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Post by ADH45258 on Mar 26, 2024 14:28:38 GMT
Are there plans for any routes to move garages when the S3 goes to Abellio? For example the K3 could move to TV and the 419 to FW (similar to 85 FW > TV and 216 WK > FW when the 265 was lost). I don't see the K3 moving to TV. If anything, the 71 is a better choice of route to move but like TB123 said more likely when the 465 goes. However if the 71 is retained with electrics, I could see it stay at FW and the K3 go to TV. I think it's been mentioned that TV has issues with electrification, so probably also rules out new electrics for the K5 if retained (though the current SDEs could do a short term contract).
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Post by londonbuses on Mar 26, 2024 14:33:27 GMT
Are there plans for any routes to move garages when the S3 goes to Abellio? For example the K3 could move to TV and the 419 to FW (similar to 85 FW > TV and 216 WK > FW when the 265 was lost). I don't see the K3 moving to TV. If anything, the 71 is a better choice of route to move but like TB123 said more likely when the 465 goes. Ideally both should be at TV, but why is the 71 a better choice than the K3? Also the N65 uses hybrids off the 71, which means it is unlikely it will move to TV.
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Post by ADH45258 on Mar 26, 2024 14:37:36 GMT
Could depend on the 71's tender result, TV would be better placed for the 71 if it doesn't get electrics Not sure AV is viable in its current form so I doubt the 419 will move out unless there is a major reallocation or garage closure in plan. Due to limited capacity at Abellio and Metroline nearby, RATP probably have a good chance of retaining the Hounslow area routes that are due, but I'm not sure there's much they could bid for to gain - there's the 482 and H28, and perhaps the 285 or SL7 later on. But RATP probably don't need to have both AV and WK. Really I think it might have been a better decision to electrify AV for the 235 rather than WK (or even run it from FW). WK is smaller than AV and not as well located, but harder to justify any sort of closure or mothballing now that it is wired up. WK had already been reduced to an outstation after some losses, but the closure of EB meant that space was needed again - though they have since lost more routes. Regarding the 419 though, I think it could still move to FW or V if there is a significant saving over remaing at AV.
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Post by JUNIOR26 on Mar 26, 2024 15:17:19 GMT
I don't see the K3 moving to TV. If anything, the 71 is a better choice of route to move but like TB123 said more likely when the 465 goes. Ideally both should be at TV, but why is the 71 a better choice than the K3? Also the N65 uses hybrids off the 71, which means it is unlikely it will move to TV. Why should the K3 be at TV? There's a reason why FW was the preferred choice of garage to TV.
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Post by JUNIOR26 on Mar 26, 2024 15:19:29 GMT
I don't see the K3 moving to TV. If anything, the 71 is a better choice of route to move but like TB123 said more likely when the 465 goes. However if the 71 is retained with electrics, I could see it stay at FW and the K3 go to TV. I think it's been mentioned that TV has issues with electrification, so probably also rules out new electrics for the K5 if retained (though the current SDEs could do a short term contract). The 71s likely to retain its hybrids, so cannot see it going electric.
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Post by southlondon413 on Mar 26, 2024 15:21:03 GMT
Ideally both should be at TV, but why is the 71 a better choice than the K3? Also the N65 uses hybrids off the 71, which means it is unlikely it will move to TV. Why should the K3 be at TV? There's a reason why FW was the preferred choice of garage to TV. IIRC at the time of 2018 contract RATP had to base it at FW to accommodate the drivers moving over from TF as TV was too far for them to move. I’m sure I remember reading that here.
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Post by JUNIOR26 on Mar 26, 2024 16:52:21 GMT
Why should the K3 be at TV? There's a reason why FW was the preferred choice of garage to TV. IIRC at the time of 2018 contract RATP had to base it at FW to accommodate the drivers moving over from TF as TV was too far for them to move. I’m sure I remember reading that here. It wasn't necessarily that they had to but the drivers on the route were considered hence why FW was preferred over TV.
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Post by LK65EBO on Mar 26, 2024 17:01:15 GMT
Has SP40206 been withdrawn?
