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Post by thesquirrels on Oct 25, 2021 19:07:12 GMT
Not being funny, but why would it need to be cut back to improve reliability (the W4) the route is short as it is. It would not gain any advantage putting it into Wood Green. Its not that short. In fact it's quicker to take the 123 or 243 to Bruce Grove from Wood Green than the W4 and also the 41 to Tottenham Hale and Seven Sisters from Turnpike Lane But those point to point trips are not primarily what the W4 is for, and the W4 is the least frequent of these routes by some margin so would rarely be the first choice for those trips. It is true to say the W4 is a slow service that gets caught up in some congestion but I'd stop short of supporting a split. Curtailments happen but they are rare.
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Post by thesquirrels on Oct 23, 2021 21:34:15 GMT
When the W14 was operated by Arriva in the early 00s, was it commercially operated or regularly operated with TFL? Only reason I'm wondering is because I saw a few photos of the buses it used were in the provincial Arriva Livery of the time. TfL route. The tender awards predated (2000? I think) the all-over red rule, and operation was by Arriva East Herts and Essex so they arrived in that outfit's conventional colours. They were repainted red later.
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Post by thesquirrels on Oct 17, 2021 9:04:50 GMT
There's not enough links between Hertfordshire and Harrow. Look at Edgware. Edgware have three bus routes that can take you into Hertfordshire. Routes 107 and 292 to Borehamwood and 142 to Watford. Only route 258 connects between Harrow and Watford so the demand of the new route 342 between Harrow and Borehamwood should be high. It would be good for shopping as well as school and work. Harrow is well linked to Hertfordshire by TfL - on the train. 4tph to Bushey and Watford on the Overground and 4-6tph to Rickmansworth, Croxley and Cassiobury Park on the Met. As a railhead Edgware requires any onward links to be made by bus so decent links exist as a result, by bus. Will leave the debate about the merits or otherwise of a Borehamwood to Harrow bus to others but given that Sullivans' commercial route to Watford - its nearest major town centre - is withering on the vine I'm not sure how much demand could be found for a route linking further-away Harrow.
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Post by thesquirrels on Oct 16, 2021 22:39:10 GMT
A bit of an idea shuffle around Barnet/Muswell Hill/Friern Barnet. Route 84: Cutback to PB. Route 234: Revised to run between Potters Bar & Muswell Hill but with changes on the southern end. Between Colney Hatch Tesco & Muswell Hill the route would run via Colney Hatch Lane rather than via Trott Road & Coppetts to enable a more direct service between Muswell Hill & Barnet but extended on the northern end to Potters Bar Station via Route 84. Frequency reduced to every 15 minutes and the 43s frequency cut would allow this to not overbus the corridor as I believe it went from a bus every 6 minutes to 7.5 enabling a 2bph reduction (which is the equivalent of 4bph on a single decker route). Now this might be a case of what is a more precious link for Coppetts Estate residents, whether its an East Finchley link for the tube or a Barnet/Whetstone link. Route 446: Revised to run between Hampstead Heath & Friern Barnet via Route 603 to Muswell Hill & route 234 to Friern Barnet. Frequency introduced at every 15 minutes during the peak times however can be adjusted depending on demand. Thoughts? I don't think the Potters Bar section needs 4bph - the current 2bph on the 84 doesn't get particularly busy as it is. And unless you have plans to kill the 699 school bus services to Owens I really doubt there is much general demand for a through service from the southern part of LB Barnet. Slicing 33% of the service along the freehold sections of the current 234 and forcing a change on passengers from the Coppetts Wood area trying to get north of Friern Barnet seems a bit mean. It is a densely populated little enclave with some very remote concentrations of less than affluent housing, especially compared to areas surrounding it. From a 6bph direct service to 4bph changing onto another 4bph! To enable a small area of Muswell Hill to enjoy a 4-5 minute faster journey to Barnet (the very direct 263 exists for Highgate Wood, East Finchley and the Western end of Fortis Green. From Fortis Green it is also possible to 'game' the 234 by simply walking up Tetherdown and pick the bus up at the top of Coppetts Road, missing out the Muswell Hill congestion - I realise Pages Lane locks up at school start and finish times). The son-of-603 and daughter-of-234 do link up well on a map but I don't think there is a frequency that keeps both ends happy. x15 outside of the peaks will carry fresh air south of East Finchley for a long time, while the 234 section in the peaks will probably struggle - there are several schools in the Coppetts Wood area, though these are mostly Haringey and their catchments won't go north of the A406 so from that point of view the split makes more sense than cutting it to the south.
