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Post by sid on Dec 31, 2018 11:23:34 GMT
No buses were anywhere near loaded to the windscreen when I was in Oxford Street about midday on Saturday. The only hint of overcrowding was on the 390 towards Archway hence my suggestion of rerouting the 73 via Vere Street. These problems are surely down to inadequate Sunday services which happens in a lot of areas rather than anything unique to Oxford Street? Similar overcrowding occurs in many town centres when the shops close on a Sunday. I hope nobody is holding their breath awaiting this backlash and I wonder when the penny is going to drop and people realise Oxford Street is actually more pleasant with less buses? It is unfortunate that the opening of Crossrail has been delayed, and I do think the 25 change should have been postponed until it is, but not the end of the world. I hope nobody minds me adding a dose of reality? Of course buses won't be that loaded at midday. You have to give people time to get to the shops and then shop. There is some reality for you.
Did you make any late afternoon or evening time observations? I agree with the comment about the 73, and maybe the same for the 55 also...
I have been along Oxford Street at various times since the changes and not noticed any particular overcrowding except on the 390. It's really not unusual to find overcrowded buses around closing time on a Sunday, in fact here's a photo, albeit not a particularly good one, of the stop opposite the Greyhound in Bromley at about 17.00 on Sunday 23rd. www.flickr.com/photos/154741497@N03/45523439065/
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Post by sid on Dec 31, 2018 7:47:03 GMT
No buses were anywhere near loaded to the windscreen when I was in Oxford Street about midday on Saturday. The only hint of overcrowding was on the 390 towards Archway hence my suggestion of rerouting the 73 via Vere Street.
These problems are surely down to inadequate Sunday services which happens in a lot of areas rather than anything unique to Oxford Street? Similar overcrowding occurs in many town centres when the shops close on a Sunday.
I hope nobody is holding their breath awaiting this backlash and I wonder when the penny is going to drop and people realise Oxford Street is actually more pleasant with less buses?
It is unfortunate that the opening of Crossrail has been delayed, and I do think the 25 change should have been postponed until it is, but not the end of the world.
I hope nobody minds me adding a dose of reality?
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Post by sid on Dec 30, 2018 21:35:36 GMT
On the way home from work this afternoon every bus was heaving along Oxford Street, and it was a Sunday night. I hope TfL are proud they've cut a load of routes and they're planning to cut more. Picture 1 Picture 2The 94 and 148 are two of many routes with an inadequate Sunday service, in many areas Sunday shopping hours are busier than Saturdays.
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Post by sid on Dec 30, 2018 16:00:16 GMT
Hopefully a simple question - where does the 246 terminate / start from at Chartwell? I know it's a few months before it resumes service to Chartwell but Google maps isn't clear as to what happens - presumably because there is no timetable / stop data to reflect on the map. Does it turn via the Car Park facility? That looks to be the only viable way for a bus to turn round. In the car park, goes in one entrance and out the other. There is a car park attendant present in case the driver has any problems.
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Post by sid on Dec 30, 2018 0:07:54 GMT
Had a wander around Hyde Park and Oxford Street yesterday. Some observations: At the height of Saturday passenger traffic, 23s were at best carrying penny numbers to/from Hammersmith. Job done. Almost every bus I saw on Oxford Street was busy to full, even 7s and 113s. 94s were seemingly the busiest buses, whereas surprisingly 139s were close to empty, more so than 159s! Was there a wall of red vehicles? No. It was a wall of taxis and minicabs continuously stopping to pick up anyone and anything. Why is Oxford Street traffic so bad? Continual traffic lights and the plethora of non-bus vehicles. Wigmore Street was very heavily congested and appeared unsuitable for ANY buses. Colour me not surprised at all. The whole Oxford St bus route rationalisation exercise is a disaster - unless you are a cab / minicab driver. It demonstrates incompetence on a large scale. It's not perfect but it's hardly the catastrophe some people would like it to be.
