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Post by vjaska on Nov 14, 2020 19:46:06 GMT
Until a few years ago buses used to run via Denmark Hill in order to serve East Dulwich properly, but as you say, this is quite a bit longer. Plus it means that you don't stop right outside North Dulwich. Go back a few more years and it would have been easy to serve East Dulwich by following the 37's old routeing via Melbourne Grove. No idea if Melbourne Grove is still passable for buses, but in any case the bus stops have been removed, so there wouldn't be a stop near the station anyway. I lived round there for many years and had no idea the replacement service took the long way around via Denmark Hill! Learn something new every day! The 37 along Melbourne Grove was a bit of a nightmare if an oncoming bus appeared! Even if it was still a through road, I doubt anybody would want to see buses running along there again. Re North Dulwich I'm sure there there was a period when the 37 ran via Village Way, perhaps on diversion? Nowadays the bridge has a 14'3" height restriction so it wouldn't be passable for double deckers. I think the current arrangement is a reasonable compromise, though potentially dis-satisfactory for accessibility - after all East Dulwich has step-free access from street level to the platforms. Yeah, Melbourne Grove was incredibly problematic, remember those times especially when two 37's met on that section which created issue when taking into account the parked cars. The East Dulwich on Melbourne Grove stop was also blocked up on occasions by cars from memory. As for Village Way, I don't think the 37 has used it since at least 1988 (and I only mention that date as my bus map from that time period has the 37 down as using the current routing via the whole stretch of Half Moon Lane. When the bridge at North Dulwich had to be closed due to needing strengthening work in the late 90's, the 37 was diverted non stop via Dulwich Village, Dulwich Common, West Dulwich, Croxted Road & Norwood Road.
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Post by 6HP502C on Nov 18, 2020 23:31:51 GMT
I'd quite like to give the Alexandra Palace to Hertford North route a go one day and definitely St Pancras to St Albans. Maybe in the future, but I understand when Go Ahead do them it's usually buses from NP. Next route to review will be London Bridge to Tulse Hill via East Dulwich. Should be a lively one with 38 minutes end to end! You will surely have an opportunity to do Ally Pally to Hertford North in the near future, As TA1 rightly says, the Hertford Loop is closed for the next few Sundays. It’s probably the route that I have to put Rail Replacement timetables together for the most, certainly for Thameslink and Great Northern . Next weekend during the Kings Cross block there are plenty of rail replacement jobs on for Great Northern. Go-Ahead may supply buses from other garages along with NP to cover these jobs although Victoria is also blocked I believe. Sadly I'm missing out on all the action this weekend . Victoria to East Croydon is a great route to do. It's one of those routes where in the past buses have vanished inexplicably and could be seen running in convoys of four or five with only the one at the front knowing the way. And you hear the passengers speculating as to whether or not the bus will get lost. It's quite possibly the best one of them all to do in London, just so long as you're not instructed to lead four other buses along the whole route! Since those days I think the frequency has been halved to 6bph and there was a route learning session recently so those issues should be a thing of the past. There's usually a bus service between Victoria and Streatham Hill which doesn't appear to be on this weekend and isn't mentioned online. National Rail suggests anyone travelling from Streatham Hill to Balham should go via Croydon! Quite like the idea of that way of working. Is that agency work or something else ? Ebbsfleet is bleak at the moment, the M&S cafe has closed. Take a packed lunch ! Ebbsfleet was bleak. I procured sustenance at the start of the shift and requested a MEC due to their ability to remain toastily warm inside while stationary. Other bus types don't have any heaters, just windscreen demisters which remain cold if the vehicle isn't moving. One bus on the Greenhithe to Strood route kept coming into Ebbsfleet instead of serving Northfleet. It gave me a job to do, dropping passengers to Northfleet.
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Post by redexpress on Nov 19, 2020 7:48:31 GMT
Sadly I'm missing out on all the action this weekend . Victoria to East Croydon is a great route to do. It's one of those routes where in the past buses have vanished inexplicably and could be seen running in convoys of four or five with only the one at the front knowing the way. And you hear the passengers speculating as to whether or not the bus will get lost. It's quite possibly the best one of them all to do in London, just so long as you're not instructed to lead four other buses along the whole route! Since those days I think the frequency has been halved to 6bph and there was a route learning session recently so those issues should be a thing of the past.
