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Metroline
Nov 28, 2019 14:35:34 GMT
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Post by ADH45258 on Nov 28, 2019 14:35:34 GMT
I am wondering how well the electric buses are performing on the 43 and 134 given that we are nearly in December and both routes *should* have been fully converted by now.
To be fair on the 43, most days it is just BDEs during the morning and afternoons, however come evening hybrids appear. Conversion of the N43 to electric buses hasn't even started. All the electric 43s bar two are now in service, so you would expect at least the complete day service including evenings to be BDEs. At worst you would expect no more than 2 hybrids as replacement for the two BDEs yet to go into service.
There are 16 OMEs in service on the 134, though only about half seem to see service each day. With 16 OMEs you would expect at least half the service to be electric buses.
I wonder when these routes will go fully electric? I do question just how long it will take fot the 94 to convert and all ADH/VHs to leave S. With only the 148 to pull buses from (which can't be used on the 94) there may have to be a retention of some hybrids for till atleast summer next year. Can't help thinking it would make sense to transfer another route in (maybe the 306) to atleast have an option for the N94 if the Electrics needs to charge up. Probably easier to have loans from other garages. Otherwise perhaps RATP could move the 72 to V or RP in exchange for a hybrid DD route (likely the 306). Though unlikely, as the 306 will probably be quite a competitive tender, RATP could perhaps bid with electrics to increase chances of retaining it, in which case moving to S would make more sense to use charging infrastructure.
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Metroline
Nov 28, 2019 14:40:16 GMT
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Post by ADH45258 on Nov 28, 2019 14:40:16 GMT
I think the OMEs will displace remaining VMHs at PB to PA, enabling some VWs to come to EW to finally convert route 292. Then spare TEHs ex-route 266 not needed for route 282 could in theory enable further SEL withdrawals. In practice Metroline have prioritised TE withdrawals, no doubt as these have a higher resale value than SELs. Plenty of reshuffle options utilising the surplus hybrids. I could see the TEs at UX being a priority for withdrawal as these are ex-First examples (with DEs, Metroline have been withdrawing various ex-First examples including some newer batches, but retaining the original 08reg). Could be more TEs though going to UX, perhaps more from PB, being replaced there by hybrids? Or VWs could go to UX for the U3/U4 if alternative vehicles go to EW.
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Post by wirewiper on Nov 28, 2019 16:19:59 GMT
I am wondering how well the electric buses are performing on the 43 and 134 given that we are nearly in December and both routes *should* have been fully converted by now.
To be fair on the 43, most days it is just BDEs during the morning and afternoons, however come evening hybrids appear. Conversion of the N43 to electric buses hasn't even started. All the electric 43s bar two are now in service, so you would expect at least the complete day service including evenings to be BDEs. At worst you would expect no more than 2 hybrids as replacement for the two BDEs yet to go into service.
There are 16 OMEs in service on the 134, though only about half seem to see service each day. With 16 OMEs you would expect at least half the service to be electric buses.
I wonder when these routes will go fully electric? I do question just how long it will take fot the 94 to convert and all ADH/VHs to leave S. With only the 148 to pull buses from (which can't be used on the 94) there may have to be a retention of some hybrids for till atleast summer next year. Can't help thinking it would make sense to transfer another route in (maybe the 306) to atleast have an option for the N94 if the Electrics needs to charge up. Or operate the 94 night service from another garage. But I don't think it will be a problem, TfL and other operators will be able to draw on Metroline's pioneering experience.
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Metroline
Nov 28, 2019 16:59:51 GMT
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Post by LondonNorthern on Nov 28, 2019 16:59:51 GMT
Will the DE8s from Metroline get replaced? Right now some are sounding really shabby and I wonder if any are actually getting replaced.
The 10 & 11 reg from Route 234 if the 234 gets its DEMs back & the 12 reg currently not in use from Route 214 could play a part in this, but then some would be needed for the E6.
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Post by ADH45258 on Nov 28, 2019 18:25:45 GMT
Will the DE8s from Metroline get replaced? Right now some are sounding really shabby and I wonder if any are actually getting replaced. The 10 & 11 reg from Route 234 if the 234 gets its DEMs back & the 12 reg currently not in use from Route 214 could play a part in this, but then some would be needed for the E6. These 08reg DEs were previously allocated to route 232. They were swapped (on supposedly a temporary basis) with newer 10reg allocated to the 143 due to the LEBZ. After the 232 was lost, the 10reg moved to the 95 at G, instead of the allocated 143. With the 143 continuing to use the older 08reg DEs, which presumably are not converted to euro6 (and as you say may not be in the best condition), perhaps the 143 could gain the spare MMC DELs (wrongly ordered for the 393). The batch is the perfect allocation size for the route (when including the 2 143D SD workings from W). And I think the 143 could do with a slight increase in capacity, especially with the 143D needed at both ends of the route as well as the 643, plus I don't think the 143 can take DDs along some of the routeing in Finchley. The route should be able to use longer vehicles as it has occasionally used the 112's 64reg.
