Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2019 20:43:52 GMT
This has probably been done before but was thinking today what must be the most vague destination displayed on bus blinds.
A few spring to mind for me :
City Thameslink (25)
Prince Regent (325)
Blackwall (15) I think there is a Ham in SW London too
Must be loads more which locals would know but if you new to London you probably wouldn't have a clue.
|
|
|
Post by LT 20181 on Feb 7, 2019 20:56:19 GMT
This has probably been done before but was thinking today what must be the most vague destination displayed on bus blinds.
A few spring to mind for me :
City Thameslink (25)
Prince Regent (325)
Blackwall (15) I think there is a Ham in SW London too
Must be loads more which locals would know but if you new to London you probably wouldn't have a clue.
How's this? Just "Harrow" on routes terminating at Harrow Bus Station - routes 223, 340, 395, 483 and the Harrow H Routes H9/10, H11, H17 & H18/19. Locals know buses are heading for Harrow Bus Station (apart from the 395 which terminates one stop before the bus station at a stop/stand called Kymberley Road). It does seem odd to me though. Most of Transdev's DPS/SDP Plaxton Pointer batch along with First's DM/DML Marshall Capital batch from before 2011 had the "Bus Station" qualifier along with the name "Harrow", but buses from 2011 onwards (such as the Enviro 200s and Gemini 2s) just say "Harrow". I don't know why. Although, I have noticed a new "Bus Station" qualifier on the 483's VWs.
|
|
|
Post by busaholic on Feb 7, 2019 21:01:40 GMT
No doubt in my mind - Angel Road Superstores on 341s. What are passengers at Waterloo Station to make of that? If anything, they're probably inclined to think it's Islington bound.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2019 21:01:40 GMT
Thamesmead East on the 180 springs to mind, as the curtailment point is actually much closer to Belvedere, and isn't very specific at all.
Plain Chiselhurst now shown on the 161 as well.
Southwark Park Road on the 1 is also very vague, especially since the bus doesn't actually serve any of Southwark Park Road if curtailed there (the last stop is on Grange Road), although a little caveat is it isn't actually on the blind, I think they just forgot to order it, as per Abbey Wood on the 180 (which also wasn't present on the blinds until recently).
|
|
|
Post by bigbaddom1981 on Feb 7, 2019 21:05:33 GMT
On routes 192, 329, 317 or any route terminating at Enfield Town
Enfield (for Enfield Town, but how would you know for it being so vague)
|
|
|
Post by lonmark on Feb 7, 2019 21:11:41 GMT
61 arrive in Chislehurst 161 arrive in Chislehurst R7 arrive in Chislehurst.
So where is in Chislehurst... ah... 61 end up at Gordon Arms, 161 end up at War Memorial, R7 end up at Sainsbury.
|
|
|
Post by 15002 on Feb 7, 2019 21:18:25 GMT
Every route that terminates at Barking.
169 displays Barking and the 287 and 238 also displays Barking but they terminate at different parts with 287 and 238 terminating at Barking Station and 169 terminating at Barking Town Centre.
Only exception is the 687 which displays Barking Station when terminating there.
|
|
|
Post by snoggle on Feb 7, 2019 22:02:26 GMT
Must be loads more which locals would know but if you new to London you probably wouldn't have a clue.
Isn't this the curse of every bus network though? I know London has had a long history of via points etc on blinds but many other places have no such legacy. It is almost always the case that a visitor / non resident / new arrival will struggle with however a transport service is described because they won't know the geography. When I grew up in Newcastle the local buses sometimes just displayed "Service" or "Duplicate" and the route number. Others had things like "Throckley" or "Cowgate Circle" and yet people learnt what bus went where and were able to get about. There was no internet, no next bus signs, no route maps at bus stos, no timetables at bus stops. Often there were no route numbers displayed at stops. You had to make a bit of effort to get a timetable and a map or, more likely, your parents took you on the bus or the train and taught you how to use it and when buses were due and what one to catch. I don't specifically recall being taught how to read a timetable or having specific "lessons" from my Mum (Dad drove and didn't really take us on public transport) but somewhere the info sunk in. As I've said before I only "learnt" London's geography and layout by forcing myself off the tube and on to the buses so I could see what the streets were like. Bus maps were a great help. Don't know how I'd do it now with the reduction in Central London routes and absence of detailed paper bus maps. I don't really worry about London's blind displays. It's not as if "Angel Road Superstores" is any real impediment to people boarding the 341 at Waterloo or Clerkenwell or Islington or Newington Green. London almost always has stop info which gives a reasonable clue as to where buses are going and when.
