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Post by Volvo on Dec 2, 2023 22:52:13 GMT
The HV's are no slouch, had one or two do some serious speeds without limiter on. A HV can get up to speed quicker than at HT however a HT can breeze out a HV if driven properly. Our 67reg ADHs and the older 62 plates are rapid and are quicker upto any speed than the 18/68 VHs. However the older VHs that I have driven the 15/65regs that were at BT are far quicker than any ADHs trust me on that, those VHs were rapid!!! Especially the 15regs we had on the 125s last year, they would do 30 up the hills on the 125s (just like the 67reg ADHs) but they were quicker, Hounslow really looked after them, they remind me of many of Arrivas 66 - 67reg HVs @ AR/EC. The 68 reg ADHs we have though are just dreadful buses, they struggle to even maintain 25 up Harrow Weald even with a run up and that was when they were new, they are even worse you would be doing 30 and as soon as you touch the incline after the KFC the speed would drop to 20 on some of them, where the 62regs would hit around 28, the 67 regs would sail past 30 if you kept your foot down. Pulling away from the bus stop opposite KFC for Harrow Weald Garage, the 67regs again would sail past 30, then 62regs would hit around 28-30 but the 68regs are not making it past 20, even the useless 18/68reg VHs manage around 26-27 by the the time they get to the top at the roundabout after pulling away from said stop. The 15regs we had when one escaped onto the H12 hit 30 and was still going again matching the 67reg ADHs. Honestly I wish RATP ordered more 67reg ADHs and we had those instead of the 18/68 VHs which are slow, laggy things.
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Post by vjaska on Dec 3, 2023 1:52:05 GMT
I remember those S reg ADL's they were nasty. Nice when new but by the time they were transferred to [EC] for the W15 they were well and truly battered. It reminds me of the first batch of P reg ALX200 for the 230 after 5 years they were rolling wrecks, the faults they had on them was unbelievable and falling to pieces. The only thing decent was the exterior paintwork. I remember a lot of drivers did not want to drive the 230 because of the condition of them. Heck at times I remembered seeing it on the 173 around Beckton Asda. I preferred the X-reg ones. Oh yes I remembered the P-reg ones on the 230 which had the low floor bus writing on the side. Similar to the Wright pathfinders on the 101. I think the 167 and 20 back in it's grey green days also had their own P-reg buses but I think they were single doored. The X reg PDL's had a lot of character but the few at TH were sluggish though boy did they sound beasty - the roar on them was brilliant. Only took one ride on the S reg ALX200's on the 78 and that was enough, terrible batch along with the equally bad V reg ADL's on the 407. The W XKX from the W14 & 397 were a bit better - the 410 got about 5 for a PVR increase and they were interesting at the very least - ADL63 had suspension issues, ADL64 would max rev in first gear just before changing into 2nd whilst the others were decent.
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Post by ADH45258 on Dec 3, 2023 1:52:41 GMT
A HV can get up to speed quicker than at HT however a HT can breeze out a HV if driven properly. Our 67reg ADHs and the older 62 plates are rapid and are quicker upto any speed than the 18/68 VHs. However the older VHs that I have driven the 15/65regs that were at BT are far quicker than any ADHs trust me on that, those VHs were rapid!!! Especially the 15regs we had on the 125s last year, they would do 30 up the hills on the 125s (just like the 67reg ADHs) but they were quicker, Hounslow really looked after them, they remind me of many of Arrivas 66 - 67reg HVs @ AR/EC. The 68 reg ADHs we have though are just dreadful buses, they struggle to even maintain 25 up Harrow Weald even with a run up and that was when they were new, they are even worse you would be doing 30 and as soon as you touch the incline after the KFC the speed would drop to 20 on some of them, where the 62regs would hit around 28, the 67 regs would sail past 30 if you kept your foot down. Pulling away from the bus stop opposite KFC for Harrow Weald Garage, the 67regs again would sail past 30, then 62regs would hit around 28-30 but the 68regs are not making it past 20, even the useless 18/68reg VHs manage around 26-27 by the the time they get to the top at the roundabout after pulling away from said stop. The 15regs we had when one escaped onto the H12 hit 30 and was still going again matching the 67reg ADHs. Honestly I wish RATP ordered more 67reg ADHs and we had those instead of the 18/68 VHs which are slow, laggy things. It's odd that RATP chose to order just 4x ADHs for the 258, only to go for VHs for other routes around the same time (18/635) and most subsequent hybrid orders (all apart from the H12/H14). Plus BT were familiar with VHs at the time on the 139. I do wonder why RATP didn't go for more ADHs, at least for the 79, or even for the 105/406 too. However if RATP had ordered ADHs instead of the 18/68reg VHs as you said, these would have been more ultracaps at that point in time.
