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Post by wirewiper on Aug 4, 2024 7:45:22 GMT
So to sum up what we think we know, at 09.00 on Saturday 3rd August we have: 217 - operated by Arriva (AR), possibly emergency timetable 298 - operated by Uno, definite emergency timetable with limted service, ceasing around 18.00 299 - operated by Go-Ahead (NP), possibkly emergency timetable 327 - suspended UFN 389 - suspended UFN 399 - suspended UFN 549 - interim operation by Stagecoach (WH) until service changes on 7th September. Possibly full timetable. W9 - operated by Stagecoach (AW), possibly emergency timetable. School routes 605, 606, 617, 629 to be retendered for the start of school term in September. 640 has already been awarded to metroline to start in September. Please feel free to update, correct, or fill in any gaps! And what i think we know now, twelve hours later: 217 has been operated by Arriva (AR), using some of its own Enviro400s and some hired in. 298 has been operated by Uno on an emegrency timetable. 299 has been operated by Go-Ahead (NP) using 61-reg SEs on a reduced timetable. 327 appears to have had some level of service operated by Metroline (PB) 389/399 have not operated today but may have a service from Monday 549 has not operated today but Stagecoach plans to operate the service from Monday. W9 did not operate this morning, but Stagecpoach had buses from HK out from around mid-day. 720 was operated by RATP (SO) from mid-day onwards, initially with a reduced timetable. As I said before - if you know better than I do, speak up! According to a post on the RATP thread, 720 is a commercial fleet operation and is using buses and drivers from a number of garages. |
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Post by COBO on Aug 4, 2024 7:53:15 GMT
Makes you wonder if TfL can do this to a small operator what about a big operator. Maybe lets try that with Stagecoach specifically RM  If that was to happen you won’t be seeing a 365 for a while as TfL will struggle to find another operator in time get enough buses to run all Stagecoach routes including the 365. If finding another operator to operate buses routes from a small operator is hard imagine if Stagecoach who has several garages both sides of the Thames I bet that would be pain. |
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Post by greenboy on Aug 4, 2024 7:55:33 GMT
This from London Busroutes site...
Sullivan Buses
Sullivan Buses has issued a press release stating that it will cease operating all its TfL services with effect from 3 August 2024. Other operator13:29 03/08/2024s have been asked to step in and provide replacement services as follows:
217 Arriva
298 Uno
299 Go-Ahead London
389 Go-Ahead London
399 Go-Ahead London
549 Stagecoach
W9 Stagecoach
No operator so far advised for the 327
School routes 605 606 617 629 640 (these are not currently operating anyway due to school holidays)
Services on all routes are likely to be severely disrupted for several weeks at least, and there may be no service at all for the next few days.
These changes will be added to the main website pages once the position is clearer.
Routes 298, 299, 389, 399 and 640 had already been awarded to other operators and the 549 was due to cease in September. The 217, 327 and W9 are currently out to tender.
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Post by WH241 on Aug 4, 2024 9:14:58 GMT
Unlikely I know but do wonder if the Woodford restructure was designed to speed up the removal of Sullivan from the TfL network. The way the 549 was handled is just weird when they describe the W14 as restructured! I would understand a restructure at one end but not both. It seems almost convenient that the W12, W13 and W14 were up for tender then they decided to consult on changes and extend the existing contracts then tender at a later date. I think TfL could be confident that Stagecoach would have put in a joint bid for the three routes.
Was the 549 contract formally terminated by tfL as it never reached a break point? Would Sullivan been compensated for the removal?