|
|
|
Post by Nathan on Feb 7, 2019 22:17:00 GMT
- 172 to Clarkenwell Green - Not necessarily vague, but this is incorrect now that the route no longer terminates there. It should now be 172 to Farringdon Street, Smithfield like the turns found on the 45 and 63.
- 36 to New Cross Gate - If I remember correctly, the route would terminate at Sainsbury's, but part of the contract for GAL is to allow the route to terminate outside the garage. Could be confusing for people heading to New Cross Gate Station from Peckham side. Not to mention the other routes that also have the same destination name but terminate at other areas.
- H9/H10 to Harrow - Why isn't this destination Harrow-on-the-hill instead?
- 176 to Penge - Used to be Penge, Pawleyne Arms right?
- 37 to Peckham - I'm probably nit-picking at this point, but I have heard people call the bus station a bus garage đ
- 132/229 to Bexley - I can't remember which route has this turning point. It would be nice to have a qualifier as I have no idea where this terminus is. If there was a name a passenger could type into Google Maps then that would make the destination name helpful
- 222 to Cowley - Same issue as the destination above. I remember the first time I went on the 222 and got this turn. This was the first time even hearing if this place lol
|
|
|
Post by vjaska on Feb 7, 2019 22:30:37 GMT
Must be loads more which locals would know but if you new to London you probably wouldn't have a clue.
Isn't this the curse of every bus network though? I know London has had a long history of via points etc on blinds but many other places have no such legacy. It is almost always the case that a visitor / non resident / new arrival will struggle with however a transport service is described because they won't know the geography. When I grew up in Newcastle the local buses sometimes just displayed "Service" or "Duplicate" and the route number. Others had things like "Throckley" or "Cowgate Circle" and yet people learnt what bus went where and were able to get about. There was no internet, no next bus signs, no route maps at bus stos, no timetables at bus stops. Often there were no route numbers displayed at stops. You had to make a bit of effort to get a timetable and a map or, more likely, your parents took you on the bus or the train and taught you how to use it and when buses were due and what one to catch. I don't specifically recall being taught how to read a timetable or having specific "lessons" from my Mum (Dad drove and didn't really take us on public transport) but somewhere the info sunk in. As I've said before I only "learnt" London's geography and layout by forcing myself off the tube and on to the buses so I could see what the streets were like. Bus maps were a great help. Don't know how I'd do it now with the reduction in Central London routes and absence of detailed paper bus maps. I don't really worry about London's blind displays. It's not as if "Angel Road Superstores" is any real impediment to people boarding the 341 at Waterloo or Clerkenwell or Islington or Newington Green. London almost always has stop info which gives a reasonable clue as to where buses are going and when. Correct me if Iâm wrong but most places outside London bar major town centres only have one terminus unlike in London where a place like Brixton has multiple places particularly as London areas are far more built up and have a far denser bus network. Outside of London, you are almost forced to learn your local routes due to different variations & the usually lower frequency - for me, Iâd welcome the return of accurate destinations.