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Post by vjaska on Dec 3, 2023 1:53:27 GMT
And Sundays too when it is quiet. The DLAs were monsters on the A406, never driven one in service but as Training vehicles. The 492s DWs was the closest thing to a DLA I’ve driven In service. Those DW's from the South were practically the same. Drove a few of the ex 19 batch The 403 DW's (54 reg) were my favourite of the lot just because their acceleration was a little more rapid than the rest though I liked all the different batches TBH
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Post by vjaska on Dec 3, 2023 1:57:04 GMT
A HV can get up to speed quicker than at HT however a HT can breeze out a HV if driven properly. Our 67reg ADHs and the older 62 plates are rapid and are quicker upto any speed than the 18/68 VHs. However the older VHs that I have driven the 15/65regs that were at BT are far quicker than any ADHs trust me on that, those VHs were rapid!!! Especially the 15regs we had on the 125s last year, they would do 30 up the hills on the 125s (just like the 67reg ADHs) but they were quicker, Hounslow really looked after them, they remind me of many of Arrivas 66 - 67reg HVs @ AR/EC. The 68 reg ADHs we have though are just dreadful buses, they struggle to even maintain 25 up Harrow Weald even with a run up and that was when they were new, they are even worse you would be doing 30 and as soon as you touch the incline after the KFC the speed would drop to 20 on some of them, where the 62regs would hit around 28, the 67 regs would sail past 30 if you kept your foot down. Pulling away from the bus stop opposite KFC for Harrow Weald Garage, the 67regs again would sail past 30, then 62regs would hit around 28-30 but the 68regs are not making it past 20, even the useless 18/68reg VHs manage around 26-27 by the the time they get to the top at the roundabout after pulling away from said stop. The 15regs we had when one escaped onto the H12 hit 30 and was still going again matching the 67reg ADHs. Honestly I wish RATP ordered more 67reg ADHs and we had those instead of the 18/68 VHs which are slow, laggy things. I find B5LH's are suited to flat, longer distance routes where the gears are ideal whereas I think the ADL hybrids in general are better for either hilly work (I've come across a lot of B5LH's that are great at climbing hills with a run up but aren't so great when starting from a standstill on a hill) or more sedate running which is why I'm surprised some HV's wern't dislodged elsewhere to be used on the SL1 and have the HA's take their place instead
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Post by SouthLondoner468 on Dec 3, 2023 2:04:55 GMT
Our 67reg ADHs and the older 62 plates are rapid and are quicker upto any speed than the 18/68 VHs. However the older VHs that I have driven the 15/65regs that were at BT are far quicker than any ADHs trust me on that, those VHs were rapid!!! Especially the 15regs we had on the 125s last year, they would do 30 up the hills on the 125s (just like the 67reg ADHs) but they were quicker, Hounslow really looked after them, they remind me of many of Arrivas 66 - 67reg HVs @ AR/EC. The 68 reg ADHs we have though are just dreadful buses, they struggle to even maintain 25 up Harrow Weald even with a run up and that was when they were new, they are even worse you would be doing 30 and as soon as you touch the incline after the KFC the speed would drop to 20 on some of them, where the 62regs would hit around 28, the 67 regs would sail past 30 if you kept your foot down. Pulling away from the bus stop opposite KFC for Harrow Weald Garage, the 67regs again would sail past 30, then 62regs would hit around 28-30 but the 68regs are not making it past 20, even the useless 18/68reg VHs manage around 26-27 by the the time they get to the top at the roundabout after pulling away from said stop. The 15regs we had when one escaped onto the H12 hit 30 and was still going again matching the 67reg ADHs. Honestly I wish RATP ordered more 67reg ADHs and we had those instead of the 18/68 VHs which are slow, laggy things. I find B5LH's are suited to flat, longer distance routes where the gears are ideal whereas I think the ADL hybrids in general are better for either hilly work (I've come across a lot of B5LH's that are great at climbing hills with a run up but aren't so great when starting from a standstill on a hill) or more sedate running which is why I'm surprised some HV's wern't dislodged elsewhere to be used on the SL1 and have the HA's take their place instead Yeah, I too have noticed recently that some of the HVs on 249/468 are more suited to flat roads. Some of the HVs (especially the 17 reg) recently have been quite sluggish, with some going up Anerley/South Norwood Hill at about 5mph— feels like I’m on a T in New Addington! Whereas you get MMCs on the 196/SL6 shooting up South Norwood Hill like nothing. However, most of the HVs are still very good and can get to speed, even uphill very quickly.
