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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2017 19:23:41 GMT
It will be interesting! They could make use of Stratford City / International bus stations and terminate bus routes such as 158 /257 that side during the works. I know its not ideal but could ease pressure and cut back on delays for buses arriving at Stratford. I can see how the 158 could be diverted but not the 257 without losing a sizeable section between Crownfield Road and Stratford. To reach Stratford City the 257 would have to go right round the gyratory which would seem to be pointless. Sorry was thinking Windmill road could be used but just seen this is one way.
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Post by redbus on May 6, 2017 22:44:48 GMT
I wonder how unuseable the bus services in the area are going to be during this. I just hope that it is not bad after the works. As said by vjaska , there is no guarantee removing the gyratory will make things better. I bang my head everytime I am in Tottenham headed towards central London and I am stuck in traffic that was not there before because of the removal of the bus lane. Fortunately, for my head, I dont do that journey too often. This is all about changes to the public realm and never mind anyone who has to get around by road. The artists impressions after the changes always look pretty, but the result is usually very different. Some of the public realm changes are great ideas and have an overall benefit, but others don't work out so well. For instance take a look at Braham Park around the back of Aldgate East today, can one really say that has worked out well? Take a look at the use of it, how it looks now and compare the traffic as was against today.
A gyratory is a very efficient way of dispersing lots of traffic which is why they were implemented in the first place. Nowadays clever traffic light control will give a much better throughput than in the days when the gyratory was built, but set against that there is now much more traffic and a gyratory is still considerably more efficient than clever traffic light control as it makes better use of road space.
I hope Stratford will be one of those schemes that work well and that traffic will be no worse afterwards, but looking at the scheme I do have doubts. As for the period during the works it really depends what effort is put into minimising traffic delays. TfL's record here is extremely poor, for example the recent Aldgate / CS2 work often resulted in the bus journey between Liverpool Street and Aldgate East, normally a few minutes, taking an hour, even off peak at lunchtime. There's plenty of scope for improvement!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2017 14:44:57 GMT
Looks like work starts this month. Major works expect delays warning signs are being displayed on the A13 in Beckton and Limehouse.
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Sept 10, 2017 15:30:37 GMT
Looks like work starts this month. Major works expect delays warning signs are being displayed on the A13 in Beckton and Limehouse. The fact they're putting up signs in Beckton and Limehouse doesn't bode well I wonder if we'll get a huge influx of "temporary" timetables on all the routes later this month with a load of reduced frequencies.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2017 15:44:23 GMT
Looks like work starts this month. Major works expect delays warning signs are being displayed on the A13 in Beckton and Limehouse. The fact they're putting up signs in Beckton and Limehouse doesn't bode well  I wonder if we'll get a huge influx of "temporary" timetables on all the routes later this month with a load of reduced frequencies. Sorry I wasn't very clear the signs are the ones used normally for traffic delays etc. there could be others elsewhere.
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Post by vjaska on Sept 10, 2017 15:51:06 GMT
Looks like work starts this month. Major works expect delays warning signs are being displayed on the A13 in Beckton and Limehouse. Thanks for the heads up - what a mess Stratford will be just for a another ill thought out so called improvement works.
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Post by Alexis on Sept 10, 2017 15:56:03 GMT
Looks like work starts this month. Major works expect delays warning signs are being displayed on the A13 in Beckton and Limehouse. Thanks for the heads up - what a mess Stratford will be just for a another ill thought out so called improvement works. I think it's a little unfair to call them "so called improvement works" before work is finished. The CS2 works were a genuine improvement, as were the Aldgate works in my opinion, so I think we should at least allow the works to be completed before jumping to conclusions. Looks like work starts this month. Major works expect delays warning signs are being displayed on the A13 in Beckton and Limehouse. 18 September to be exact (at least, based on the signs I've seen on Stratford High Street).
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Post by sid on Sept 10, 2017 15:58:53 GMT
Thanks for the heads up - what a mess Stratford will be just for a another ill thought out so called improvement works. I think it's a little unfair to call them "so called improvement works" before work is finished. The CS2 works were a genuine improvement, as were the Aldgate works in my opinion, so I think we should at least allow the works to be completed before jumping to conclusions. I agree and I think most of these schemes offer a genuine improvement to the vast majority.
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Post by vjaska on Sept 10, 2017 17:02:57 GMT
Thanks for the heads up - what a mess Stratford will be just for a another ill thought out so called improvement works. I think it's a little unfair to call them "so called improvement works" before work is finished. The CS2 works were a genuine improvement, as were the Aldgate works in my opinion, so I think we should at least allow the works to be completed before jumping to conclusions. Looks like work starts this month. Major works expect delays warning signs are being displayed on the A13 in Beckton and Limehouse. 18 September to be exact (at least, based on the signs I've seen on Stratford High Street). Well I'm afraid I disagree - I think every junction improvement has been a waste of money and in some cases, removed or worsened convenient interchanges just to pander towards cyclists who after getting their own way, still break the rules of the road. The only decent improvement idea they came up was for building a flyover over Purley Way at Fiveways but no surprise to see they didn't take that option. They've still to ruin Tulse Hill Vauxhall & Wandsworth with similar schemes and before you've asked - yes I've used Aldgate since and it's terrible personally what they've done to it.
