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Post by abellion on Dec 25, 2023 6:57:29 GMT
Sounds like AR batch Gemini 3s starting to overrev due to the long term flat battery issue causing slow acceleration. A very common issue across all garages, companies and Volvo batches. I believe the WN Gemini 3 batch had gotten new batteries recently alongside their refurbishments. Most 17 reg stuff having this issue now due to being 6/7 years old. For some reason it takes 1-2 years to sort out. Batteries only lasting 6/7 years really isn’t very good, I see why hybrids didn’t really catch on outside of London. More expensive to buy AND huge midlife running costs due to battery replacement, not to mention the waste. After the second battery cycle that really only limits a very expensive bus to 14 years use. Thats terrible! How do ADL hybrids compare? Are the first of the 2nd generation ADL hybrids (like the 14-regs on the 156, 205 and 345) still on their original batteries? I’m wondering the same about ADL hybrids, I cannot believe the 2014 ones are starting to turn 10 already with how flawless their performance generally is
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Post by wirewiper on Dec 25, 2023 7:35:36 GMT
Funnily enough I was about in Reading today where I rode a ADL Hybrid on the route X4 to Bracknell. I cannot ever see Hybrids or Electrics becoming the norm outside of London due to the reasons you mention. Are you sure it was hybrid as Reading converted their hybrids to diesels? Hybrids are old hat at this point and never became the norm outside London because the savings were never really their hence why most provincial examples were converted to diesel. Electrics don’t exactly fall into this category - batteries have improved since then and will continue to do so all the time as per any technology I believe that 211-217 used on lion 4/X4 are still hybrid drive. The sky blue vehicles (routes 15/16) and the berry vehicles (routes 23/24) were converted to direct diesel drive in 2018-2019 when they were refurbished after being displaced from purple 17. The yellow 26 vehicles were refurbished during 2020 when it was decided not to buy new replacements due to financial constraints during the Covid pandemic (205 had been converted to full electric as a trial but proved unreliable, so has been scrapped). I'm not sure of the status of the generic vehicles. The lion vehicles are due to be replaced soon, by new ADL Enviro400 City similar to the seven delivered for routes 702 and 703 this year.
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Post by DE20106 on Dec 25, 2023 8:42:52 GMT
Batteries only lasting 6/7 years really isn’t very good, I see why hybrids didn’t really catch on outside of London. More expensive to buy AND huge midlife running costs due to battery replacement, not to mention the waste. After the second battery cycle that really only limits a very expensive bus to 14 years use. Thats terrible! How do ADL hybrids compare? Are the first of the 2nd generation ADL hybrids (like the 14-regs on the 156, 205 and 345) still on their original batteries? I’m wondering the same about ADL hybrids, I cannot believe the 2014 ones are starting to turn 10 already with how flawless their performance generally is There’s no question of it the ADL hybrid system is vastly superior to the Volvos, even if they’re more flammable 😂 although the Volvos have a higher top speed iirc, that doesn’t usually matter though for gridlocked London roads. That only matters for routes like the SL1
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Post by mark on Dec 25, 2023 9:35:05 GMT
Batteries only lasting 6/7 years really isn’t very good, I see why hybrids didn’t really catch on outside of London. More expensive to buy AND huge midlife running costs due to battery replacement, not to mention the waste. After the second battery cycle that really only limits a very expensive bus to 14 years use. Thats terrible! How do ADL hybrids compare? Are the first of the 2nd generation ADL hybrids (like the 14-regs on the 156, 205 and 345) still on their original batteries? Funnily enough I was about in Reading today where I rode a ADL Hybrid on the route X4 to Bracknell. I cannot ever see Hybrids or Electrics becoming the norm outside of London due to the reasons you mention. All of Reading’s hybrids have been converted to straight diesel drivelines.
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Post by yunus on Dec 25, 2023 11:32:46 GMT
TfL had almost entirely stopped specifying straight-diesel double decks buses upon the advent of Euro6, with little more than 100 entering service between 2014 and 2017. It wasn't down to Arriva, as operators order what TfL specify, largely. at some point Tfl are gonna realise that they are wasting money on unreliable Hybrid and EV Buses. Tfl gonna realise it too late Fully agree but they will not admit it.