Trouble with the Vic - East Croydon route was that the pilots didn't always know the route either! I remember a trip on a Metroline West bus, with a driver who knew absolutely nothing of South London, following a Go-Ahead pilot bus that was running empty, leaving the poor Metroline driver to deal with all the passengers.
It started off badly with the lead driver forgetting that he was acting as a pilot, zooming past all the stops, with our driver only stopping because of frantic bell-ringing by passengers (or frantic waving from people at bus stops). As a result we missed out the Balham loop altogether. By Norbury the lead driver had remembered that he had to wait for us, but we soon realised we'd have been better off without him. Between Thornton Heath and Selhurst he got completely lost, and when he started leading us down Alverston Gardens - a narrow residential cul-de-sac off Selhurst Road - I stepped in, and our driver was all too happy to accept my offer to lead him to East Croydon! We left the lead driver to plough on down the cul-de-sac... he eventually turned up at East Croydon some 20 minutes after us
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Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2020 10:28:56 GMT
Quite a big District Line closure with DL6/7/8 running this weekend and the LO service X running Shadwell to Dalston.
Sunday, Chislehurst to Sevenoaks, Dartford to Gillingham, Ebbsfleet to Strood , Gravesend to Maidstone West, Bromley South to Orpington, Chislehurst to Orpington non stop and Lewisham to Hayes,
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Post by 6HP502C on Nov 19, 2020 13:09:37 GMT
Trouble with the Vic - East Croydon route was that the pilots didn't always know the route either! I remember a trip on a Metroline West bus, with a driver who knew absolutely nothing of South London, following a Go-Ahead pilot bus that was running empty, leaving the poor Metroline driver to deal with all the passengers. It started off badly with the lead driver forgetting that he was acting as a pilot, zooming past all the stops, with our driver only stopping because of frantic bell-ringing by passengers (or frantic waving from people at bus stops). As a result we missed out the Balham loop altogether. By Norbury the lead driver had remembered that he had to wait for us, but we soon realised we'd have been better off without him. Between Thornton Heath and Selhurst he got completely lost, and when he started leading us down Alverston Gardens - a narrow residential cul-de-sac off Selhurst Road - I stepped in, and our driver was all too happy to accept my offer to lead him to East Croydon! We left the lead driver to plough on down the cul-de-sac... he eventually turned up at East Croydon some 20 minutes after us Going down Alverston Gardens is not an easy mistake to make. There are missed turns, there are wrong turns, then there are ramming buses down narrow, marked no through roads. Getting a bus into that road in itself must have been a challenge! There are quite a few hard bits. Clapham Junction to Balham is complex thanks to several banned left and right turns in the Clapham Common area. In the past the maps have sent buses via Clapham Common, omitting Wandsworth Common completely. Sometimes the maps do send buses via Wandsworth Common. The Balham station loop is a common omission. Sometimes a mistake and sometimes naughtily to avoid the time penalty. Every time I served that station there were always passengers and station staff with quite vocal comments on wait times. Norbury to Selhurst is also quite complicated. The stop for Norbury is quite a distance before the railway bridge and easily missed and buses have been known to take the wrong left turn onto Norbury Avenue, or miss the unlikely looking turn onto Norbury Crescent. Some buses have missed Park Road. One time I arrived at East Croydon. Not long after, a convoy of six buses rolled in together and were sent back out together! I didn't overtake any of those buses despite following the mapped route so the passengers must have had an adventure. I wonder where exactly buses are terminating now Dingwall Road can't be used as a stand.
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Post by YY13VKP on Nov 20, 2020 0:05:10 GMT
You will surely have an opportunity to do Ally Pally to Hertford North in the near future, As TA1 rightly says, the Hertford Loop is closed for the next few Sundays. It’s probably the route that I have to put Rail Replacement timetables together for the most, certainly for Thameslink and Great Northern . Next weekend during the Kings Cross block there are plenty of rail replacement jobs on for Great Northern. Go-Ahead may supply buses from other garages along with NP to cover these jobs although Victoria is also blocked I believe. Sadly I'm missing out on all the action this weekend . Victoria to East Croydon is a great route to do. It's one of those routes where in the past buses have vanished inexplicably and could be seen running in convoys of four or five with only the one at the front knowing the way. And you hear the passengers speculating as to whether or not the bus will get lost. It's quite possibly the best one of them all to do in London, just so long as you're not instructed to lead four other buses along the whole route! Since those days I think the frequency has been halved to 6bph and there was a route learning session recently so those issues should be a thing of the past. There's usually a bus service between Victoria and Streatham Hill which doesn't appear to be on this weekend and isn't mentioned online. National Rail suggests anyone travelling from Streatham Hill to Balham should go via Croydon! Quite like the idea of that way of working. Is that agency work or something else ? Ebbsfleet is bleak at the moment, the M&S cafe has closed. Take a packed lunch ! Ebbsfleet was bleak. I procured sustenance at the start of the shift and requested a MEC due to their ability to remain toastily warm inside while stationary. Other bus types don't have any heaters, just windscreen demisters which remain cold if the vehicle isn't moving. One bus on the Greenhithe to Strood route kept coming into Ebbsfleet instead of serving Northfleet. It gave me a job to do, dropping passengers to Northfleet. There's no Streatham Hill to Victoria bus timed for this week due to the Victoria to Croydon buses running instead. Think Southern have ticket acceptance on route 255 between Balham and Streatham Hill to cover that.
