension trhough the tunnel It may be a few years but I hope time is the healer to some of these half-baked ideas TfL had (has) for south Newham. One example of one such ill-thought out idea is having the 104 turn right onto High Street South from Lonsdale Avenue. It's a very well known traffic hotspot on the route and at present, the junction just isn't suitable for a high frequency bus service to turn right. The start of Lonsdale Avenue is very close to the A13 junction, so putting traffic lights at that junction is near impossible. Yellow boxes will only add to the A13 queues and make traffic flow worse in the long run. I'm a fan of the 304 being introduced but not at the cost of digging up High Street South. This is something I was concerned about too, The only way I can see this working is if lights are introduced by Lonsdale Avenue, but instead of keeping it as two separate junctions it's treated as one huge junction instead. A simple fix however could be to use Greatfield Avenue which should prevent a more awkward turn, and any oncoming cars should be able to more easily see a waiting bus to give it room to pass ahead of them. I honestly think that the whole Newham changes need a revamp, there's far too much overlapping change in the area now. The 241 needs to be rerouted to Royal Wharf, but only can after its cut from Canning Town. Then is the 330 going to North Woolwich or North Woolwich Road? That's not been made clear either. A new stand has been erected on North Woolwich Road, however there's a clear North Woolwich blind for the 330 on the WH MMCs, not to mention there's an additional proposal to reroute the 330 to Custom House via the Connaught Bridge too. You've also got the 262 cut in the area and the 325 extension too which all overlap. I really think the changes could be "tidied up" in one way or the other. I know @dannyb has mentioned this quite a few times in the past, and I'll reiterate it and that's the 300 really should be renumbered upon this rerouting, it's effectively being turned inside out and will be using the same road in opposite directions which will end up confusing the living daylight out of people. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2021 20:09:31 GMT
It may be a few years but I hope time is the healer to some of these half-baked ideas TfL had (has) for south Newham. One example of one such ill-thought out idea is having the 104 turn right onto High Street South from Lonsdale Avenue. It's a very well known traffic hotspot on the route and at present, the junction just isn't suitable for a high frequency bus service to turn right. The start of Lonsdale Avenue is very close to the A13 junction, so putting traffic lights at that junction is near impossible. Yellow boxes will only add to the A13 queues and make traffic flow worse in the long run. I'm a fan of the 304 being introduced but not at the cost of digging up High Street South. This is something I was concerned about too, The only way I can see this working is if lights are introduced by Lonsdale Avenue, but instead of keeping it as two separate junctions it's treated as one huge junction instead. A simple fix however could be to use Greatfield Avenue which should prevent a more awkward turn, and any oncoming cars should be able to more easily see a waiting bus to give it room to pass ahead of them. I honestly think that the whole Newham changes need a revamp, there's far too much overlapping change in the area now. The 241 needs to be rerouted to Royal Wharf, but only can after its cut from Canning Town. Then is the 330 going to North Woolwich or North Woolwich Road? That's not been made clear either. A new stand has been erected on North Woolwich Road, however there's a clear North Woolwich blind for the 330 on the WH MMCs, not to mention there's an additional proposal to reroute the 330 to Custom House via the Connaught Bridge too. You've also got the 262 cut in the area and the 325 extension too which all overlap. I really think the changes could be "tidied up" in one way or the other. I know @dannyb has mentioned this quite a few times in the past, and I'll reiterate it and that's the 300 really should be renumbered upon this rerouting, it's effectively being turned inside out and will be using the same road in opposite directions which will end up confusing the living daylight out of people. Just to say I agree 100% about the Newham changes I am losing track of them myself and even mixed up the 104 /304 last night when the Silvertown Tunnel extension was being discussed.