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Post by sid on Dec 29, 2018 20:06:56 GMT
I was in Oxford Street about midday today and everything was fine. www.flickr.com/photos/154741497@N03/31576705177/in/dateposted/As for the 23 the entire route is pretty quiet including the Westbourne Park end. I have noticed since the change that the 9 seems a lot busier as does the 390 and one small change I would make is to reroute the 73 via Vere Street to serve the stop outside John Lewis. The Holles Street routes back when the 25 was bendy used to go via Vere Street. It used to subject the routes to a lot of congestion so was changed, although the route via Great Portland Street is far worse for congestion so why they did it is beyond me. 55s quite often go via Vere Street although don't serve any stops until Great Titchfield Street. Oxford Street was jammed with cabs this evening for sure! Presumably they were rerouted just to reduce bus movements across the Oxford Circus junction but with the 10 gone I think at least the 73 could be rerouted that way to serve a common stop with the 390.
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Post by sid on Dec 29, 2018 19:41:31 GMT
TV news footage of Oxford Street shops on Thursday showed, as you say, loads of black cabs and other cars in a line, with perhaps one bus in the middle distance and another, coming the other way, in the far distance, and this BEFORE the cull is complete. Boxing Day shopping numbers were said to be up significantly on last year in the area, in contrast to other places in the south east. Wonder how many thought ''ooh, Crossrail's open, let's go up West!' Hopefully the number of minicabs will be reduced when the have to pay the congestion charge from next April. I was in Oxford Street about midday today and everything was fine. www.flickr.com/photos/154741497@N03/31576705177/in/dateposted/As for the 23 the entire route is pretty quiet including the Westbourne Park end. I have noticed since the change that the 9 seems a lot busier as does the 390 and one small change I would make is to reroute the 73 via Vere Street to serve the stop outside John Lewis.
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Post by sid on Dec 28, 2018 16:59:39 GMT
What part of the 174 is running on New Years Eve? Tfl are, as per usual, not very forthcoming with information And the 45,185 and 388? Incredibly poor to announce only part of these routes would be served without saying which part!
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Post by sid on Dec 28, 2018 13:38:40 GMT
There are also reports of heavy loadings on the RT service on the 430 between Putney and Roehampton. Of which how many were genuine commuters I wonder. You can't use that an example for a Christmas Day service. Most apparently, there are photos on Facebook.
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Post by sid on Dec 28, 2018 9:34:41 GMT
Must just add here that two of our (Metrobus) Fastway 10 early Christmas morning trips to Gatwick had to leave people behind as they were so full. Surely TfL can provide a limited service to Heathrow - judging by the 10 situation I’ve no doubt they’d be used. There are also reports of heavy loadings on the RT service on the 430 between Putney and Roehampton.
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Post by sid on Dec 27, 2018 22:27:19 GMT
This incident got a brief mention on BBC national news, no serious injuries and police are continuing to investigate the circumstances.
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Post by sid on Dec 27, 2018 22:21:16 GMT
If the 353 has 5 minutes stand time at AVI it is hardly surprising that the service is unattractive to the Courtwood Lane passengers .... Never see anyone waiting for it at my Mum's local stop now .... Big change from T31 days ... another example of stupid changes resulting in reduced passenger numbers! Like TFL cares, less hassle. What are they supposed to do? Drivers need toilets. The Courtwood Lane section may as well be withdrawn anyway.