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Post by 6HP502C on Dec 5, 2020 7:51:57 GMT
Last Sunday the Chatham Main Line was closed between Herne Hill and Shortlands. A rail replacement service was laid on between Denmark Hill and Bromley South. I did a late shift. I last did the route in 2015 with MAN 14.240/MCV Evolution 709 from MB. Pleased to report nothing at all on the route has changed since then. The routeThe service runs every 30 minutes all day. Stops served are Denmark Hill, Herne Hill, West Dulwich, Sydenham Hill, Penge East, Kent House, Beckenham Junction, Shortlands and Bromley South. Denmark Hill to Herne Hill is via the eponymous Denmark Hill and, er, Herne Hill. Serving Herne Hill station both ways necessitates a double run down Dulwich Road, turning the bus via Hurst Street, Railton Road and Rymer Street, the turning procedure the 201 uses. Thence via Croxted Road, serving West Dulwich and onto South Croxted Road, past the Gipsy Hill roundabout and onto Kingswood Drive, from where Sydenham Hill station is served. Route 450 is followed along Westwood Hill as far as Sydenham station, then route 194 is followed through Penge East and Kent House (served from Beckenham Road) as far as the War Memorial then along Rectory Road to Beckenham Junction station forecourt. Despite at least half a dozen TfL routes running between Beckenham and Bromley, this one still forges its own path. It follows the 227 as far as Shortlands station, served from the 358 stops on Shortlands Road then onto Hayes Lane and Westmoreland Road to Bromley South. The official route is to take the passengers on a loop around Kentish Way in order to park outside Bromley South station. But in practice it made more sense to set down opposite the station then scramble for a parking space on Ravensbourne Road or Ringers Road. The route had a simple enough structure, few opportunities for confusion. There weren't many significant hazards, but turning out of Rymer Street onto Dulwich Road in Herne Hill was a bit dodgy - people love parking illegally, close to the corner with no consideration of the tailswing of the buses that need to turn out of that road. Negotiable with care and caution, just about. At the end of the day there was an extension trip from Herne Hill to Victoria. Two routes were permitted, one via Brixton and one via Camberwell New Road. Sadly I've recycled the maps now, forgot to note which river crossing was shown given Vauxhall Bridge is shut northbound. LoadingsNo more than about 8 people at a time. Quite a few short trips mid-route where no parallel TfL route offered links. The final trip from Bromley South to Victoria, set down only after Penge East had one passenger ride from Bromley to Herne Hill. Running timesThis route is timed for Sunday shopping hours. Given there aren't really any traffic hotspots along the route, the running times were a good call, not too excessive in the evening. 15 minutes were given between Herne Hill and Denmark Hill. 16 minutes given from Herne Hill to Victoria. One extreme to the other! Vehicle ChoiceMercedes Evobus Citaro. Buses from most of GAL's garages put in appearances on the other duties. SummaryA nice little route. No traffic, no drama. Not necessarily an easy one for those unfamiliar with the area. Route difficulty rating - 2/3 (intermediate) Enjoyability - 3/5 (moderate) Next route review - TBC. I'm being sent into the country for the first time tomorrow with a Horsham - Barnham standby duty. I don't propose to review routes out of the TfL area, but may do a partial review of Purley to Horley if I'm on it next weekend!