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Post by mkay315 on Dec 3, 2023 5:22:02 GMT
Heck at times I remembered seeing it on the 173 around Beckton Asda. I preferred the X-reg ones. Oh yes I remembered the P-reg ones on the 230 which had the low floor bus writing on the side. Similar to the Wright pathfinders on the 101. I think the 167 and 20 back in it's grey green days also had their own P-reg buses but I think they were single doored. The X reg PDL's had a lot of character but the few at TH were sluggish though boy did they sound beasty - the roar on them was brilliant. Only took one ride on the S reg ALX200's on the 78 and that was enough, terrible batch along with the equally bad V reg ADL's on the 407. The W XKX from the W14 & 397 were a bit better - the 410 got about 5 for a PVR increase and they were interesting at the very least - ADL63 had suspension issues, ADL64 would max rev in first gear just before changing into 2nd whilst the others were decent. I know a few that were on the 289 also transferred to DX for the 173 PVR increase. One reg I remembered in particular was X475GGO (PDL25). I always remembered seeing that one with the Black Stopping sign in capital letters. At one point DX also had some S-JUA darts that came off the 319 but I can't remember which ones they were. I'll have a look through my archives.
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Post by ServerKing on Dec 3, 2023 6:08:35 GMT
And Sundays too when it is quiet. The DLAs were monsters on the A406, never driven one in service but as Training vehicles. The 492s DWs was the closest thing to a DLA I’ve driven In service. Those DW's from the South were practically the same. Drove a few of the ex 19 batch The 05 plate ones on the 19 were beasts it was great when a few DWs headed north to the 349 for a while before leaving London Miss the DLPs though (Euro3 examples) Of the Euro2 DLAs, apart from 6226 and her sisters thrashed on the 370, was DLA156 at Tottenham. DLA239 had a knackered diff but was still great to ride on the 243 early mornings (remenisces to times before 20 zones in London)
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Post by ServerKing on Dec 3, 2023 6:18:39 GMT
I find B5LH's are suited to flat, longer distance routes where the gears are ideal whereas I think the ADL hybrids in general are better for either hilly work (I've come across a lot of B5LH's that are great at climbing hills with a run up but aren't so great when starting from a standstill on a hill) or more sedate running which is why I'm surprised some HV's wern't dislodged elsewhere to be used on the SL1 and have the HA's take their place instead Yeah, I too have noticed recently that some of the HVs on 249/468 are more suited to flat roads. Some of the HVs (especially the 17 reg) recently have been quite sluggish, with some going up Anerley/South Norwood Hill at about 5mph— feels like I’m on a T in New Addington! Whereas you get MMCs on the 196/SL6 shooting up South Norwood Hill like nothing. However, most of the HVs are still very good and can get to speed, even uphill very quickly. The way some of Tottenham's HVs behave, you'd think they'd spent their lives on the hills on the 412 Sluggish starts, jerky gearchanges... can't wait until the electrics start next year, hope the rollout isn't as painful as the 307's
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Post by HV92 on Dec 3, 2023 6:35:36 GMT
I can go back even further as I’m getting old lol and I remember the M’s used to vary so much. During my school days I used to get the 121 to school when AD had a part allocation. M510 GYE 510W was an awesome bus, especially from Oakwood station , that bus used to fly!