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Post by sid on Dec 27, 2018 21:27:38 GMT
What's the point of running empty buses round all night whether they are free to use or not? Sigh, most of the buses aren't empty is my point. Very few buck the trend; from the 2016 list, I know the 275 isn't bursting at the seams nor was the 432 when I down at Brixton one New Year's Eve. Now the 432 is running all night unlike say the 161 which has seen generous New Year's bph at night & generous loads. Funding has severely scuppered coverage at night this year, I admit, but I assure you buses are not running empty for most of the night. I really don't want to get into the corner of 'you have to ride these services to know what you're talking about' but unless you're on these services on the night yourself, or TfL magically release the data of patronage of services on NYE then I'll take your contradictions with a pinch of salt. I'm still dogged to alter your fascination that it's empty buses that are being withdrawn. Buses running on the 73 in addition to the N73 were well used but now have been removed. What's happened instead is resources transfer onto the 476 where I'm sure capacity will be superfluous north of Stoke Newington; or what about the N35 when it had 8bph at night between Shoreditch and Brixton. Look how the 45 curtailed to E&C will support the N35 there where TfL have previously pulled night bus resources. Are you sure the 73 in the former example was running empty all night for TfL to withdraw additional services on it? I don't doubt that routes like the N73 will be busier than usual and routes serving North Greenwich. I was just making the point that I'm not greatly surprised that suburban routes like the 229,269 and 412 won't be running.
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Post by sid on Dec 27, 2018 20:48:33 GMT
Of course poor usage of these services might have also had something to do with it? The 412 is particularly baffling considering how low daytime usage is. It might but then I have had reliable reports from past years from a reliable and trustworthy observer that the 412 (alongside many other routes) did indeed carry reasonable loads on NYE night. I've said this on here before. It's sad it keep needs repeating. Given that you argue strongly that there should be buses on Xmas Day I am surprised you seem to be less enthused about another form of "one night only" limited transport provision that would allow people to get home from functions or visiting friends or even from work on a special occasion day. There is years of evidence that NYE night transport is well used and necessary in order to prevent normal night bus services from being overwhelmed and also by providing an additional safe form of transport rather than leaving people at risk from using potentially unsafe modes / fly by night "mini cab" drivers [1] seeking to make money at a time of high demand. An effective set of night bus links in outer London also makes sense when you have overnight operation of the tube network, parts of the Overground and the DLR. [1] and just to be clear this is NOT a sweeping comment about black cabs / Uber / mini cabs. It is a reference to a tiny number of rogue cab operations that work on the fringe of the law and whose drivers may not exactly be trustworthy. I find it difficult to believe that the 412 would have carried any significant numbers. If other NYE extra routes are well used then all well and good but it would appear that is generally not the case although an increased service on many existing night routes will be needed . It's about providing public transport where it's needed, and there is clearly a need for some level of service on Christmas Day.
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Post by sid on Dec 27, 2018 19:26:11 GMT
Of course poor usage of these services might have also had something to do with it? The 412 is particularly baffling considering how low daytime usage is. If travel is free, where does usage come into it? It would only be relevant if the resources to dethrone a route running all night for NYE was recycled to another route; that rarely happens. The priority has always been coverage of areas not served by normal night buses for New Year's services, followed by supporting capacity on key trunk routes/corridors. The comprehensive list from 2016 compared to the pitiful coverage we have now means a couple things: a) that TfL have relied on the weekend Night Tube bus routes to form a skeleton service for outer London (37% of the night bus coverage in 2018 compared to in 2016) and b) what routes that are given all night services are mostly in inner London. Instead of propping up night routes like the N133, N15 or N109, their daytime counterparts like the 118/333, 115 or 109 respectively are coming into the picture. It seems like this year, main corridors are the focus of the funding for NYE night routes. It isn't as blatant as to do with which route is poorly used. If it was, then how can you explain to me why the Romford Road corridor has seen a reduction in bus services this year; even in previous years when the N86 was at 8pbh to Ilford & 6pbh to Romford, and with the (N)25 at 10bph in the past, both routes couldn't cope with the crowds at Stratford?! The N86 hasn't been selected it seems to have an enhanced service and the N25 will be 8bph during that night; with the TfL Rail line to Shenfield out (as usual ) and a bus replacement service every 30 minutes, I dread to think how the N86 with its 3bph will cope come New Years. What's the point of running empty buses round all night whether they are free to use or not?
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