Lets not even talk about the 300! I can't think of any route that has swapped directions like this and really do hope it is renumbered!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2021 20:12:18 GMT
Don't forget the 104 is supposed to be restructured soon and I daren't say that the new structure may well have been done based on a future extension trhough the tunnel It may be a few years but I hope time is the healer to some of these half-baked ideas TfL had (has) for south Newham. One example of one such ill-thought out idea is having the 104 turn right onto High Street South from Lonsdale Avenue. It's a very well known traffic hotspot on the route and at present, the junction just isn't suitable for a high frequency bus service to turn right. The start of Lonsdale Avenue is very close to the A13 junction, so putting traffic lights at that junction is near impossible. Yellow boxes will only add to the A13 queues and make traffic flow worse in the long run. I'm a fan of the 304 being introduced but not at the cost of digging up High Street South. Going off topic here - That turn is probably worse than where the D8 turns from Bazley Street into East India Dock Road. |
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Post by enviroPB on Jan 13, 2021 20:12:23 GMT
It may be a few years but I hope time is the healer to some of these half-baked ideas TfL had (has) for south Newham. One example of one such ill-thought out idea is having the 104 turn right onto High Street South from Lonsdale Avenue. It's a very well known traffic hotspot on the route and at present, the junction just isn't suitable for a high frequency bus service to turn right. The start of Lonsdale Avenue is very close to the A13 junction, so putting traffic lights at that junction is near impossible. Yellow boxes will only add to the A13 queues and make traffic flow worse in the long run. I'm a fan of the 304 being introduced but not at the cost of digging up High Street South. This is something I was concerned about too, The only way I can see this working is if lights are introduced by Lonsdale Avenue, but instead of keeping it as two separate junctions it's treated as one huge junction instead. A simple fix however could be to use Greatfield Avenue which should prevent a more awkward turn, and any oncoming cars should be able to more easily see a waiting bus to give it room to pass ahead of them. I honestly think that the whole Newham changes need a revamp, there's far too much overlapping change in the area now. The 241 needs to be rerouted to Royal Wharf, but only can after its cut from Canning Town. Then is the 330 going to North Woolwich or North Woolwich Road? That's not been made clear either. A new stand has been erected on North Woolwich Road, however there's a clear North Woolwich blind for the 330 on the WH MMCs, not to mention there's an additional proposal to reroute the 330 to Custom House via the Connaught Bridge too. You've also got the 262 cut in the area and the 325 extension too which all overlap. I really think the changes could be "tidied up" in one way or the other. I know @dannyb has mentioned this quite a few times in the past, and I'll reiterate it and that's the 300 really should be renumbered upon this rerouting, it's effectively being turned inside out and will be using the same road in opposite directions which will end up confusing the living daylight out of people. South Newham proposals have always been a hot steaming pile of crap! The super stand for the 304 at Custom House barely looks like it can handle one route, let alone the proposed 3 at one point from TfL and a double run of the 300. I'm a little gutted that the 300 didn't get extended to Stratford City via Manor Park & Wanstead Park. The new links it would have created would have been a great addition to the network; but as soon as TfL realised they were extending the 300 and paralleling Crossrail simultaneously, it was quietly dropped. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2021 20:14:19 GMT
This is something I was concerned about too, The only way I can see this working is if lights are introduced by Lonsdale Avenue, but instead of keeping it as two separate junctions it's treated as one huge junction instead. A simple fix however could be to use Greatfield Avenue which should prevent a more awkward turn, and any oncoming cars should be able to more easily see a waiting bus to give it room to pass ahead of them. I honestly think that the whole Newham changes need a revamp, there's far too much overlapping change in the area now. The 241 needs to be rerouted to Royal Wharf, but only can after its cut from Canning Town. Then is the 330 going to North Woolwich or North Woolwich Road? That's not been made clear either. A new stand has been erected on North Woolwich Road, however there's a clear North Woolwich blind for the 330 on the WH MMCs, not to mention there's an additional proposal to reroute the 330 to Custom House via the Connaught Bridge too. You've also got the 262 cut in the area and the 325 extension too which all overlap. I really think the changes could be "tidied up" in one way or the other. I know @dannyb