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Metroline
Nov 28, 2019 19:10:47 GMT
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Post by LondonNorthern on Nov 28, 2019 19:10:47 GMT
Will the DE8s from Metroline get replaced? Right now some are sounding really shabby and I wonder if any are actually getting replaced. The 10 & 11 reg from Route 234 if the 234 gets its DEMs back & the 12 reg currently not in use from Route 214 could play a part in this, but then some would be needed for the E6. These 08reg DEs were previously allocated to route 232. They were swapped (on supposedly a temporary basis) with newer 10reg allocated to the 143 due to the LEBZ. After the 232 was lost, the 10reg moved to the 95 at G, instead of the allocated 143. With the 143 continuing to use the older 08reg DEs, which presumably are not converted to euro6 (and as you say may not be in the best condition), perhaps the 143 could gain the spare MMC DELs (wrongly ordered for the 393). The batch is the perfect allocation size for the route (when including the 2 143D SD workings from W). And I think the 143 could do with a slight increase in capacity, especially with the 143D needed at both ends of the route as well as the 643, plus I don't think the 143 can take DDs along some of the routeing in Finchley. The route should be able to use longer vehicles as it has occasionally used the 112's 64reg. I initially thought that they would but apparently they were sent back to ADL and swapped for the current DEMs on Route 393 (don't know if this is true)
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Nov 28, 2019 19:43:10 GMT
These 08reg DEs were previously allocated to route 232. They were swapped (on supposedly a temporary basis) with newer 10reg allocated to the 143 due to the LEBZ. After the 232 was lost, the 10reg moved to the 95 at G, instead of the allocated 143. With the 143 continuing to use the older 08reg DEs, which presumably are not converted to euro6 (and as you say may not be in the best condition), perhaps the 143 could gain the spare MMC DELs (wrongly ordered for the 393). The batch is the perfect allocation size for the route (when including the 2 143D SD workings from W). And I think the 143 could do with a slight increase in capacity, especially with the 143D needed at both ends of the route as well as the 643, plus I don't think the 143 can take DDs along some of the routeing in Finchley. The route should be able to use longer vehicles as it has occasionally used the 112's 64reg. I initially thought that they would but apparently they were sent back to ADL and swapped for the current DEMs on Route 393 (don't know if this is true) I don't think they were, last time I was on the A40 they were still at Perivale East in storage and this was after the 393s correct DEMs had arrived
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Metroline
Nov 28, 2019 20:28:19 GMT
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Post by ADH45258 on Nov 28, 2019 20:28:19 GMT
These 08reg DEs were previously allocated to route 232. They were swapped (on supposedly a temporary basis) with newer 10reg allocated to the 143 due to the LEBZ. After the 232 was lost, the 10reg moved to the 95 at G, instead of the allocated 143. With the 143 continuing to use the older 08reg DEs, which presumably are not converted to euro6 (and as you say may not be in the best condition), perhaps the 143 could gain the spare MMC DELs (wrongly ordered for the 393). The batch is the perfect allocation size for the route (when including the 2 143D SD workings from W). And I think the 143 could do with a slight increase in capacity, especially with the 143D needed at both ends of the route as well as the 643, plus I don't think the 143 can take DDs along some of the routeing in Finchley. The route should be able to use longer vehicles as it has occasionally used the 112's 64reg. I initially thought that they would but apparently they were sent back to ADL and swapped for the current DEMs on Route 393 (don't know if this is true) As they're dual door, perhaps another London operator will purchase them? Maybe RATP for route 326 (directly or indirectly), after this batch had been suggested for Metroline to bid for the 326 with?
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Post by VWH1414 on Nov 28, 2019 22:14:21 GMT
I initially thought that they would but apparently they were sent back to ADL and swapped for the current DEMs on Route 393 (don't know if this is true) As they're dual door, perhaps another London operator will purchase them? Maybe RATP for route 326 (directly or indirectly), after this batch had been suggested for Metroline to bid for the 326 with? They never went back to ADL, they are still sat in PV. If the fault in the order wasn't on ADLs side then technically they don't have to accept them back. Also yet again, the 326 CANNOT take DELs, so it would have to be indirectly, but I am doubting Metroline will get rid of these. I can see them being used to replace older DEs, perhaps the 08 reg at W, with the 143 gaining the DELs and then some newer DEs from PB going to W for the 324s new contract. Whilst it was suggested Metroline could've bid for the 326 indirectly using these, that doesn't mean it was set in stone they'd get it, LS came in with a cheaper bid using other existing buses.
