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Post by vjaska on Jan 27, 2019 23:29:40 GMT
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Post by snowman on Jan 28, 2019 5:47:03 GMT
Cardiff has a population of 350,000 (City boundary) of 890,000 for whole Urban Zone So about 10% of London’s 8m. (or 9m if you take M25 as boundary) Cardiff lost £1.9m on buses and London therefore lost £19m. actually a staggering £650m (35 times more per person) Guess which city is living in real world, and which is on a financial suicide mission |
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Post by busaholic on Jan 28, 2019 11:54:02 GMT
Cardiff has a population of 350,000 (City boundary) of 890,000 for whole Urban Zone So about 10% of London’s 8m. (or 9m if you take M25 as boundary) Cardiff lost £1.9m on buses and London therefore lost £19m. actually a staggering £650m (35 times more per person) Guess which city is living in real world, and which is on a financial suicide mission I took an intense dislike to Cardiff on my only visit (guess I shouldn't have inadvertently chosen a Wales rugby home game day!) but I follow with interest from a distance the goings-on in the remaining municipal bus operators. Nottingham, Lothian and Reading (and now Blackpool) are regularly cited for positive developments, so why not Cardiff? Newport, Halton, Warrington and Ipswich, all being much smaller places, can't be expected to emulate the others, but the news from Cardiff always seems to be depressing, especially anything to do with bus stations. I better add that I'm using the term 'municipal' for convenience: i'm aware of the actual financial arrangements.  |
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Post by snoggle on Jan 28, 2019 12:38:38 GMT
Sadly I'm not too surprised by this. Cardiff Bus has been struggling for a while despite attempts to lower its cost base and invest in the fleet. There have also been issues with the management set up as well in recent years. |
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Post by MetrolineGA1511 on Feb 2, 2019 20:24:33 GMT
IIRC there was a time around 6-7 years ago when Cardiff City Council were considering selling a 40% stake in Cardiff Bus to help balance the Council's books.
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Post by tony4387 on Feb 2, 2019 22:11:15 GMT
Maybe the council will be considering a sale or partial sale
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Post by busaholic on Feb 2, 2019 23:22:49 GMT
Maybe the council will be considering a sale or partial sale Unless it was a fire sale I can't see a buyer.... though maybe those RATP dark horses might prove me wrong. |
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Post by VWH1414 on Feb 3, 2019 11:56:26 GMT
Maybe the council will be considering a sale or partial sale Unless it was a fire sale I can't see a buyer.... though maybe those RATP dark horses might prove me wrong. You also have Comfort Delgro who haven't long bought NAT who might go for Cardiff bus, especially as they can just merge it with current operations. Either way I can't see Cardiff Bus staying as a municipal for much longer, with a sale most likely on the horizon. |
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Post by snoggle on Feb 3, 2019 15:43:07 GMT
Unless it was a fire sale I can't see a buyer.... though maybe those RATP dark horses might prove me wrong. You also have Comfort Delgro who haven't long bought NAT who might go for Cardiff bus, especially as they can just merge it with current operations. Either way I can't see Cardiff Bus staying as a municipal for much longer, with a sale most likely on the horizon. I suspect a Comfort Delgro grab for Cardiff Bus might not get past the competition authorities. It would given them a virtual monopoly on many city services. There isn't much of a presence from Stagecoach, First or Newport Buses apart from odd corridors. I can see Stagecoach wanting Cardiff Bus - it's an ideal add on to their services to / from the Valleys. |
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Post by VWH1414 on Feb 3, 2019 16:46:30 GMT
You also have Comfort Delgro who haven't long bought NAT who might go for Cardiff bus, especially as they can just merge it with current operations. Either way I can't see Cardiff Bus staying as a municipal for much longer, with a sale most likely on the horizon. I suspect a Comfort Delgro grab for Cardiff Bus might not get past the competition authorities. It would given them a virtual monopoly on many city services. There isn't much of a presence from Stagecoach, First or Newport Buses apart from odd corridors. I can see Stagecoach wanting Cardiff Bus - it's an ideal add on to their services to / from the Valleys. That's true, forgot about the competition authorities. Thinking about it though Go Ahead could also be a contender to get it, they've expanded a lot recently and bought the municipal Thamesdown Transport back in 2017 and may take this as an opportunity to branch out into Wales, if not then like you said I think Stagecoach will be the next most likely candidate for Cardiff Bus. Cardiff Bus don't seem to be the only one struggling, Halton Transport is another that, from what I've heard, isn't doing too well. Of the few municipals left, from what I can tell only Warringtons Own Buses and Reading Buses are still doing very well. |
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Post by MetrolineGA1511 on Feb 3, 2019 18:25:51 GMT