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Post by thesquirrels on Oct 11, 2021 20:14:00 GMT
One thing I don’t get is some routes which aren’t in the top 30 are more frequent than the routes that are in the top 30. A good example of this would be 38, it surprisingly didn’t make it in the top 30 yet somehow overall, it’s more frequent than 18 which is supposed to be the busiest route at this point in time. It is about how the bus on a given route will be used on a typical journey - not all journeys are equal in length and purpose. A bus can be used more, or less, intensively to give total rider numbers. Frequency needs to be looked at in tandem with route length and where the journeys start and finish, where 'busy' sections of route might be, etc etc. The 38 is busy to and from Victoria Station and through Islington, but it is often quite lightly loaded in Hackney and through Holborn. Inversely the 149 can be packed from first stop to last, with flows to traffic objectives all along the route as well as many end to end riders. Ditto the 18 which is very busy from Marylebone out to Wembley, and only a little quieter on the last mile either end. A seat on the bus, taken at random, might see three or more passengers on a long 18 or 149 journey, while on the 38 the same seat might only see two passengers for much of the day on an end to end trip, and be empty for a time in between. Routes like the 18 and 149 also get very busy from 4am onwards with shift workers, and still be busy past midnight with leisure traffic (e.g. the 149 in Dalston) with little break during the day when shopper/leisure traffic is high, so the usage intensity carries across 18+ hours of the day, rather than the 12-15 typical on most London routes with an off peak daytime gap.
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Post by thesquirrels on Oct 10, 2021 8:22:39 GMT
Some of the local residents are asking for the 91 to be cut back to Hornsey I've read comments elsewhere suggesting a local person or even a councillor (can't clarify 100% which it is) has asked for the roundabout to be abolished and a set of lights installed with the 91 moved elsewhere. The letter is included in the tweet linked below, along with the signatories. There have been three instances in the last 23 years where a bus has crashed on that roundabout and caused property damage. The councillor who wrote the letter has a special interest as she was at secondary school nearby when the first crash occurred. As has been said, if the 91 was sent to Turnpike Lane the route would need to stand on Ducketts Common as the bus station is full. Terminating at Hornsey Station would miss a useful objective at Turnpike Lane but the propensity for the latter to snarl up would create more headaches for the route's operation so missing it would have that benefit. If Rokesly and Elmfield Avenues could be made one-way, following the direction the W3 already takes, the 91 could probably be made to turn there safely at all times. But Haringey has made Elmfield Ave a 'school street' banning non-residential vehicular access at start and finish times (though TfL is exempted from this ban), so Rokesly Ave needs to be two way to keep access at those times. Not sure an LT would make the turn from Tottenham Lane into Elmfield Avenue either!
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Post by thesquirrels on Sept 24, 2021 7:25:54 GMT
Not too much better, however managed to find fares for £94.84 (that is outbound and return together) for Paddington - Paignton. Though I agree, the fares can be ridiculous. Was looking at a day up north, and the only cost sensible option would be with the new operator Lumo. If they're succesful, I hope they expand onto other main corridors If you do it in advance, you can get Croydon to Paignton fares for 33.80 each way. Almost less than by car. If it's for next week, it'll be a bit more but SplitMyFare can really help bring costs down. Appreciate the well intention in passing on this information, but it shouldn't have to be a case of 'beating the system' in order to secure fares that aren't rip offs. I've no doubt the £33.80 fare exists somewhere, for some date, but the fact that the forum is drawing a blank highlights how contrived the whole system is.