|
|
|
Post by snoggle on Feb 7, 2019 22:54:25 GMT
Correct me if Iâm wrong but most places outside London bar major town centres only have one terminus unlike in London where a place like Brixton has multiple places particularly as London areas are far more built up and have a far denser bus network. Outside of London, you are almost forced to learn your local routes due to different variations & the usually lower frequency - for me, Iâd welcome the return of accurate destinations. Sorry to say it but you're wrong. Newcastle used to have 4 bus stations plus a whole load of cross city routes. In the days of Metro integration you had shedloads of services that departed only from suburban interchanges but you used the Metro to reach them. Now Newcastle has two bus stations plus cross city routes plus multiple and varied on street stands with loop workings. Sunderland used to have two bus stations. One was closed down due to redevelopment. Most services, bar cross town locals, went to the upgraded Park Lane interchange. Unfortunately traffic congestion has worsened journey times and in order to save money Stagecoach pulled all of the "E" services to South Shields out of the Interchange. If you want those routes having arrived at the Interchange you have to trek across the town centre. I found this to my cost last time I was there. Birmingham has no cross city centre services since pedestrianisation. Routes only run from satellite stopping points around the centre - you have to walk between them to change buses. There is next to no signposting of where to go for what buses. You're just assumed to know. Manchester has multiple stopping points across the City Centre. Bristol is similar with the bus station only really catering for inter-urban and coach services. Trying to cross Bristol is not easy and that's before you get to the shambles that are stop locations and frequencies. Leicester has two bus stations but not every route serves those bus stations. IIRC Centrebus city routes don't use either of them. For no great reason I was looking at Tamworth's bus services today - they don't all stop in one place either and very few serve the railway station. If you wanted to change between some routes you'd have to walk across the town centre. I won't go on because for every exception there are also places with a single bus station that all routes serve or a main street with a load of on street stops. However things are now a lot worse than prior to deregulation because there was no great commercial pressure to sell off bus stations and garages nor was there a battle of wits between councils (who owned bus stations) and operators over departure charges. You only need to look at what Stagecoach has done in many places to bus stations and bus garages to realise that property sale windfalls were more important than passenger convenience. Of course we are now headed in London to the worst practice seen outside - the removal of the 97 and 357 from Walthamstow Bus station is the first example. The Croydon town centre changes are the next set of "don't run to bus stations or across town centres" nonsense. I predict Harrow is next and there is a long list after that. It was very telling last night on my way home on the 97 that not a single person alighted or boarded at the new Bridge stop for the Central but there were 20 people waiting at the next stop along Hoe St. I assume those poor souls had to walk all the way through the bus station, down an alley, up the High St and then into Hoe Street to get their bus home. It was raining last night so they all got wet. In the past they'd have been under cover in the bus station. Can you tell I really HATE this change?
|
|
|
Post by ronnie on Feb 7, 2019 22:55:46 GMT
No doubt in my mind - Angel Road Superstores on 341s. What are passengers at Waterloo Station to make of that? If anything, they're probably inclined to think it's Islington bound. Think that has become a bit easier as now it reads âNorthumberland Park, angel road superstoresâ in most cases
|
|
|
Post by rhys on Feb 8, 2019 0:07:36 GMT
This is more so incorrect but 76 for âWaterlooâ when it actually terminates at Lambeth North (Lower Marsh). Whatâs odd is that when routes like 12, 53 & 453 are curtailed to Lambeth North, they terminate at the same stop as 76 depending on the direction theyâre coming from and actually show Lambeth North. Not sure if I agree with this one, seeming as Lambeth North is only indirectly served in one direction, just before its terminus. I think âWaterlooâ being displayed more highlights the main national station that is served, than it does of where the route stands. Plus technically, it does set down underneath Waterloo station, at Lower Marsh. Moreover, the 76, ironically, itself does not stop at any stops that call âLambeth North Stationâ. Years ago, âBaylis Roadâ was used as a qualifier, however if TfL were to be more specific with the destinations around the Waterloo area, other routes like the 341 and 381 would also need their destination blinds to be altered. Although the 12 [1], 159, 453, 53 etc all display âLambeth Northâ when setting down there, most journeys are usually coming from the south, where Lambeth North station wouldâve been served just prior to setting down. Itâs the opposite of what the 76 does essentially. [1] the 12 displays âWestminster Bridge Roadâ instead of Lambeth North, when a non LT is used on the route.
|
|
|
Post by busaholic on Feb 8, 2019 0:21:28 GMT
No doubt in my mind - Angel Road Superstores on 341s. What are passengers at Waterloo Station to make of that? If anything, they're probably inclined to think it's Islington bound. Think that has become a bit easier as now it reads âNorthumberland Park, angel road superstoresâ in most cases Wow, that's a result.
|
|
|
Post by stuckonthe486 on Feb 8, 2019 0:30:18 GMT
"Blackheath" on the 386, when it was extended to Blackheath Village - huge confusion because the route already went through Blackheath Royal Standard. Now amended.
|
|