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Post by Alexis on Sept 10, 2017 18:05:45 GMT
I think it's a little unfair to call them "so called improvement works" before work is finished. The CS2 works were a genuine improvement, as were the Aldgate works in my opinion, so I think we should at least allow the works to be completed before jumping to conclusions. 18 September to be exact (at least, based on the signs I've seen on Stratford High Street). Well I'm afraid I disagree - I think every junction improvement has been a waste of money and in some cases, removed or worsened convenient interchanges just to pander towards cyclists who after getting their own way, still break the rules of the road. The only decent improvement idea they came up was for building a flyover over Purley Way at Fiveways but no surprise to see they didn't take that option. They've still to ruin Tulse Hill Vauxhall & Wandsworth with similar schemes and before you've asked - yes I've used Aldgate since and it's terrible personally what they've done to it. I can't speak about other junction improvement works since I don't travel through them regularly (or even at all), but with Aldgate, I travel through the junction at least 3-4 times per week, both as a pedestrian and a bus user, and I have to say that for me personally the current layout is much better than the old layout. For pedestrians the crossings are much simpler and easier to understand, unlike before when it could be a bit of a struggle to work out how to get where you wanted. Also for bus passengers the old one-way system made it rather confusing to work out where you needed to go to catch a bus, but with the current layout it's a lot more obvious. But since you've already used the new Aldgate, I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree.
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Post by Alexis on Sept 10, 2017 18:07:50 GMT
I think it's a little unfair to call them "so called improvement works" before work is finished. The CS2 works were a genuine improvement, as were the Aldgate works in my opinion, so I think we should at least allow the works to be completed before jumping to conclusions. I agree and I think most of these schemes offer a genuine improvement to the vast majority. I agree, I think car users are usually worse off overall, but considering the improvements that pedestrians and cyclists get, I'd say overall the new layouts offer the best compromise, unlike one-way systems which very much benefit car users only.
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Post by sid on Sept 10, 2017 18:18:49 GMT
I agree and I think most of these schemes offer a genuine improvement to the vast majority. I agree, I think car users are usually worse off overall, but considering the improvements that pedestrians and cyclists get, I'd say overall the new layouts offer the best compromise, unlike one-way systems which very much benefit car users only. I totally agree and I think the motoring lobby have held sway for far too long in this country and it's only right that they should come behind public transport users, cyclists and pedestrians in the pecking order and I say that as a car owner myself. I very rarely drive into Central London though as using public transport is so much easier.
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Post by Hassaan on Sept 10, 2017 19:25:51 GMT
Well I'm afraid I disagree - I think every junction improvement has been a waste of money and in some cases, removed or worsened convenient interchanges just to pander towards cyclists who after getting their own way, still break the rules of the road. The only decent improvement idea they came up was for building a flyover over Purley Way at Fiveways but no surprise to see they didn't take that option. They've still to ruin Tulse Hill Vauxhall & Wandsworth with similar schemes and before you've asked - yes I've used Aldgate since and it's terrible personally what they've done to it. I can't speak about other junction improvement works since I don't travel through them regularly (or even at all), but with Aldgate, I travel through the junction at least 3-4 times per week, both as a pedestrian and a bus user, and I have to say that for me personally the current layout is much better than the old layout. For pedestrians the crossings are much simpler and easier to understand, unlike before when it could be a bit of a struggle to work out how to get where you wanted. Also for bus passengers the old one-way system made it rather confusing to work out where you needed to go to catch a bus, but with the current layout it's a lot more obvious. But since you've already used the new Aldgate, I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree. Much of what you've written above also applies to Stratford. It is very annoying that some routes only serve the station in one direction, with the other direction being a trek though the shopping centre (and one that can be quite intimidating too at certain times) or the long way round the outside. Or get moaned at on here for daring to use a bus for one stop .
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Sept 10, 2017 20:10:37 GMT
I can't speak about other junction improvement works since I don't travel through them regularly (or even at all), but with Aldgate, I travel through the junction at least 3-4 times per week, both as a pedestrian and a bus user, and I have to say that for me personally the current layout is much better than the old layout. For pedestrians the crossings are much simpler and easier to understand, unlike before when it could be a bit of a struggle to work out how to get where you wanted. Also for bus passengers the old one-way system made it rather confusing to work out where you needed to go to catch a bus, but with the current layout it's a lot more obvious. But since you've already used the new Aldgate, I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree. Much of what you've written above also applies to Stratford. It is very annoying that some routes only serve the station in one direction, with the other direction being a trek though the shopping centre (and one that can be quite intimidating too at certain times) or the long way round the outside. Or get moaned at on here for daring to use a bus for one stop . This is the one reason and quite possible the only reason I am supporting the works, some routes will serve the bus station in both directions (which is better than the case now) and it can make life so much more easier. However I really hope this all gets planned out properly. Some adequate traffic management at the bus station needs to be put in place, currently the bus station gets jammed with buses as it is and doubling the amount of 25s which run through there won't help matters . What I'd personally do is run the 25 and 425 westbound around via the Grove so that towards Holborn Circus/Clapton they pick up on the new stop opposite the main bus station as opposed to having to navigate the whole bus station as per plan.
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Post by brutxi on Sept 10, 2017 20:33:25 GMT
Much of what you've written above also applies to Stratford. It is very annoying that some routes only serve the station in one direction, with the other direction being a trek though the shopping centre (and one that can be quite intimidating too at certain times) or the long way round the outside. Or get moaned at on here for daring to use a bus for one stop . This is the one reason and quite possible the only reason I am supporting the works, some routes will serve the bus station in both directions (which is better than the case now) and it can make life so much more easier. However I really hope this all gets planned out properly. Some adequate traffic management at the bus station needs to be put in place, currently the bus station gets jammed with buses as it is and doubling the amount of 25s which run through there won't help matters . What I'd personally do is run the 25 and 425 westbound around via the Grove so that towards Holborn Circus/Clapton they pick up on the new stop opposite the main bus station as opposed to having to navigate the whole bus station as per plan. Is there a time frame for the works? One can assume the postponement of the extension of 425 to Ilford could be due to the works.
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