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Post by thesquirrels on Sept 1, 2021 22:12:25 GMT
TfL routes along unlit roads: As the nights are drawing in I'd like to do some bus running in the dark along unlit roads- it's always quite atmospheric. In the South East area I'm familiar with: 146: The section from Keston Church to Downe. 246: Mainly from Biggin Hill to Westerham but also with a short run between Coney Hall and The Fox at Keston. 464: From Saltbox Hill towards New Addington. R8: A lot of the route is on rural roads, especially between Downe and Cudham. So, is there anywhere else in London with similar 'rural' non lit running? Thanks. 370 between Corbets Tey and the M25. U9, Harvil Road, south of Harefield. Cockfosters Road / Stagg Hill is lit for it's total length now, but the 313 along the Ridgeway west of Botany Bay can give clear views over London at night.
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Post by thesquirrels on Aug 31, 2021 21:41:19 GMT
Whilst coming home from work today I noticed that the 610 and 611 have been removed from the stops in Enfield and Oakwood. Have they been cut back (I've seen a 610 have Cockfosters on the blind so maybe it's been cut back there) or have they just been binned off like the 575? Curtailed to Cockfosters. I'm not 100% sure when Uno gave up on the Enfield journeys (which latterly were only peak and during UoH term time) but I think the lack of student activity related to Covid meant they were stopped early last year.
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Post by thesquirrels on Aug 31, 2021 7:26:18 GMT
The bottom line question is whether a direct link is needed, i.e. to the point were TfL 'need' to step in and fund, more than likely at a loss for the early years of operation, a service that extends significantly beyond it's operating area, the majority of which would be outside of Greater London, trampling on the toes of a commercially successful Arriva service in doing so, then ask Herts CC to cough up to financial support to match theirs (because I sincerely doubt it would get off the ground without both) - where it had no need to before - to provide a link between Watford and a residential area inside London. What are the younger crowd going to Watford for? Are there schools that Watford have a catchment in Hillingdon? It would be convenient, but at the price, is it *necessary*? The younger crowd go there as it is a main shopping district in the wider area along with uxbridge and harrow, plus there are schools such as west herts, watford grammar and merchant taylors amongst others which are quite popular choices from residents from ruislip. Merchant Taylors is served by Moor Park (just about the only time I see that station busy!). Watford Boys' and West Herts College are both walking distance from Watford Met. Watford Girls is less accessible from the Metropolitan Line, granted. Habs in Elstree runs their own feeder coach from Ruislip. I understand that Watford is a popular shopping destination from Ruislip but TfL's argument would be that Harrow and Uxbridge provide all of the necessary town centre facilities and it already provides good bus and rail links to both of those. That sort of leisure and retail travel is much more a choice-based decision than one driven by need. I live in the middle of Wood Green's shopping district but I can get a bus to Brent Cross from across the road if I wish to. If I made the decision to go to Westfield E20 I would need to change buses or go by tube. I am not slighted by TfL's decision not to provide a direct bus for that journey!
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Post by thesquirrels on Aug 30, 2021 19:01:34 GMT
I'm not sure there would be much demand for a direct bus link between Ruislip and Watford. Currently, passengers wanting to travel by bus can either change at Northwood for the non-TFL route 8, or take the 114/398 to change for the 258. And by train, there is the Metropolitan line to Watford Station (plus a walk to the town centre), or can take the Met to Northwick Park, for the Overground from Kenton to Watford High Street. Much of your 431 proposal also largely duplicates Arriva's existing route 8 from Mount Vernon Hospital to Watford and Abbots Langley. If funding was available for an additional cross-border service in this area, I think a far more useful link from Watford would be via Carpenders Park to Hatch End. Many passengers here rely on the Overground, but not everywhere is within walking distance to one of the stations. This route could perhaps continue to Harrow, maybe serving some local roads in Pinner around Paines Lane. This could also provide some compensation for TFL's proposal to cut back the 258 to Bushey Heath. Another link that could be useful, while very unlikely to happen, would be an orbital route between Watford and Barnet, via Bushey, Elstree and Borehamwood - also replacing Sullivan's route 306. However, TFL's proposal for the 258 does suggest that there is no funding available for any expansion of the network around Watford.
