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Post by snowman on Dec 19, 2017 11:57:34 GMT
With one year to go TfL have launched a map news link Link to images Link to New one year to go map Note the initial map does not include the Whitechapel-Statford section, Paddington through running, or the services to Reading or Heathrow T5 Rather disappointingly (in my opinon) it looks like the enhanced Thameslink (which is a kind of North-South crossrail) doesn't look like it is being included in the 2019 map. Not sure there is a place for a tube, overground, tram, TfL rail map (without other rail lines) anymore. Wish they simply did a central map (say zone 2 inwards, and an alternative all zones map).
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Post by snoggle on Dec 19, 2017 12:09:12 GMT
With one year to go TfL have launched a map news link Link to images Link to New one year to go map Note the initial map doesnot include the Whitechapel-Statford section, or the services to Reading or Heathrow T5 Rather disappointingly (in my opinon) it looks like the enhanced Thameslink (which is a kind of North-South crossrail) doesn't look like it is being included in the 2019 map. There is no reason why the Dec 2018 map would show Whitechapel to Stratford. It doesn't open until May 2019. Services to Reading and to T5 start in Dec 2019. I can understand TfL not wishing to confuse matters by showing future services when the important message is that from Dec 2018 there are three distinct elements to the Crossrail service. Not surprised by the omission of Thameslink. Its service pattern won't be stable for until late 2019 and we get back to the old debate about what should or should not be on the "tube" map.
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Dec 19, 2017 12:43:13 GMT
Does anyone know why Terminal 5 services are not shown? Will they start at a later date?
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Post by snowman on Dec 19, 2017 12:44:27 GMT
Does anyone know why Terminal 5 services are not shown? Will they start at a later date? yes this is a December 2018 map, Terminal 5 starts year later Its also why some stations (in the west) don't have the wheelchair symbol (as step free is delayed until after the May 2018 take over of Heathrow Connect) One that has baffled me is Bond Street, fully step free symbol on Jubilee Line, but only accessible on Central Line. Similarly I thought Victoria was supposed to be step free by December 2018. Although this might just be sloppy compilation using bits of old maps
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Post by snoggle on Dec 19, 2017 21:32:19 GMT
Does anyone know why Terminal 5 services are not shown? Will they start at a later date? yes this is a December 2018 map, Terminal 5 starts year later Its also why some stations (in the west) don't have the wheelchair symbol (as step free is delayed until after the May 2018 take over of Heathrow Connect) One that has baffled me is Bond Street, fully step free symbol on Jubilee Line, but only accessible on Central Line. Similarly I thought Victoria was supposed to be step free by December 2018. Although this might just be sloppy compilation using bits of old maps Just worth adding that transfers between terminals are free at Heathrow so taking the TfL Rail service to Heathrow Central (T23) just requires a same platform change to HEX for the onward link to T5. I expect that Oyster will allow fares to T5 via TfL Rail from May next year. You rightly say the 2 tph Crossrail service to T5 starts in Dec 2019. The provision of step free access at the Western stations will be a push to get finished by Dec 2019 never mind May next year. TfL have only recently let contracts for step free access at 4 stations and NR are still retendering the station rebuild contracts for the rest. It's going to be one heck of a push to get them all finished. Interestingly no work has started on rebuilding Ilford station either. It certainly won't be finished in a year's time. I suspect the issue about the tube map symbols for Bond Street relate solely to the provision of platform humps. I haven't used Bond St for ages so I am guessing that the Jubilee Line platforms have platform humps while the Central Line does not (yet). There is definitely lift access from street to all platforms via the new ticket hall that opened a couple of weeks ago. Victoria may have slipped slightly into January unless there is a mad dash finish going on now. Again I haven't been down there in a long while so am not sure about the precise state of play with the rebuild. I know a new entrance has appeared near Wilton Road / NR south eastern side. I don't know if the enlarged Vic Line ticket hall has emerged from behind hoardings yet.