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Post by Londontransport3 on Aug 4, 2024 9:52:33 GMT
This from London Busroutes site... Sullivan Buses Sullivan Buses has issued a press release stating that it will cease operating all its TfL services with effect from 3 August 2024. Other operator13:29 03/08/2024s have been asked to step in and provide replacement services as follows: 217 Arriva 298 Uno 299 Go-Ahead London 389 Go-Ahead London 399 Go-Ahead London 549 Stagecoach W9 Stagecoach No operator so far advised for the 327 School routes 605 606 617 629 640 (these are not currently operating anyway due to school holidays) Services on all routes are likely to be severely disrupted for several weeks at least, and there may be no service at all for the next few days. These changes will be added to the main website pages once the position is clearer. Routes 298, 299, 389, 399 and 640 had already been awarded to other operators and the 549 was due to cease in September. The 217, 327 and W9 are currently out to tender. 327 Started Yesterday afternoon with Metroline Operating it |
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Post by evergreenadam on Aug 4, 2024 9:57:37 GMT
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Post by galwhv69 on Aug 4, 2024 10:05:14 GMT
I did enjoy doing work for Sullivans, and quite a few of the regular staff were great to work with, however unfortunately this wasn't enough to keep the operation going Have you found something else, such as W9, 217 etc with the operators that took over? Don't have a PCV yet lol, I've only been a service controller/supervisor, mostly on rail replacement. Luckily I'm on holiday at the moment, and the work I do on the buses is on a casual (mostly weekend) basis as I work full time on the railways. I'm casual for quite a few agencies, so have other options such as RRSS (for Metroline and Go Ahead), and Stagecoach |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 4, 2024 11:00:22 GMT
Some drivers were only messaged 6 hours ago about them no longer having a job to come to today(aware there's tupe but they won't be instant and most drivers are agency based who will now have to scrounge for other work for their drivers), however most of them had already found out through other channels. Quite a few drivers keep mentioning there is an investigation into the operation of Sullivan Buses? which they can't comment on and the demise in the TfL side of the company is well deserved. Very true, a few drivers who had regular work with them as agency are now gutted as they would not be covered by any TUPE. Now this coming week is going to be harder to get work. The two large agency contractors may struggle to get some of them work with other companies as many companies has filled up a lot of driver shortages over the past few months. Spoke with a few drivers I know work for them yesterday who said there was no prior warning and they had liked working for them. |
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Post by lj61nwc on Aug 4, 2024 11:04:34 GMT
Some drivers were only messaged 6 hours ago about them no longer having a job to come to today(aware there's tupe but they won't be instant and most drivers are agency based who will now have to scrounge for other work for their drivers), however most of them had already found out through other channels. Quite a few drivers keep mentioning there is an investigation into the operation of Sullivan Buses? which they can't comment on and the demise in the TfL side of the company is well deserved. Very true, a few drivers who had regular work with them as agency are now gutted as they would not be covered by any TUPE. Now this coming week is going to be harder to get work. The two large agency contractors may struggle to get some of them work with other companies as many companies has filled up a lot of driver shortages over the past few months. Spoke with a few drivers I know work for them yesterday who said there was no prior warning and they had liked working for them. Yep, it's been confirmed quite a few (I'm not sure of how many or if it's all of the TfL rota drivers) have been made redundant and they've been referred to Quantuma to get instructions about redundancy pay eligibility etc. |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 4, 2024 11:05:56 GMT
Can't say I'm surprised the writing was on the wall for several years now. A sad los. Surprised that a bigger operator like Metroline didn't take all Sullivan tfl bus routes and take their buses. I doubt Metroline would have bought the operations. The contracts were not making money and would require a different model that did nor depend so much on agency drivers. |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 4, 2024 11:07:22 GMT
Don't know about that and best to wait and see not speculate , but I remember everyone on here being shocked when Sullivans won the 549 as seemed a bit far compared to WH ? I think that's the last route they won and don't think it was that long ago , but suppose since 2020 a lot of operators have been handing back routes , maybe they should of done this and re-bid ? Still a few routes being awarded with Diesels albeit 3 year contracts and maybe worked out a Electric strategy from there . People slate Dean but I think it's refreshing to see a "open book" owner/director of a company , I don't understand people saying they are cowboys when they've openly said they aren't making money ? Why would they put people over profit ? Whole point of a business is to make a profit it's Tfl's who should be putting people over profit , Pretty poor from them to just text drivers though and hence why probably alot of services ran bshite last night and to be fair don't blame them I would bring the bus back right away aswell finding out over text loosing my job , Another thing though using Agency Drivers must cost a fair bit ? When I worked in Haulage would cost the company around £20 a hour for a Class 2 Driver when wages were around £10/12 a hour so sure it's a lot worst now for Bus Drivers . Is he being honest? There is no mention in his statement that the meeting with TfL was primarily called to address the appalling performance by Sullivan on its contracts. Poor vehicle availability and a driver shortage were issues totally within his control but he appears not to have done anything to address them for months. All of which require money.... |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 4, 2024 11:09:14 GMT