My suggestion for a service to Rickmansworth, while it would be difficult to fund, is partly because there is currently no non-TFL bus service available between the nearby towns of Northwood and Rickmansworth. There is the R1/R2, but these only operate a few times a day, plus they only serve Mount Vernon Hospital (rather than the rest of Northwood), and go indirectly via Harefield. The Metropolitan Line is not a solution to every journey, as several residential areas are not within walking distance of Northwood or Rickmansworth stations. There is also a small amount of housing along London Road that might benefit from a bus service. I think at the very least, TFL could provide a bus service around the Batchworth Lane area of Northwood - this could be quite simply achieved by diverting the 331 between Mount Vernon/Batchworth Heath and Northwood Station. No there would defo be demand for a ruislip-watford link especially for the younger crowd, and when i say watford i mean watford junction, 114 to 258 to overground is long firstly. I have done the the route, traffic hub. Ruislip to harrow via 114 can take up to 30 minutes, there needs to be a direct route. Non tfl, routes dont really count as an alternative for London residents. with all your alternatives, they are either long, indirect, or require to pay the passenger to pay twice when alot of people in ruislip do go to watford. The bottom line question is whether a direct link is needed, i.e. to the point were TfL 'need' to step in and fund, more than likely at a loss for the early years of operation, a service that extends significantly beyond it's operating area, the majority of which would be outside of Greater London, trampling on the toes of a commercially successful Arriva service in doing so, then ask Herts CC to cough up to financial support to match theirs (because I sincerely doubt it would get off the ground without both) - where it had no need to before - to provide a link between Watford and a residential area inside London. What are the younger crowd going to Watford for? Are there schools that Watford have a catchment in Hillingdon? It would be convenient, but at the price, is it *necessary*?
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Post by thesquirrels on Aug 28, 2021 22:37:01 GMT
Golders Green is not full of multi-millionaires! Plenty of people live there with reasonable incomes and getting rich people onto public transport is a good thing! However I agree do not disregard t he working class. I think it's absolutely atricious that lower income residents aren't being listened to especially with LTNs. As for Battersea Bridge, perhaps vjaska or @m1104 could correct me as they seem to be knowledgeable of the area but across the bridge on the south side I believe there is a lot of council housing down towards Clapham Junction? Certainly lots of flats there.
Also as for Chelsea, sure residents there generally scream louder than in poorer areas but then again in higher-income areas plenty of staff will work in these houses as either cleaners, chefs, nannies etc. They'll need a method of transportation for them for them to reach their homes, for example the 328 can load up fairly heavily on the southern end for those to then use it up north.
Regarding areas with fancy names as well, there are plenty of areas like Swiss Cottage that may sound extremely posh but can definitely see high usage of public transport. For example take the 31, the section between Kilburn & Camden passes through Primrose Hill, Abbey Road, Swiss Cottage etc and yet that struggles on an 6bph frequency, absolutely should've been kept at an 8bph frequency (arguably busiest section of the route as well). Ditto the C11.
I said if Golders Green had multimillionaires. I didn't know about council housing in Battersea. I understand about cleaners, chefs, nannies etc, but do people live on Shaftesbury Avenue? Camden Council has the head leasehold on at least one mansion block on Shaftesbury Avenue. A flat in one went on the council's Choice Based Lettings site a few months ago. £160 a week to live in the West End.. if your need is high enough. Similarly some of the mansion blocks between Bloomsbury Way and the British Museum are Camden too. Westminster Council has housing in Soho and Covent Garden has a mix from both boroughs and a large Peabody estate. But this digresses from the argument. It is worth noting that Camden, Islington and Westminster have huge numbers of council and housing association owned *street properties*, and Camden in particular has a chunk of theirs inside zone 1. In some cases councils acquired individual street properties, in others they took over housing associations, or they/HAs took on slum terraces to improve them and let them, slowly becoming islands of affordable housing as London gentrified. Notting Hill housing Trust started life in the stuccoed townhouses around Ladbroke Grove, and maintains a presence there today. Point being, don't just look for estates. The richest areas of the country have the same social need for public transport, often hiding in plain sight. Additionally many new developments are specifically car-free, i.e. the council will refuse parking permits unless a registered disability is proven, bringing TfL new customers with each new high rise/high density development. Tfl does need to look at these when planning ahead re. service provision, and as far as I understand they do.