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Post by ronnie on Dec 5, 2020 8:51:18 GMT
Trouble with the Vic - East Croydon route was that the pilots didn't always know the route either! I remember a trip on a Metroline West bus, with a driver who knew absolutely nothing of South London, following a Go-Ahead pilot bus that was running empty, leaving the poor Metroline driver to deal with all the passengers. It started off badly with the lead driver forgetting that he was acting as a pilot, zooming past all the stops, with our driver only stopping because of frantic bell-ringing by passengers (or frantic waving from people at bus stops). As a result we missed out the Balham loop altogether. By Norbury the lead driver had remembered that he had to wait for us, but we soon realised we'd have been better off without him. Between Thornton Heath and Selhurst he got completely lost, and when he started leading us down Alverston Gardens - a narrow residential cul-de-sac off Selhurst Road - I stepped in, and our driver was all too happy to accept my offer to lead him to East Croydon! We left the lead driver to plough on down the cul-de-sac... he eventually turned up at East Croydon some 20 minutes after us Going down Alverston Gardens is not an easy mistake to make. There are missed turns, there are wrong turns, then there are ramming buses down narrow, marked no through roads. Getting a bus into that road in itself must have been a challenge! There are quite a few hard bits. Clapham Junction to Balham is complex thanks to several banned left and right turns in the Clapham Common area. In the past the maps have sent buses via Clapham Common, omitting Wandsworth Common completely. Sometimes the maps do send buses via Wandsworth Common. The Balham station loop is a common omission. Sometimes a mistake and sometimes naughtily to avoid the time penalty. Every time I served that station there were always passengers and station staff with quite vocal comments on wait times. Norbury to Selhurst is also quite complicated. The stop for Norbury is quite a distance before the railway bridge and easily missed and buses have been known to take the wrong left turn onto Norbury Avenue, or miss the unlikely looking turn onto Norbury Crescent. Some buses have missed Park Road. One time I arrived at East Croydon. Not long after, a convoy of six buses rolled in together and were sent back out together! I didn't overtake any of those buses despite following the mapped route so the passengers must have had an adventure. I wonder where exactly buses are terminating now Dingwall Road can't be used as a stand. Out of curiosity, what’s the “correct” route if there’s one?
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Post by 6HP502C on Dec 6, 2020 4:18:17 GMT
Out of curiosity, what’s the “correct” route if there’s one? There is a mapped route but it's very long to describe - I'm going to look into showing the route as a layer on Google Maps or similar to make it easier to visualise.
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Post by ronnie on Dec 6, 2020 13:14:40 GMT
Out of curiosity, what’s the “correct” route if there’s one? There is a mapped route but it's very long to describe - I'm going to look into showing the route as a layer on Google Maps or similar to make it easier to visualise. Thanks! Yes that would be good enough. Somehow I always love maps and routes
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Post by 6HP502C on Dec 7, 2020 21:52:27 GMT
Right, I've had a go at creating a map of the Victoria to East Croydon route - Google Maps link. It's not perfect, but the route and bus stop locations are correct. When I figure it out properly I'll try and make it an ongoing feature of future reviews
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Post by ronnie on Dec 7, 2020 22:58:53 GMT
Right, I've had a go at creating a map of the Victoria to East Croydon route - Google Maps link. It's not perfect, but the route and bus stop locations are correct. When I figure it out properly I'll try and make it an ongoing feature of future reviews Thanks! It is a touch complex I must say!
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Post by 6HP502C on Dec 8, 2020 0:49:58 GMT
I've had a go at laying out some of the other routes I've rated a 3/3 for difficulty. Stratford to Richmond - Google Maps linkHammersmith to Heathrow Terminal 5 - Google Maps linkAnd the most dreaded route of them all which has ongoing problems with buses failing to serve the stations - St Pancras to Elstree & Borehamwood - Google Maps link. This one has a layer for West Hamstead to St Pancras too that can be toggled on and off. Having laid that one out on the map, use of sav-nav is almost certain to be a problem. Drivers relying on it are going to come unstuck as some of the stations are situated on roads that are bus only, rendering the sat-nav useless. There are also many banned turns that force different routes either way throughout the route.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2020 12:08:51 GMT
Anyone have a clue regarding operators on the PL and DL closures in West London over Christmas and New Year ?
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Post by jamirie on Dec 9, 2020 15:55:44 GMT
Anyone have a clue regarding operators on the PL and DL closures in West London over Christmas and New Year ? Abellio will be operating the following: DL4 Fulham Broadway-Wimbledon on Boxing day only. PL1 Gunnersbury-Northfields 24th-30th of December (excluding Christmas day) PL3 Hammersmith-Heathrow Central 24th-30th of December (excluding Christmas day)
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