I suspect a Comfort Delgro grab for Cardiff Bus might not get past the competition authorities. It would given them a virtual monopoly on many city services. There isn't much of a presence from Stagecoach, First or Newport Buses apart from odd corridors. I can see Stagecoach wanting Cardiff Bus - it's an ideal add on to their services to / from the Valleys. That's true, forgot about the competition authorities. Thinking about it though Go Ahead could also be a contender to get it, they've expanded a lot recently and bought the municipal Thamesdown Transport back in 2017 and may take this as an opportunity to branch out into Wales, if not then like you said I think Stagecoach will be the next most likely candidate for Cardiff Bus. Cardiff Bus don't seem to be the only one struggling, Halton Transport is another that, from what I've heard, isn't doing too well. Of the few municipals left, from what I can tell only Warringtons Own Buses and Reading Buses are still doing very well. Indeed, Halton have not boght any new buses for many years. They have recently relied on second-hand purchases such as ex-Metrobus OmniCities and ex-Avon MCVs. I think other municipals doing well are Lothian and Nottingham. Even Blackpool have recently bought significant batches of new buses. |
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Post by danorak on Feb 3, 2019 19:39:17 GMT
I suspect a Comfort Delgro grab for Cardiff Bus might not get past the competition authorities. It would given them a virtual monopoly on many city services. There isn't much of a presence from Stagecoach, First or Newport Buses apart from odd corridors. I can see Stagecoach wanting Cardiff Bus - it's an ideal add on to their services to / from the Valleys. That's true, forgot about the competition authorities. Thinking about it though Go Ahead could also be a contender to get it, they've expanded a lot recently and bought the municipal Thamesdown Transport back in 2017 and may take this as an opportunity to branch out into Wales, if not then like you said I think Stagecoach will be the next most likely candidate for Cardiff Bus. Cardiff Bus don't seem to be the only one struggling, Halton Transport is another that, from what I've heard, isn't doing too well. Of the few municipals left, from what I can tell only Warringtons Own Buses and Reading Buses are still doing very well. All of which says to me that it's all about what partnerships you can set up, and non-bus specific traffic issues, rather than ownership. Nottingham has some well developed partnerships together with a workplace parking levy and a tram (the municipal operator achieves the same rating in Transport Focus research as Stagecoach and Trent Barton). Reading does some interesting things but the local authority is not interested in making the local road network bus friendly. I thought Cardiff's offering when I was last there was hugely passenger unfriendly. |
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Post by snoggle on Feb 3, 2019 20:15:36 GMT
I suspect a Comfort Delgro grab for Cardiff Bus might not get past the competition authorities. It would given them a virtual monopoly on many city services. There isn't much of a presence from Stagecoach, First or Newport Buses apart from odd corridors. I can see Stagecoach wanting Cardiff Bus - it's an ideal add on to their services to / from the Valleys. That's true, forgot about the competition authorities. Thinking about it though Go Ahead could also be a contender to get it, they've expanded a lot recently and bought the municipal Thamesdown Transport back in 2017 and may take this as an opportunity to branch out into Wales, if not then like you said I think Stagecoach will be the next most likely candidate for Cardiff Bus. Cardiff Bus don't seem to be the only one struggling, Halton Transport is another that, from what I've heard, isn't doing too well. Of the few municipals left, from what I can tell only Warringtons Own Buses and Reading Buses are still doing very well. I agree that Go Ahead could be a contender for Cardiff Bus but I think it's a tad remote for them. They haven't got anything nearby whereas their other operations all have some level of neighbouring company to allow overhead costs to be pulled down. I suspect it might be a step too far for them. It's a better strategic fit for Stagecoach and could allow them other scheduling efficiencies on routes that currently run into Cardiff. Of course the Council would quickly be landed with a bill for "socially necessary" services that may not be a burden on their coffers now. I am surprised Halton hasn't been taken over or run out of business. Arriva and Stagecoach could easily do so if they put their minds to it. Halton's network is surprisingly decent for what is not a particularly prosperous area. They do, though, clearly have a fleet replacement issue given their inability to raise sufficient funds to buy new vehicles. |
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Post by snowman on Apr 27, 2021 20:25:57 GMT
It seems Cardiff is back ordering
Just placed an order for 36 Yutong E12 12m electric buses
Also taking 12 Citaros that were with Bus Vannin (Isle of Man)
Yutong seems a popular choice in South Wales as Newport bus has 16 more on order
I understand that Stagecoach Caerphilly has cancelled its 16 electric buses, (mix of solo and metrocity) which is why the electric bus grant was reassigned within South Wales.
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Post by smiler52 on May 3, 2021 22:50:57 GMT
It seems Cardiff is back ordering Just placed an order for 36 Yutong E12 12m electric buses Also taking 12 Citaros that were with Bus Vannin (Isle of Man) Yutong seems a popular choice in South Wales as Newport bus has 16 more on order I understand that Stagecoach Caerphilly has cancelled its 16 electric buses, (mix of solo and metrocity) which is why the electric bus grant was reassigned within South Wales. having been on both the byd 507/521 batch and newports yutongs I have to admit I do like the yutongs better also note they now own the Former demonstrator YG18CVS |
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