has mentioned this quite a few times in the past, and I'll reiterate it and that's the 300 really should be renumbered upon this rerouting, it's effectively being turned inside out and will be using the same road in opposite directions which will end up confusing the living daylight out of people. South Newham proposals have always been a hot steaming pile of crap! The super stand for the 304 at Custom House barely looks like it can handle one route, let alone the proposed 3 at one point from TfL and a double run of the 300. I'm a little gutted that the 300 didn't get extended to Stratford City via Manor Park & Wanstead Park. The new links it would have created would have been a great addition to the network; but as soon as TfL realised they were extending the 300 and paralleling Crossrail simultaneously, it was quietly dropped. The 300 would not use that stand for a double run and was never proposed too as far as I know. The 300 would turn right off Victoria Dock Road into Freemasons Road like the 325 does now. |
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Jan 13, 2021 23:48:37 GMT
It may be a few years but I hope time is the healer to some of these half-baked ideas TfL had (has) for south Newham. One example of one such ill-thought out idea is having the 104 turn right onto High Street South from Lonsdale Avenue. It's a very well known traffic hotspot on the route and at present, the junction just isn't suitable for a high frequency bus service to turn right. The start of Lonsdale Avenue is very close to the A13 junction, so putting traffic lights at that junction is near impossible. Yellow boxes will only add to the A13 queues and make traffic flow worse in the long run. I'm a fan of the 304 being introduced but not at the cost of digging up High Street South. Going off topic here - That turn is probably worse than where the D8 turns from Bazley Street into East India Dock Road. I honestly don't know who on earth thought that turn on the D8 would be acceptable, the fact its right by the lights means that when a bus tries to make it, it either needs to wait forever or it will block traffic coming the other way when it tries to force its way in which causes traffic and many angry drivers. This is something I was concerned about too, The only way I can see this working is if lights are introduced by Lonsdale Avenue, but instead of keeping it as two separate junctions it's treated as one huge junction instead. A simple fix however could be to use Greatfield Avenue which should prevent a more awkward turn, and any oncoming cars should be able to more easily see a waiting bus to give it room to pass ahead of them. I honestly think that the whole Newham changes need a revamp, there's far too much overlapping change in the area now. The 241 needs to be rerouted to Royal Wharf, but only can after its cut from Canning Town. Then is the 330 going to North Woolwich or North Woolwich Road? That's not been made clear either. A new stand has been erected on North Woolwich Road, however there's a clear North Woolwich blind for the 330 on the WH MMCs, not to mention there's an additional proposal to reroute the 330 to Custom House via the Connaught Bridge too. You've also got the 262 cut in the area and the 325 extension too which all overlap. I really think the changes could be "tidied up" in one way or the other. I know @dannyb has mentioned this quite a few times in the past, and I'll reiterate it and that's the 300 really should be renumbered upon this rerouting, it's effectively being turned inside out and will be using the same road in opposite directions which will end up confusing the living daylight out of people. South Newham proposals have always been a hot steaming pile of crap! The super stand for the 304 at Custom House barely looks like it can handle one route, let alone the proposed 3 at one point from TfL and a double run of the 300. I'm a little gutted that the 300 didn't get extended to Stratford City via Manor Park & Wanstead Park. The new links it would have created would have been a great addition to the network; but as soon as TfL realised they were extending the 300 and paralleling Crossrail simultaneously, it was quietly dropped. While on about routes from the East Ham area to Stratford, something really should have been done about the Plashet Road corridor while they were at this. I believe the 238 and 104 are now in second place and third place respectively for pax per mile and that corridor between Stratford and Upton Park is probably the cause for most of it, a third route is desperately needed down there. The 104 and 238 at Stratford are just total disaster zones heading down there, I feel sorry for anyone who tries to board at the Stratford Broadway stop as I've not had a bus stop there in months now as they're always at full capacity leaving the bus station. Maybe the 304 when introduced should actually run to Stratford City via Wanstead Park as you suggest? It will certainly provide the East Ham area with an alternative to at least the 238 while also being comparable in time taken to reach Stratford as well. |
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