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Post by paulo on Mar 26, 2024 19:51:14 GMT
Not sure AV is viable in its current form so I doubt the 419 will move out unless there is a major reallocation or garage closure in plan. Due to limited capacity at Abellio and Metroline nearby, RATP probably have a good chance of retaining the Hounslow area routes that are due, but I'm not sure there's much they could bid for to gain - there's the 482 and H28, and perhaps the 285 or SL7 later on. But RATP probably don't need to have both AV and WK. Really I think it might have been a better decision to electrify AV for the 235 rather than WK (or even run it from FW). WK is smaller than AV and not as well located, but harder to justify any sort of closure or mothballing now that it is wired up. WK had already been reduced to an outstation after some losses, but the closure of EB meant that space was needed again - though they have since lost more routes. Regarding the 419 though, I think it could still move to FW or V if there is a significant saving over remaing at AV. Hounslow garages location offers good redevelopment opportunities. It maybe one of the considerations for RATP as part of their strategic review particularly as there is little they can gain now in the next few years on tenders. Majority of the remaining routes can be reallocated without much increase in mileage. A loss of the H22 or H98 maybe the final nail in the coffin.
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Post by londonbuses on Mar 26, 2024 20:43:10 GMT
Due to limited capacity at Abellio and Metroline nearby, RATP probably have a good chance of retaining the Hounslow area routes that are due, but I'm not sure there's much they could bid for to gain - there's the 482 and H28, and perhaps the 285 or SL7 later on. But RATP probably don't need to have both AV and WK. Really I think it might have been a better decision to electrify AV for the 235 rather than WK (or even run it from FW). WK is smaller than AV and not as well located, but harder to justify any sort of closure or mothballing now that it is wired up. WK had already been reduced to an outstation after some losses, but the closure of EB meant that space was needed again - though they have since lost more routes. Regarding the 419 though, I think it could still move to FW or V if there is a significant saving over remaing at AV. Hounslow garages location offers good redevelopment opportunities. It maybe one of the considerations for RATP as part of their strategic review particularly as there is little they can gain now in the next few years on tenders. Majority of the remaining routes can be reallocated without much increase in mileage. A loss of the H22 or H98 maybe the final nail in the coffin. This is definitely true, it is in a prime location for new flats. The H98 is probably the only route that couldn't easily be reallocated (110 to V, 419 and H22 to FW, 117 203 H37 and school routes to WK) so is the most likely to be lost if there are any plans for closure.
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Post by LK65EBO on Mar 26, 2024 20:43:52 GMT
Hounslow garages location offers good redevelopment opportunities. It maybe one of the considerations for RATP as part of their strategic review particularly as there is little they can gain now in the next few years on tenders. Majority of the remaining routes can be reallocated without much increase in mileage. A loss of the H22 or H98 maybe the final nail in the coffin. This is definitely true, it is in a prime location for new flats. The H98 is probably the only route that couldn't easily be reallocated (110 to V, 419 and H22 to FW, 117 203 and school routes to WK) so is the most likely to be lost if there are any plans for closure. Why couldn't the H98 be moved to WK? The H22 used to also be a WK route many years ago until the 105 came in.
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Post by londonbuses on Mar 26, 2024 20:45:47 GMT
This is definitely true, it is in a prime location for new flats. The H98 is probably the only route that couldn't easily be reallocated (110 to V, 419 and H22 to FW, 117 203 and school routes to WK) so is the most likely to be lost if there are any plans for closure. Why couldn't the H98 be moved to WK? It could do but I don't think there would be enough space for the 117, 203, H37, H98 and school routes to all move.
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Post by ADH45258 on Mar 26, 2024 21:42:54 GMT
Why couldn't the H98 be moved to WK? It could do but I don't think there would be enough space for the 117, 203, H37, H98 and school routes to all move. They might just about, or at least be able to fit all apart from the H37, which could be run from FW if needed. But would mean no scope for RATP to expand in this area in the future, particularly considering that Abellio and Metroline are already full at nearby garages, and as some of the remaining AV routes would fill up the remaining space at FW (plus TV as part of a reshuffle). Also consider that WK runs some non-TFL services including the Kingston Uni routes. It's still possible RATP could bid successfully for the 278, 285, 337, 482, H28 or SL7. Particularly the SL7 would be a good gain with a PVR of 20, could run from TV, FW or WK with other routes moving as required? And the 278 and H28 are in tranches with existing RATP routes so could place a joint bid. A bit later on in the tendering programme there's also the 493 and H25. I think a bigger concern for RATP would be how they address Tolworth garage if it isn't suitable for electrification (as has been suggested). Would they eventually need to look for a replacement garage in the area? And a similar situation at Park Royal as well.
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Post by LK65EBO on Mar 28, 2024 20:27:25 GMT
Not sure if I read the plate wrong but I think SP40193 is now at Tootbus.
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Post by rj131 on Mar 29, 2024 9:02:36 GMT
I don’t know if this has gone under the radar or not but SP40051 appears to be the last RATP Scania standing
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