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Post by borneobus on Jul 8, 2023 0:16:15 GMT
Good point re this routing. The 'policing' concrete bollards before the bridge were a challenge in a Renault Laguna, goodness knows how something the size of an Enviro 200 would navigate it.
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Post by borneobus on Jul 8, 2023 0:33:14 GMT
I'm quite interested in the governance around these proposed changes and sure someone will be able to clarify:
So both the proposed new routes H21 and N30 are fully within 'London' and the contract will be between Hallmark Connections and Heathrow Airport Holdings.
So I assume that in terms of route delivery and performance Hallmark would be accountable to Heathrow, and not TfL? Who sets fares, and the rules around whether Oyster Cards / Freedom Passes can be used? What is TfL's role in these proposed changes?
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Post by Dstock7080 on Jul 8, 2023 7:07:32 GMT
Who sets fares, and the rules around whether Oyster Cards / Freedom Passes can be used? Hallmark set the £1 flat fare, no Oyster or concessions/Freedom passes
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Post by mark on Jul 8, 2023 7:22:42 GMT
I'm quite interested in the governance around these proposed changes and sure someone will be able to clarify: So both the proposed new routes H21 and N30 are fully within 'London' and the contract will be between Hallmark Connections and Heathrow Airport Holdings. So I assume that in terms of route delivery and performance Hallmark would be accountable to Heathrow, and not TfL? Who sets fares, and the rules around whether Oyster Cards / Freedom Passes can be used? What is TfL's role in these proposed changes? They run under a London Service Permit so are registered with TfL but do not form part of the London buses network. There are precedents for such routes entirely within London such as the (now withdrawn) 812 and, of course, all the sightseeing services.
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Post by cardinal on Jul 8, 2023 18:16:01 GMT
Quite excited about these additions - think I will spend some time reviewing them
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Post by BE37054 (quoll662) on Jul 13, 2023 12:40:28 GMT
The N30 looks like an intriguing route. It could be really useful to have a night bus to Heathrow, especially for days when the Night Tube isn't running. It needs to be publicised to succeed though, as I imagine most people round here won't know about it so will just get a taxi to Heathrow if they need to be there at an ungodly hour for a flight. Could have some success with shift workers though as there are no Heathrow flights between midnight and 5am. The route looks like its trying a bit too hard to slavishly follow the Piccadilly Line by going via Popes Lane and Swnycombe Avenue. I think it would be better for the route to begin at Acton, serve Ealing Broadway then go down Northfield Avenue - Northfields is only a short walk to South Ealing or Boston Manor so it would act as a hub stop. Then it would go down Swyncombe Avenue and Boston Manor Road to reach the A4. Fills a gap the N9 leaves , although I’m not sure it will be well used fri & sat nights given the night tube. Nice to see though. Although some employers still send employees cabs to get them to work at the airport in the small hours. On Saturdays and Sundays (presume Fri/Sat nights) the route only operates between Heathrow Central and Heathrow Terminal 4.
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Post by MoEnviro on Jul 19, 2023 18:27:37 GMT
Further update-
BM coaches to operate a new Route H30 from Heathrow Terminal 4 to Terminal 5 via Cargo area in Stirling and Sealand Roads. Running every 20 mins between 0500 and 2340.
First Slough Route 4 to be renumbered A4 and Mon-Fri daytime frequency is increased to every 15 mins. Also improvements to early morning service on every day of the week from 0300 with frequency increased to every 30 mins.
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Post by M1199 on Jul 21, 2023 12:07:13 GMT
Something that’s intrigued me for a while now is how come Bear Buses’ route 305 has never been extended the few hundred metres down the Bath Road from Colnbrook to T5. It’s routing would surely attract some Heathrow traffic and I’m pretty sure they have some euro_6 compliant vehicles in their fleet now.
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Post by galwhv69 on Jul 21, 2023 18:02:25 GMT
Something that’s intrigued me for a while now is how come Bear Buses’ route 305 has never been extended the few hundred metres down the Bath Road from Colnbrook to T5. It’s routing would surely attract some Heathrow traffic and I’m pretty sure they have some euro_6 compliant vehicles in their fleet now. Could Heathrow possibly charge a fee to use Terminal 5 & Central Bus Stations, which Bear Buses may have found not worth it for potential passenger numbers
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Post by mark on Jul 22, 2023 15:09:13 GMT
Something that’s intrigued me for a while now is how come Bear Buses’ route 305 has never been extended the few hundred metres down the Bath Road from Colnbrook to T5. It’s routing would surely attract some Heathrow traffic and I’m pretty sure they have some euro_6 compliant vehicles in their fleet now. Could Heathrow possibly charge a fee to use Terminal 5 & Central Bus Stations, which Bear Buses may have found not worth it for potential passenger numbers I'm pretty certain that access fees for local bus services were dropped by HAL some years ago. As far as the 305 goes, it only runs six times a day on weekdays, with no early or late buses, so is unlikely to appeal to Heathrow employees. The bits of its route with potentially worthwhile numbers of airport workers are largely covered by other routes.