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Post by ServerKing on Nov 28, 2019 22:44:38 GMT
As they're dual door, perhaps another London operator will purchase them? Maybe RATP for route 326 (directly or indirectly), after this batch had been suggested for Metroline to bid for the 326 with? They never went back to ADL, they are still sat in PV. If the fault in the order wasn't on ADLs side then technically they don't have to accept them back. Also yet again, the 326 CANNOT take DELs, so it would have to be indirectly, but I am doubting Metroline will get rid of these. I can see them being used to replace older DEs, perhaps the 08 reg at W, with the 143 gaining the DELs and then some newer DEs from PB going to W for the 324s new contract. Whilst it was suggested Metroline could've bid for the 326 indirectly using these, that doesn't mean it was set in stone they'd get it, LS came in with a cheaper bid using other existing buses. How about the 268? Might as well put them to some use...
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Post by VWH1414 on Nov 28, 2019 22:56:54 GMT
They never went back to ADL, they are still sat in PV. If the fault in the order wasn't on ADLs side then technically they don't have to accept them back. Also yet again, the 326 CANNOT take DELs, so it would have to be indirectly, but I am doubting Metroline will get rid of these. I can see them being used to replace older DEs, perhaps the 08 reg at W, with the 143 gaining the DELs and then some newer DEs from PB going to W for the 324s new contract. Whilst it was suggested Metroline could've bid for the 326 indirectly using these, that doesn't mean it was set in stone they'd get it, LS came in with a cheaper bid using other existing buses. How about the 268? Might as well put them to some use... I was thinking 143 because there is nearly an exact fit (16 DELs for a TVR of 15 - 1 would therefore still be spare, but could just be used as a general spare at W). Either way I see them being used at some point.
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Post by E279 on Nov 29, 2019 2:33:48 GMT
TEH1462 & TEH1463 have been out since the 08/12th of this month but also come out of service at scheduled times etc. I wonder if these potentially could be undergoing refurbishment for the 282.
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Post by barrypotter on Nov 29, 2019 6:07:42 GMT
OME 2667 is in the (PB) building.
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Metroline
Nov 29, 2019 12:28:26 GMT
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Post by LondonNorthern on Nov 29, 2019 12:28:26 GMT
As they're dual door, perhaps another London operator will purchase them? Maybe RATP for route 326 (directly or indirectly), after this batch had been suggested for Metroline to bid for the 326 with? They never went back to ADL, they are still sat in PV. If the fault in the order wasn't on ADLs side then technically they don't have to accept them back. Also yet again, the 326 CANNOT take DELs, so it would have to be indirectly, but I am doubting Metroline will get rid of these. I can see them being used to replace older DEs, perhaps the 08 reg at W, with the 143 gaining the DELs and then some newer DEs from PB going to W for the 324s new contract. Whilst it was suggested Metroline could've bid for the 326 indirectly using these, that doesn't mean it was set in stone they'd get it, LS came in with a cheaper bid using other existing buses. There's only 6 10 and 11 reg DEs at PB, and there are some needed for the E6. There are 3 currently unallocated 12 reg but that wouldn't cut the 324 particularly as the E6 still requires 6 more DEs. To help matters, the spare DEL could go to the 112/316 and release a 10/11/12 reg for the 324 because I can't imagine the 324 being able to take DELs.
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Metroline
Nov 29, 2019 13:39:55 GMT
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Post by ADH45258 on Nov 29, 2019 13:39:55 GMT
As they're dual door, perhaps another London operator will purchase them? Maybe RATP for route 326 (directly or indirectly), after this batch had been suggested for Metroline to bid for the 326 with? They never went back to ADL, they are still sat in PV. If the fault in the order wasn't on ADLs side then technically they don't have to accept them back. Also yet again, the 326 CANNOT take DELs, so it would have to be indirectly, but I am doubting Metroline will get rid of these. I can see them being used to replace older DEs, perhaps the 08 reg at W, with the 143 gaining the DELs and then some newer DEs from PB going to W for the 324s new contract. Whilst it was suggested Metroline could've bid for the 326 indirectly using these, that doesn't mean it was set in stone they'd get it, LS came in with a cheaper bid using other existing buses. With the 143, another option could be for only the main PVR to gain MMC DELs, with older DEs kept for the 2 school extras. Then use the remaining 2 DELs for route 112, giving a full DEL allocation to slightly increase capacity. The 2 12reg DEs currently allocated to the 112 could then form part of the 324's new allocation.
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