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Post by TB123 on Dec 3, 2023 11:27:43 GMT
Those DW's from the South were practically the same. Drove a few of the ex 19 batch The 403 DW's (54 reg) were my favourite of the lot just because their acceleration was a little more rapid than the rest though I liked all the different batches TBH 102 was the best of that batch imo. And 95, 98 was also very good. Had some very fun rides on those "back in the day" on the 264s across Mitcham Common or on diversion via the full length of Roman Way. The 53 plates at CN were excellent too, 41 being my personal favourite
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Post by Volvo on Dec 3, 2023 14:12:34 GMT
Our 67reg ADHs and the older 62 plates are rapid and are quicker upto any speed than the 18/68 VHs. However the older VHs that I have driven the 15/65regs that were at BT are far quicker than any ADHs trust me on that, those VHs were rapid!!! Especially the 15regs we had on the 125s last year, they would do 30 up the hills on the 125s (just like the 67reg ADHs) but they were quicker, Hounslow really looked after them, they remind me of many of Arrivas 66 - 67reg HVs @ AR/EC. The 68 reg ADHs we have though are just dreadful buses, they struggle to even maintain 25 up Harrow Weald even with a run up and that was when they were new, they are even worse you would be doing 30 and as soon as you touch the incline after the KFC the speed would drop to 20 on some of them, where the 62regs would hit around 28, the 67 regs would sail past 30 if you kept your foot down. Pulling away from the bus stop opposite KFC for Harrow Weald Garage, the 67regs again would sail past 30, then 62regs would hit around 28-30 but the 68regs are not making it past 20, even the useless 18/68reg VHs manage around 26-27 by the the time they get to the top at the roundabout after pulling away from said stop. The 15regs we had when one escaped onto the H12 hit 30 and was still going again matching the 67reg ADHs. Honestly I wish RATP ordered more 67reg ADHs and we had those instead of the 18/68 VHs which are slow, laggy things. It's odd that RATP chose to order just 4x ADHs for the 258, only to go for VHs for other routes around the same time (18/635) and most subsequent hybrid orders (all apart from the H12/H14). Plus BT were familiar with VHs at the time on the 139. I do wonder why RATP didn't go for more ADHs, at least for the 79, or even for the 105/406 too. However if RATP had ordered ADHs instead of the 18/68reg VHs as you said, these would have been more ultracaps at that point in time. I know they would have been more ultracrap, hence I wrote I wish.