The buses are owned by Sullivan's. You can't just take them. What about borrow them until Metroline can find enough spare buses they own? There are so many other spare compliant buses across the network and at other bus sales specialists like Ensigns. So why would TfL go to them for. Even if they did, it is highly unlikely Sullivans would let them borrow them or even rent them to TfL if they have been drip feeding them money in the past. |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 4, 2024 11:22:17 GMT
You always bash Rainham, but I really don’t see your issue their services are run really well apart from the 174 which is largely down to the nature of the route and even that is not diabolical Your 365 bashing I certainly don’t agree with considering I use the route daily and I live on line of route! There are much worse garages out there. i hate to break it to you but Stagecoach have a firm hold on Romford and surrounding area. Live on the Clockhouse Lane End of the 365, which happens to be the only section that is solely 365 (in both direction) and the service we get is horrendous, our buses are almost always terminated short of Havering Park, I've regularly experienced long 30-40 mins gaps in service on my section of route. Maintenance is in my opinion terrible compared to other garages like NS, BK, DX or RR, the buses are just terrible, refurb or not. I can only hope that someone else grabs up the 365, as the route deserves better. The only 'Decent' section of service on the 365 seems to be between Romford and Orchard Village or whatever they call it. And personally I don't think when I see 3 or 4 365's running together, with all of them or most of them curtailed, is an example of a service run 'really well'. But alas TFL are blind to the fact that the 365 is one of the worst performing routes in Romford, behind the 5 and 86 Anyways, back to the Sullivan's thing I use the 365 and find it is better run than the 174. Although I do not use the section north of Havering Rd, so would not experience the problems you mention. |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 4, 2024 11:25:07 GMT
Live on the Clockhouse Lane End of the 365, which happens to be the only section that is solely 365 (in both direction) and the service we get is horrendous, our buses are almost always terminated short of Havering Park, I've regularly experienced long 30-40 mins gaps in service on my section of route. Maintenance is in my opinion terrible compared to other garages like NS, BK, DX or RR, the buses are just terrible, refurb or not. I can only hope that someone else grabs up the 365, as the route deserves better. The only 'Decent' section of service on the 365 seems to be between Romford and Orchard Village or whatever they call it. And personally I don't think when I see 3 or 4 365's running together, with all of them or most of them curtailed, is an example of a service run 'really well'. But alas TFL are blind to the fact that the 365 is one of the worst performing routes in Romford, behind the 5 and 86 Anyways, back to the Sullivan's thing Funny enough I am also on the Collier Row end of the 365, and I don’t see your concern, there are a FEW turns to Romford, Parkside Avenue but they mainly get pulled towards Beam Park normally to South Hornchurch or Elm Park, Recently there have been numerous roadworks on line of route in the Romford area and also Elm Park area, so the service WAS affected then like all routes in the area, and as for maintenance you do crack me up, I can’t believe you live on line of route with the rubbish your spouting with all due respect. I look forward to you actually using the route  And I can gaurentee it’s staying with Stagecoach, GAL/Arriva aren’t out of the question but Stagecoach are situated well and will likely undercut the other 2 with prices. oh and as for maintenance I’d say RM are better than DX, RR and GY, NS & RM are far superior with presentation then GAL & Arriva in the area specially with blinds your lucky to see a 103 the blinds set correctly, rare. No way are [RM] better than [NS] are you having a laugh? The exterior and even worst the interior is a world apart. |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Aug 4, 2024 11:27:51 GMT
You don't ever see the 'Collier Row' curtailments as they don't show up on LVF, the countdown timers or inside the bus. I use the route almost every day, and it's always a gamble, whether I waste my time waiting for the 365 or just get whatever and walk. And I don't think having loose handrails, peeling paint, crappy overpainted handrails and the fact the MMC's at NS were recently beginning to smoke, isn't what I call 'Presentable' and neither is that God Awful Interior Stagecoach has. I don't use the 103 as it goes no where near Clockhouse Lane or anywhere that I need to go, therefore I don't care for it and any route that I don't use on a daily basis Again End of Debate, back to the original thread. I live in Romford- I've not seen any MMCs "smoking." I think it is when the buses do a regen, only lasts fro about 10 minutes then the exhaust is clear. |
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And I can gaurentee it’s staying with Stagecoach, GAL/Arriva aren’t out of the question but Stagecoach are situated well and will likely undercut the other 2 with prices.