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Post by RandomBusesGirl on Dec 19, 2017 22:35:03 GMT
I don't think it's clear anywhere in the release, so I'll ask: when will there be a through service from Shenfield branch to rest of the line? (E.g. into Paddington, without needing to change). As for the map, not much changes on the apart from the obvious addition of the map, some Step-Free symbols being updated, some line curves being remodelled - but something did catch my eye! Who noticed the now "official" interchange between Archway and Upper Holloway? I actually did know (and used) that one, it's like a stop or 2 on a bus
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Post by smoothcriminal on Dec 19, 2017 23:19:13 GMT
Why not just leave tfl rail as is until it's linked to the core at Stratford complete waste of time renaming it when it's no different ti what it is now.
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Post by snoggle on Dec 19, 2017 23:25:17 GMT
I don't think it's clear anywhere in the release, so I'll ask: when will there be a through service from Shenfield branch to rest of the line? (E.g. into Paddington, without needing to change). As for the map, not much changes on the apart from the obvious addition of the map, some Step-Free symbols being updated, some line curves being remodelled - but something did catch my eye! Who noticed the now "official" interchange between Archway and Upper Holloway? I actually did know (and used) that one, it's like a stop or 2 on a bus I have set out the service build up on Crossrail before but I'll do it again. 10 Dec 2017 - TfL took over operation of 10 suburban stations from GWR to the west of Paddington (Slough not included). May 2018 - TfL take over operation of Heathrow Connect service, increase service to 4 tph using 9 car class 345s. Dec 2018 - Operation of the Crossrail core service from Paddington to Abbey Wood commences. 15tph service. May 2019 - The Shenfield branch is added into the Crossrail core so trains run Paddington to Shenfield / Paddington to Abbey Wood. Dec 2019 - The full Crossrail service commences with services running through from Shenfield to Reading / Abbey Wood to Heathrow T4 and T5 There will be a 24tph service so a train every 5 mins to both Shenfield and Abbey Wood. The service to the west is more variable with 4 tph to Reading, 4 tph to Heathrow and some trains to intermediate points like Maidenhead / West Drayton. Final frequencies are still to be confirmed to the west. There will also be 4 tph peak direction only from Liv St (surface) to Shenfield. Hopefully that answers your question (and any others that may have been lurking in your head).
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Post by snoggle on Dec 19, 2017 23:28:12 GMT
Why not just leave tfl rail as is until it's linked to the core at Stratford complete waste of time renaming it when it's no different ti what it is now. Because TfL have decided the "stupid name" comes into use when the main tunnel section opens. At some point it all gets renamed anyway so it's academic whether you do it in Dec 2018 or 6 months later in May 2019. As with Thameslink the Crossrail service proposition is in a state of flux for a year so people will have to cope with a changing range of destinations, times, frequencies etc from May 2018 through to Dec 2019.
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Post by snowman on Dec 20, 2017 6:47:51 GMT
I don't think it's clear anywhere in the release, so I'll ask: when will there be a through service from Shenfield branch to rest of the line? (E.g. into Paddington, without needing to change). As for the map, not much changes on the apart from the obvious addition of the map, some Step-Free symbols being updated, some line curves being remodelled - but something did catch my eye! Who noticed the now "official" interchange between Archway and Upper Holloway? I actually did know (and used) that one, it's like a stop or 2 on a bus I have set out the service build up on Crossrail before but I'll do it again. 10 Dec 2017 - TfL took over operation of 10 suburban stations from GWR to the west of Paddington (Slough not included). May 2018 - TfL take over operation of Heathrow Connect service, increase service to 4 tph using 9 car class 345s. Dec 2018 - Operation of the Crossrail core service from Paddington to Abbey Wood commences. 15tph service. May 2019 - The Shenfield branch is added into the Crossrail core so trains run Paddington to Shenfield / Paddington to Abbey Wood. Dec 2019 - The full Crossrail service commences with services running through from Shenfield to Reading / Abbey Wood to Heathrow T4 and T5 There will be a 24tph service so a train every 5 mins to both Shenfield and Abbey Wood. The service to the west is more variable with 4 tph to Reading, 4 tph to Heathrow and some trains to intermediate points like Maidenhead / West Drayton. Final frequencies are still to be confirmed to the west. There will also be 4 tph peak direction only from Liv St (surface) to Shenfield. Hopefully that answers your question (and any others that may have been lurking in your head). I think something funny happens to the Abbey Wood service in May 2019 The initial 15 tph Service gets a frequency decrease to 12 tph to give an even ratio between Abbey Wood and Shenfield services,. As you would expect this frequency reduction is not included in press releases, but is in the plan in TfL committee reports (even there you need to subtract the Shenfield service from the core service to get the May 2019 Abbey Wood service). There is