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Post by Volvo on Dec 3, 2023 14:18:17 GMT
Our 67reg ADHs and the older 62 plates are rapid and are quicker upto any speed than the 18/68 VHs. However the older VHs that I have driven the 15/65regs that were at BT are far quicker than any ADHs trust me on that, those VHs were rapid!!! Especially the 15regs we had on the 125s last year, they would do 30 up the hills on the 125s (just like the 67reg ADHs) but they were quicker, Hounslow really looked after them, they remind me of many of Arrivas 66 - 67reg HVs @ AR/EC. The 68 reg ADHs we have though are just dreadful buses, they struggle to even maintain 25 up Harrow Weald even with a run up and that was when they were new, they are even worse you would be doing 30 and as soon as you touch the incline after the KFC the speed would drop to 20 on some of them, where the 62regs would hit around 28, the 67 regs would sail past 30 if you kept your foot down. Pulling away from the bus stop opposite KFC for Harrow Weald Garage, the 67regs again would sail past 30, then 62regs would hit around 28-30 but the 68regs are not making it past 20, even the useless 18/68reg VHs manage around 26-27 by the the time they get to the top at the roundabout after pulling away from said stop. The 15regs we had when one escaped onto the H12 hit 30 and was still going again matching the 67reg ADHs. Honestly I wish RATP ordered more 67reg ADHs and we had those instead of the 18/68 VHs which are slow, laggy things. I find B5LH's are suited to flat, longer distance routes where the gears are ideal whereas I think the ADL hybrids in general are better for either hilly work (I've come across a lot of B5LH's that are great at climbing hills with a run up but aren't so great when starting from a standstill on a hill) or more sedate running which is why I'm surprised some HV's wern't dislodged elsewhere to be used on the SL1 and have the HA's take their place instead I agree about the operational purposes of both vehicle types. As I mentioned in my lengthy post, E400Hs are more suited to start/stop situations and B5LHs open roads. In regards to your comment about E400Hs and Hills I can only speak from my own experience as a driver on the buses I have driven at Arriva and RATP and that experience is the battery powered E400Hs are great on hills but the ultracraps are not. Also B5LHs between 2015-2017 generally have better performance than the 2018 ones and I do mean a night and day difference. Also the 2011-2013 B5LHs I have driven are a mixed bag, some are rockets and some are snails. The most rapid one I have driven was HV54, the most rapid Euro 6 B5LH I have driven was HV376. The most rapid Euro 5 E400H I have driven was ADH45049 and the most rapid Euro 6 example was ADH45261 and I absolutely promise you both HV54 and HV376 would leave both E400Hs for dead in acceleration. HV54 was also the fastest of the lot as it's limiter is 52mph, HV376 is 44mph and there E400Hs 47mph (but did not enjoy staying at that speed, they preferred 45mph).
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Post by mkay315 on Dec 3, 2023 16:24:36 GMT
The X reg PDL's had a lot of character but the few at TH were sluggish though boy did they sound beasty - the roar on them was brilliant. Only took one ride on the S reg ALX200's on the 78 and that was enough, terrible batch along with the equally bad V reg ADL's on the 407. The W XKX from the W14 & 397 were a bit better - the 410 got about 5 for a PVR increase and they were interesting at the very least - ADL63 had suspension issues, ADL64 would max rev in first gear just before changing into 2nd whilst the others were decent. I know a few that were on the 289 also transferred to DX for the 173 PVR increase. One reg I remembered in particular was X475GGO (PDL25). I always remembered seeing that one with the Black Stopping sign in capital letters. At one point DX also had some S-JUA darts that came off the 319 but I can't remember which ones they were. I'll have a look through my archives. Looking through my archives from 2004/05 I wrote S316 JUA down as one bus I hopped on which had the bench seats and this link confirmed it for me. www.flickr.com/photos/cheeky_barstard/4799008879/in/photolist-2nsxCwj-oxuJoT-DDVwfk-rLsYMR-dwnEfi-fydnyc-q483AH-sQ8qKz-rZiuWL-qD5EWB-pBihuK-re6VfH-oWWvD5-riKfcC-bDgW1v-tmzr7V-ut2ooa-pUk3P4-87YzTe-gobD9x-tun5xx-8j5b9p-mNwyye-QqzzG5-usFmna-ub6fQA-rxVHNJvjaska
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Post by vjaska on Dec 3, 2023 17:22:42 GMT
The DDL’s were nice buses and I’m glad the majority remained in the south - DDL12 was my favourite due to having a more throaty sound. The majority managed to escape a refurb and keep the Cowie moquette, bar the few that ended up seeing out their London days at GR and I think at least one did get Arriva moquette too
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