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Post by thesquirrels on Aug 26, 2021 22:06:10 GMT
As mentioned, when heading to Edgware I dont think the cycle lane is a big factor - it was just as bad before when it was 'normal width'. I dont think the service has been as good since the North Finchley shorts were stopped. Its got better but those first few weeks without the shorts to ease loadings..... Yes, nice and quiet now in the mornings (I will most likely go back to my bike when the kids go back as sitting for 20-30 minutes on Bounds Green Road is no fun) - usual delays due to light jumpers/blockers at Bounds Green on my way home via 221 - the junction really needs to be a yellow box to keep it clear. Agree with the bollards by the garage - bit more busy tonight as Ensigns are there operating the THFC Shuttle as well Could a solution to the 221 shorts have been an extended 67 up to North Finchley/Friern Barnet? Dalston Junction - North Finchley definitely sounds workable. Probably not, IMO. There was a need for an increased service at the Edgware end so it made sense to send 8bph through, and I think a combined 14+bph to North Finchley would be overkill. I haven't used the 221 in donkeys so not sure how the reduced service is going down at the Wood Green end (I did have concerns) but I use Bounds Green Road regularly by car and the increase in traffic vs pre-lockdown no.1 has been noticeable. Agree with comments that the cycle lanes in themselves aren't a huge issue, but moving a few poorly placed wands would make life easier for a lot of people. The safety element of that cycle lane is lost at the junctions anyway, and 25+ years cycling in central and suburban London has taught me that so many of them fail at that point. Haringey's next run of LTN proposals for Bounds Green will close off all of the side cut-throughs between the High Road and BGR, as well as between BGR and Durnsford Road, though they seem to have rowed back from their proposal for a bus gate on Brownlow Road - this would have nixed the issue of drivers cutting a corner off the nasty bit of the A406 via Colney Hatch Lane and Alexandra Park Road, but at too high a price to a lot of other much more local traffic, even in the eyes of moderates.
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Post by thesquirrels on Aug 24, 2021 22:16:29 GMT
Think we did this in this thread earlier - the 229 has 20+ as do some of these routes like 366. In general any route which goes to thamesmead / beckton has a humoungous number Of the routes which go through roundabouts, the 115 has only 1 (at Canning Town) although it does traverse it twice the 271 has no roundabouts at all! Multiple Lambeth routes serve no roundabouts at all as Lambeth isn't known for having them - the IMAX one is probably the most well known in the borough and is served by a number of routes, the 3 serves the one at the end of South Croxted Road, the 315 & 322 serve roundabouts of differing sizes east & west of Norwood Road but really beyond them, possibly no others bar some mini ones. I'm not counting any gyratorys as they aren't roundabouts IMO You have set down a gauntlet here, but I am struggling to come up with any. There is a 'proper' one on the eastern edge of Myatts Fields Park, where Knatchbull Road meets with Flodden Road, right on the border with Southwark. And there is Lambeth Bridge, obviously. Other than that, I'm out.
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Post by thesquirrels on Aug 24, 2021 21:18:12 GMT
I note from Amazon's job adverts for the Dartford depot that the service will be free to employees, with a free park and ride facility in Dartford town centre and Ebbsfleet. Starting pay rate of £11.10/hr with antisocial hours enhancements! The labour market is in extraordinary times - manpower is in short supply at the moment. Arriva tried a night service on the 480 in the 2010s but chucked the towel in a few years ago. I think it will get a bit of 'civilian' use too as the two routes share some common ground.
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