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Post by John tuthill on Feb 3, 2019 17:49:04 GMT
The Aldwych was created in the 1920s when Kingsway was constructed, and I'll stand corrected if I'm wrong, but it's always been a one-way system(?) Seriously, is there a department that is hell bent of screwing up London? What with Trafalgar Square, and all the cycle routes I'm glad I don't work in London anymore. What it must be to be a service engineer with a van full of spares....... As I've said before highway engineering has phases as to what is "in fashion" and what isn't. They seem to spend a lot of time doing things and later undoing them and the redoing them again. There has always been a political / lobbying aspect behind these changes. It is rarely anything to do with a balanced assessment of overall transport *needs* and how to achieve an appropriate balance. Sadly "balance" is always defined by personal prejudices as to how individuals believe they should be allowed to travel without recognising the needs of others. What we are seeing now is a "fad" towards lowering speed and reducing road space and forcing people on to main roads only. Unfortunately it has gone so far that it is also making bus services less effective / less efficient which is a frankly ridiculous outcome. Well said.
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Post by rif153 on Feb 3, 2019 20:08:44 GMT
Would sending the 68 through the Strand underpass be too radical?
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Post by sid on Feb 3, 2019 20:18:11 GMT
Would sending the 68 through the Strand underpass be too radical? It certainly would be unless it's converted to single decker!
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Post by COBO on Feb 3, 2019 20:54:17 GMT
Would sending the 68 through the Strand underpass be too radical? No because the Strand By Pass has a height limit and double deckers won't be able to go under it.
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Post by southlondonbus on Feb 3, 2019 20:55:31 GMT
Maybe we could even extend the 1 to TB and discontinue the 199 and pull the 320 back to Bromley North. Fantasy I know.
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Post by rif153 on Feb 3, 2019 21:05:41 GMT
Would sending the 68 through the Strand underpass be too radical? No because the Strand By Pass has a height limit and double deckers won't be able to go under it. Oh right, I didn't realise
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Post by rif153 on Feb 3, 2019 21:08:26 GMT
Maybe we could even extend the 1 to TB and discontinue the 199 and pull the 320 back to Bromley North. Fantasy I know. Would you introduce a double run to Canada Water or do you suggest the 1 turns right at the end of Rotherhithe New Road cutting out Canada Water?
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Post by LVF_Admin on Feb 3, 2019 21:08:59 GMT
Maybe we could even extend the 1 to TB and discontinue the 199 and pull the 320 back to Bromley North. Fantasy I know. That would almost be history repeating itself
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Post by southlondonbus on Feb 3, 2019 21:19:02 GMT
Quite hard to believe as late as 1987 that routeing was introduced on the 1. Then again it was only really a renumbering of a short lived incarnation of the 199.
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Post by busaholic on Feb 3, 2019 21:55:30 GMT
Maybe we could even extend the 1 to TB and discontinue the 199 and pull the 320 back to Bromley North. Fantasy I know. The 1 to TB was a hugely unreliable route even fifty years ago, when it ran from Waterloo, with a partially overlapping service from Marylebone to Surrey Docks. I had cause to use it for a period of time, and if it hadn't been for my staff free travel I'd have been even more fed up with it than I was. Even offpeak, I'd doubt more than 50% of the scheduled service ever got through to TB, and I never, over a span of several years, saw two no. 1s in Bromley in the space of a few minutes. They were rare beasts indeed!
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Post by southlondonbus on Feb 3, 2019 22:14:54 GMT
Luckily the 47 paralleled it between TB and Surrey Quays so atleast that was an alternative service.
One of the problems the 1 has suffered is being along along Southwark Park Road. Untill 1999 there was the 199 every 15 mins as far at Elephant to provide assistance. Similar to how the 343 struggled for years.
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Post by vjaska on Feb 3, 2019 23:14:14 GMT
Luckily the 47 paralleled it between TB and Surrey Quays so atleast that was an alternative service. One of the problems the 1 has suffered is being along along Southwark Park Road. Untill 1999 there was the 199 every 15 mins as far at Elephant to provide assistance. Similar to how the 343 struggled for years. They could always extend the 45 to Canada Water once it gets it's stupid cut implemented - I'd certainly use it as I've been visiting the Surrey Quays shopping centre over the last year or so rather than going to Croydon.
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Post by southlondonbus on Feb 3, 2019 23:24:20 GMT
I definetly think another Elephant to Surrey Quays route would be appreciated. It could allow the 1 to drop to maybe every 12 mins as Elephant to Holborn is fairly well bussed and it would reduce the number of buses around Aldwych and Holborn.
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Post by busaholic on Feb 3, 2019 23:32:10 GMT
Luckily the 47 paralleled it between TB and Surrey Quays so atleast that was an alternative service. One of the problems the 1 has suffered is being along along Southwark Park Road. Untill 1999 there was the 199 every 15 mins as far at Elephant to provide assistance. Similar to how the 343 struggled for years. The theoretical combined headway of the 1 and 47 between Bromley Garage and Catford Garage interpeak was 6 minutes, made up of 1 Bromley Garage to Waterloo every 18 minutes, all operated by TL 47 Farnborough to Lewisham every 18 minutes, all operated by TB 47 Bromley Garage to Shoreditch every 18 minutes, mostly operated by TL, but with some Dalston (D) buses too Other 47 buses joined in at TL to make up the bulk of the Shoreditch service. In practice, the only reliable element of the three-pronged joint service was the 'localised' part of the 47, the others being often truncated to Market Square in Bromley or Downham Way, Bromley Road too in the case of the 47. As you say, Southwark Park Road has often suffered a poor service. This corner of SE London was neglected by LT and successors, but at least the Jubilee Line has brought some alleviation. I felt back in the 1970s that a flat fare circular service was needed from Waterloo out via the 188 to Surrey Docks (Quays) then back via the 1 to Waterloo, with both way running via the loop, similar to the S1 Stratford/ East Ham circular. I've said it before, but the lack of a suitable garage within easy reach made such a proposition unlikely to succeed, NX, PM, Q, WL et al being just too far away in practice.
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Post by southlondonbus on Feb 3, 2019 23:42:22 GMT
Probably a big improvement then was the introduction of the 208 in 1982 as it wasn't affected by traffic in central London. The 47 continued for 2 more years running to TB before a localisation as 47A as far at Surrey Quays/Docks. I'm guessing LT felt the 47A lacked purpose and so again made it into a long central route again (199 then 1 again).
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