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Post by yunus on Dec 25, 2023 11:34:03 GMT
Funnily enough I was about in Reading today where I rode a ADL Hybrid on the route X4 to Bracknell. I cannot ever see Hybrids or Electrics becoming the norm outside of London due to the reasons you mention. All of Reading’s hybrids have been converted to straight diesel drivelines. The reason why I thought it was a Hybrid is cos it still had the info e.g cleaner promotion etc inside the bus on the top deck.
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Post by Dad91 on Dec 25, 2023 12:51:59 GMT
All of Reading’s hybrids have been converted to straight diesel drivelines. The reason why I thought it was a Hybrid is cos it still had the info e.g cleaner promotion etc inside the bus on the top deck. I still believe hybrids better. Buses last longer. TfL wasting money on electric country not even ready for
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Post by londonbuses on Dec 25, 2023 13:40:22 GMT
Any idea which extra buses are going to be used for the 312's extension yet?
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Dec 25, 2023 13:49:49 GMT
Any idea which extra buses are going to be used for the 312's extension yet? Aren't these the extra EMCs that were drafted in from RATP?
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Post by londonbuses on Dec 25, 2023 14:19:09 GMT
Any idea which extra buses are going to be used for the 312's extension yet? Aren't these the extra EMCs that were drafted in from RATP? I don't think 12 buses is enough for the extended route given its current PVR is 9. Maybe it will use a couple of the 289's buses (potentially the two MMC ENXs) since the SL5 has a lower PVR than the 289.
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Post by SILENCED on Dec 25, 2023 14:38:57 GMT
Aren't these the extra EMCs that were drafted in from RATP? I don't think 12 buses is enough for the extended route given its current PVR is 9. Maybe it will use a couple of the 289's buses (potentially the two MMC ENXs) since the SL5 has a lower PVR than the 289. I think the award of 9 included the extension. Was not aware it has changed from 7 which would be the original EMC1-9
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Post by yunus on Dec 25, 2023 17:09:34 GMT
I’m wondering the same about ADL hybrids, I cannot believe the 2014 ones are starting to turn 10 already with how flawless their performance generally is There’s no question of it the ADL hybrid system is vastly superior to the Volvos, even if they’re more flammable 😂 although the Volvos have a higher top speed iirc, that doesn’t usually matter though for gridlocked London roads. That only matters for routes like the SL1 Maybe the ADLs Hybrid system needs to be stronger as they are the series version which means the bus is driven solely by battery power.
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Post by YY13VKP on Dec 25, 2023 17:44:03 GMT
Any idea which extra buses are going to be used for the 312's extension yet? Aren't these the extra EMCs that were drafted in from RATP? Yes those should make up the allocation for the 312 once extended.
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Post by yunus on Dec 25, 2023 19:31:00 GMT
Batteries only lasting 6/7 years really isn’t very good, I see why hybrids didn’t really catch on outside of London. More expensive to buy AND huge midlife running costs due to battery replacement, not to mention the waste. After the second battery cycle that really only limits a very expensive bus to 14 years use. Thats terrible! How do ADL hybrids compare? Are the first of the 2nd generation ADL hybrids (like the 14-regs on the 156, 205 and 345) still on their original batteries? I’m wondering the same about ADL hybrids, I cannot believe the 2014 ones are starting to turn 10 already with how flawless their performance generally is The ADL Hybrids are fantastic and the way they pick up instantly is 👌. I guess it is cos they are driven by battery power?
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Post by vjaska on Dec 25, 2023 20:14:37 GMT
Funnily enough I was about in Reading today where I rode a ADL Hybrid on the route X4 to Bracknell. I cannot ever see Hybrids or Electrics becoming the norm outside of London due to the reasons you mention. All of Reading’s hybrids have been converted to straight diesel drivelines. I said that but wirewiper with his excellent knowledge on Reading has put that straight with the X4 ones still retaining their hybrid drivelines
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