also a change at Liverpool Street sometime after May 2019 which sees the closure of platform 18 and extending of 16 and 17. Until this happens the peak Liverpool Street services are restricted to7 car. From memory I think I read somewhere that the platform extensions are planned for Christmas/ New Year 2019 (which probably means a 10 day closure of the Peak service) Although services in the core appear to end at the new Crossrail platforms at Paddington there is not a scissors crossover at the East end, so trains continue out of service to reversing sidings near Westbourne Park. Whilst platform staff can check trains are empty and close the doors on a 15 tph Service, I suspect this will be struggle when this happens every 150 seconds. Be interesting to see how they make this work, as any slow disembarking passengers will delay the train leaving the platform. There are (or were) a number of sidings and empty loco / carriage lines from Westbourne Park to Old Oak, there is a vague plan to convert at least one into a full running line (which allows dedicated crossrail line), this is all tied in to the massive proposed Old Oak development and station, which would allow dedicated terminating platforms for Elizabeth Line (if it goes ahead all Elizabeth line trains would be extended with only about 12-15 continuing do to line capacity limitations). If it happens will be mid 2020s at earliest. There have been calls for a station at Westbourne Park, although money was never found for this. Extra terminating platforms clear of the through services would help reliability.
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Post by snoggle on Dec 20, 2017 11:16:05 GMT
I have set out the service build up on Crossrail before but I'll do it again. 10 Dec 2017 - TfL took over operation of 10 suburban stations from GWR to the west of Paddington (Slough not included). May 2018 - TfL take over operation of Heathrow Connect service, increase service to 4 tph using 9 car class 345s. Dec 2018 - Operation of the Crossrail core service from Paddington to Abbey Wood commences. 15tph service. May 2019 - The Shenfield branch is added into the Crossrail core so trains run Paddington to Shenfield / Paddington to Abbey Wood. Dec 2019 - The full Crossrail service commences with services running through from Shenfield to Reading / Abbey Wood to Heathrow T4 and T5 There will be a 24tph service so a train every 5 mins to both Shenfield and Abbey Wood. The service to the west is more variable with 4 tph to Reading, 4 tph to Heathrow and some trains to intermediate points like Maidenhead / West Drayton. Final frequencies are still to be confirmed to the west. There will also be 4 tph peak direction only from Liv St (surface) to Shenfield. Hopefully that answers your question (and any others that may have been lurking in your head). I think something funny happens to the Abbey Wood service in May 2019 The initial 15 tph Service gets a frequency decrease to 12 tph to give an even ratio between Abbey Wood and Shenfield services,. As you would expect this frequency reduction is not included in press releases, but is in the plan in TfL committee reports (even there you need to subtract the Shenfield service from the core service to get the May 2019 Abbey Wood service). There is also a change at Liverpool Street sometime after May 2019 which sees the closure of platform 18 and extending of 16 and 17. Until this happens the peak Liverpool Street services are restricted to7 car. From memory I think I read somewhere that the platform extensions are planned for Christmas/ New Year 2019 (which probably means a 10 day closure of the Peak service) Although services in the core appear to end at the new Crossrail platforms at Paddington there is not a scissors crossover at the East end, so trains continue out of service to reversing sidings near Westbourne Park. Whilst platform staff can check trains are empty and close the doors on a 15 tph Service, I suspect this will be struggle when this happens every 150 seconds. Be interesting to see how they make this work, as any slow disembarking passengers will delay the train leaving the platform. Well TfL are never going to advertise a worse service for anyone are they? Remember it's compulsory to be "happy, happy, happy" about Crossrail. No negativity allowed. You are right that works are planned at Liv St surface to allow 9 car class 345s to work there. I am not certain about the timing of this but it is one reason why class 315s will still be around until 2019 on the Shenfield route. They can access other platforms at Liv St if need be and it provides a float of trains to cover for 7 car class 345s being extended to 9 car which has to happen between May and Dec 2019. I went through the supply contract for the class 345s and worked out how the fleet builds up. Not sure I posted on here but I did on District Dave. I believe TfL / MTR are seeking authority for the trains to "over carry" passengers from Paddington to Westbourne Park sidings and back again. Therefore people who are too slow / asleep will find themselves covering some rare track. I don't think there will be much in terms of platform staff taking ages to ensure trains at empty at Paddington. People will be expected to comply with announcements and displays and trains will then depart for the sidings. As the trains have no exposed inter-car connections there is no risk of people falling on the track. The main risk is aggressive passengers assaulting train crew in the siding area and I assume that issue is under negotiation with the relevant trade union(s).