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Post by cardinal on Jul 23, 2023 6:39:04 GMT
Further update- BM coaches to operate a new Route H30 from Heathrow Terminal 4 to Terminal 5 via Cargo area in Stirling and Sealand Roads. Running every 20 mins between 0500 and 2340. First Slough Route 4 to be renumbered A4 and Mon-Fri daytime frequency is increased to every 15 mins. Also improvements to early morning service on every day of the week from 0300 with frequency increased to every 30 mins. That’s a bit weird. The 482/490’ already do that. Unless the H30 is going to be free. Then I would understand. TfL area totally out of this other than the former X26 The 203,423,U3 could perhaps do with an increase. And the A10 & 423 a night service. Although the 203 only serves Hatton X it’s very well used by airport workers.
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Post by mark on Jul 23, 2023 7:40:29 GMT
Further update- BM coaches to operate a new Route H30 from Heathrow Terminal 4 to Terminal 5 via Cargo area in Stirling and Sealand Roads. Running every 20 mins between 0500 and 2340. First Slough Route 4 to be renumbered A4 and Mon-Fri daytime frequency is increased to every 15 mins. Also improvements to early morning service on every day of the week from 0300 with frequency increased to every 30 mins. That’s a bit weird. The 482/490’ already do that. Unless the H30 is going to be free. Then I would understand. TfL area totally out of this other than the former X26 The 203,423,U3 could perhaps do with an increase. And the A10 & 423 a night service. Although the 203 only serves Hatton X it’s very well used by airport workers. Yes, the H30 will be free to all. As for the 203 it will be fully double deck imminently but I can’t see TfL upping the frequency of a cross border route. Although certainly busy I can’t recall ever seeing anyone left behind so guess the capacity provided is adequate! A large number of Stanwellites use it to access the tube at Hatton X. The enhanced 555 will provide additional capacity on the Stanwell - Hatton X section from September - there will be 5 BPH over this section (albeit via slightly different routes).
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Post by cardinal on Jul 23, 2023 8:00:50 GMT
That’s a bit weird. The 482/490’ already do that. Unless the H30 is going to be free. Then I would understand. TfL area totally out of this other than the former X26 The 203,423,U3 could perhaps do with an increase. And the A10 & 423 a night service. Although the 203 only serves Hatton X it’s very well used by airport workers. Yes, the H30 will be free to all. As for the 203 it will be fully double deck imminently but I can’t see TfL upping the frequency of a cross border route. Although certainly busy I can’t recall ever seeing anyone left behind so guess the capacity provided is adequate! A large number of Stanwellites use it to access the tube at Hatton X. The enhanced 555 will provide additional capacity on the Stanwell - Hatton X section from September - there will be 5 BPH over this section (albeit via slightly different routes). Hallmarks are certainly pushing the boat out. They lose the 458 soon. Just wondering whether the additional drivers needed for all this will inevitably add more strain in SW and W London. How ironic that over two decades ago now London United in partnership with SCC and Heathrow Airport launched better services on that route , along with providing non stop buses from Feltham to T4 and T123 (numbered same) Good to see some improvements. Also nice to see White Buses get into London (just). A great local operator. Hallmarks are just a bit hit and miss - the H21 seems to be scheduled with one bus out and no recovery time at Bedfont. I don’t think that will work out too well.
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Post by wirewiper on Jul 23, 2023 16:26:37 GMT
Something that’s intrigued me for a while now is how come Bear Buses’ route 305 has never been extended the few hundred metres down the Bath Road from Colnbrook to T5. It’s routing would surely attract some Heathrow traffic and I’m pretty sure they have some euro_6 compliant vehicles in their fleet now. The 305 service is supported financially by the Royal Borough of Windsor & Maidenhead so is designed to meet the needs of local residents. I presume the Borough is not interested in paying to extend it to the Airport as alternative services already exist for many locations.
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Post by gwiwer on Aug 1, 2023 14:15:38 GMT
Thorney isn't that far from the U3 but has been left out of all London bus operations. The width restriction exists to limit traffic from passing through a fairly restricted village and the narrower roads of West Drayton once served by the 224A (to Mill Road). There isn't a suitable turn for a TfL bus in Thorney meaning any operation would have to pass through the width restriction and into Buckinghamshire. It used to be a toss-up whether you walked into Iver for the 459 at Richings Park or up to Swan Road for a 224A. Both went to Uxbridge and took as long as each other; both ran hourly but the 224A charged "central" fares while the 459 being a country bus charged slightly more. If there is a need for a bus between Iver and Heathrow why not make it an all-day offering? And incorporate the mortal remains of the original 459 which currently as the 583 manages a single trip from Uxbridge down Thorney Lane (rather than the old and more useful route through the houses) to Richings Park. I know it crosses boundaries but if it's supported by Heathrow through Bucks then why not a TfL Uxbridge - Iver - Thorney - Sipson - Heathrow service? Let's call it the U11. The other proposals are also interesting. Routes which offer only a handful of trips in the small hours are unlikely to ever gain widespread awareness and decent patronage. Again it's Heathrow pumping the funding to relieve pressure on private cares, taxies etc which is a good thing if the buses actually get used. I can't see a need for a dedicated Heathrow - Uxbridge night bus alongside the N9 / 222 when a quick-ish change along the Bath Road, even if not at exactly the same stop, will allow the journey to be completed with a Hopper fare. Or do we divert the 222 via Heathrow Central overnight as the N222?
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