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Post by busman on Dec 20, 2017 11:41:28 GMT
The temporary boost to 15tph to Abbey Wood is a bonus. The plan has always been to deliver 12tph on that branch, so I don’t see why TfL should advertise the service reduction. More like advertise the temporary increase. In fact the final daytime off peak service may be even more frequent than what TfL promised in the first place, so overall the delivery of the project in South East London has been very good. It’s the part west of Paddington that has some big question marks around it. Stations in the borough of Ealing seem to be falling behind schedule.
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Post by snowman on Jan 17, 2018 12:20:18 GMT
Today (17 Jan 2018) the first site has been handed over for over station development at Soho Place W1 Derwent London will build a 285,000 sq ft building over Tottenham Court Road station (209,000 sq ft offices, 36,000 retail and 40,000 sq ft theatre Link The stations at Woolwich and Canary Wharf were built by the developers (leaving space for the TBMs to pass through in the basements) rather than being a development of airspace separate to station build
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Post by M1104 on Jan 24, 2018 10:04:01 GMT
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Post by snoggle on Jan 31, 2018 13:12:21 GMT
Interesting summary of the discussion on Crossrail issues at the recent TfL Board. rosslydall.wordpress.com/2018/01/31/crossrail-may-miss-december-opening-deadline-after-explosion-and-as-new-trains-suffer-software-problems/Some headlines from the Board discussion. In essence construction is running late at places like Whitechapel and Bond St. At long last someone has confirmed my very long held suspicion that Whitechapel's construction and fit out is way behind where it should be. The East End power connection at Pudding Mill Lane exploded when they switched it on. This has caused a 3 month delay. The electrical equipment was apparently designed incorrectly. This has delayed the start of train testing. They were planning to switch the power on the day of the Board meeting (yesterday) but whether it has happened was still slightly in doubt. A similar installation for the Western power connection is yet to be switched on and has been subject to extensive review to avoid a repeat. Although the guilty supplier was not mentioned the words used by Terry Morgan (who I know of old) suggested he has beyond furious as to what had happened and that a "robust discussion" had been held with the supplier. Software immaturity / unreliability with the class 345s is causing problems with integrated the multiple signalling system interfaces. Back up plan in place to use class 360s into Heathrow from May as class 345's ECTS interface is unlikely to be reliable enough although it does work functionally. Apparently a train has run into Heathrow on 12 and 19 January. The CBTC equipped train is being tested at Old Dalby and is due in London on 16 Feb. It is then expected to run under its own power into the Eastern tunnel section (Abbey Wood - Canary Wharf section) by the end of Feb. Seems the entire programme is now becoming compressed and is having to be managed day to day because some physical works have to be curtailed if train testing is happening. There are also cost pressures emerging - not a surprise because "chuck money at the problem" is often the answer at this late stage of things. Mark Wild (LU MD) and Terry Morgan (Crossrail Chairman) both said there will be an operational railway open in Dec 2018. I do wonder just how "finished" it will be in some places. So lots of "fun" for the Crossrail and TfL teams as the days tick by to December 2018.
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