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Post by 6HP502C on May 20, 2015 19:41:17 GMT
I see the 35 has appeared on the South London map as a 24 hour route. I don't think this is a proposal, certainly not one in connection with the Night Tube anyway. Now removed from the South London map (breathes sigh of relief). It might be near dead west of Old Street, but like Shoreditch, Old Street lacks alternative links to Elephant and South London.
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Post by ThinLizzy on May 20, 2015 19:53:20 GMT
I'm all for the weekend night 145, no more taxi fares home from The Cauliflower in Seven Kings :-D
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Post by 6HP502C on May 20, 2015 20:01:27 GMT
Also noteworthy to see the N47, Night 47 and N199 changes to add capacity into inner South East London. I like the way the scheme has panned out. There is a move towards standardisation and 24 hour routes, but I'd object to the N47 being pulled out of Trafalgar Square given it tends to load well. It'll be interesting to see what happens in terms of the N199's contract as it will essentially be a new route. It can't replace the N47's contract, as that void will almost certainly be filled with the night element of the 47. Will the N199 have to go out to tender and can it be issued for a short term that aligns with the 199's contract dates? What happens if the 199 gets a 2 year extension? And so on.
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Post by snoggle on May 20, 2015 20:25:13 GMT
Also noteworthy to see the N47, Night 47 and N199 changes to add capacity into inner South East London. I like the way the scheme has panned out. There is a move towards standardisation and 24 hour routes, but I'd object to the N47 being pulled out of Trafalgar Square given it tends to load well. It'll be interesting to see what happens in terms of the N199's contract as it will essentially be a new route. It can't replace the N47's contract, as that void will almost certainly be filled with the night element of the 47. Will the N199 have to go out to tender and can it be issued for a short term that aligns with the 199's contract dates? What happens if the 199 gets a 2 year extension? And so on. I assume all the changes, if they go ahead, will simply be variations to existing contracts. While operators will want a fair price for the work I can't see anyone being so awkward over variation values that they risk TfL having to go to market and letting another operator in on a route. If you were Stagecoach would you "play ball" or be "the awkward squad" over the 47/N47/199/N199 changes? I think I would "play ball" provided I wasn't being shafted by TfL over the variation value. TfL have pretty flexible variation rights under the bus contracts and they need them in order to deal with possibly large scale changes driven by policy changes as seems to apply in this case although it's more a consequence of a Tube policy rather than a bus policy change.
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Post by sid on May 20, 2015 20:31:30 GMT
Also noteworthy to see the N47, Night 47 and N199 changes to add capacity into inner South East London. I like the way the scheme has panned out. There is a move towards standardisation and 24 hour routes, but I'd object to the N47 being pulled out of Trafalgar Square given it tends to load well. It'll be interesting to see what happens in terms of the N199's contract as it will essentially be a new route. It can't replace the N47's contract, as that void will almost certainly be filled with the night element of the 47. Will the N199 have to go out to tender and can it be issued for a short term that aligns with the 199's contract dates? What happens if the 199 gets a 2 year extension? And so on. I suppose in theory the N199 should load just as well from Trafalgar Square but I do worry sometimes that keeping everything neat and tidy and standardised is a bigger priority than actually meeting passenger requirements.
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Post by M1199 on May 20, 2015 21:54:31 GMT
About time Uxbridge got a night service to the vicinity of Heathrow Airport (would of liked the U3 to of been given a night service, but hey ho!) I can see it becoming popular with airport workers in the Cowley and West Drayton areas. It's also good on a personal level too, I'll be able to get the 222 home from Uxbridge after a night out on the lash and more importantly, it'll mean I won't have to wake up at 4am on my days off to drop my gf off at work!
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Post by vjaska on May 20, 2015 23:00:46 GMT
I don't think you need to alternate journeys to North Cheam - if North Cheam needs a night service, it would be easier to convert the 93 to 24 hours especially as it serves Putney Bridge Station. The 93 is 24hours lol Whoops lol.
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Post by 700101 on May 21, 2015 8:22:13 GMT
The N199 is a great idea but I think keeping the N47 running from Trafalgar Sq then run via Aldwych, Fetter Lane, Old Street, Shoreditch then run via day service on the 47 to Catford then via The 202 to Sydenham run via 75 to Croydon. This gives Lower Sydenham a night bus plus brings back a night service over 3/4 of the 75 route
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Post by vjaska on May 21, 2015 11:55:05 GMT
The N199 is a great idea but I think keeping the N47 running from Trafalgar Sq then run via Aldwych, Fetter Lane, Old Street, Shoreditch then run via day service on the 47 to Catford then via The 202 to Sydenham run via 75 to Croydon. This gives Lower Sydenham a night bus plus brings back a night service over 3/4 of the 75 route I'd prefer there to have the N75 re-introduced but extended from Lewisham to Woolwich via the 54.
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Post by YY13VKP on May 21, 2015 19:09:16 GMT
Why is the 154 becoming 24hrs? When i use the 154, there are little passengers. Unless it was proposed this will connect to the Northern line when that becomes 24hr Southern croydon needs a 24hr or night bus service, as we only have two, the 119 and the N68. It would be good if they proposed to extend the N68 to Caterham-on-the-Hill or Caterham Station
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Post by sid on May 21, 2015 19:14:39 GMT
Why is the 154 becoming 24hrs? When i use the 154, there are little passengers. Unless it was proposed this will connect to the Northern line when that becomes 24hr Southern croydon needs a 24hr or night bus service, as we only have two, the 119 and the N68. It would be good if they proposed to extend the N68 to Caterham-on-the-Hill or Caterham Station You only have two night routes? That's two more than some areas! Not a bad idea about the N68 though, maybe even down the hill to Caterham Station? As for the 154, do you really think there shouldn't be a night service between Croydon and Sutton?
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Post by thesquirrels on May 21, 2015 19:27:08 GMT
Why is the 154 becoming 24hrs? When i use the 154, there are little passengers. Unless it was proposed this will connect to the Northern line when that becomes 24hr Southern croydon needs a 24hr or night bus service, as we only have two, the 119 and the N68. It would be good if they proposed to extend the N68 to Caterham-on-the-Hill or Caterham Station If I'm not mistaken this will be the third attempt LT/TfL will have made to run a night bus from Croydon to Sutton via Roundshaw (N54/N88 in the 80s, N213 in the noughties, now the 24-hr 154). There are either some vociferous local campaigners in the area or someone at LBL really, really wants Carshalton to be on the night bus map! Are there any other examples of 'third trys' on the night network?
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Post by snoggle on May 21, 2015 20:03:52 GMT
Why is the 154 becoming 24hrs? When i use the 154, there are little passengers. Unless it was proposed this will connect to the Northern line when that becomes 24hr Southern croydon needs a 24hr or night bus service, as we only have two, the 119 and the N68. It would be good if they proposed to extend the N68 to Caterham-on-the-Hill or Caterham Station What you really mean to say is "I want a Night Bus, I want a Night Bus, I want a Night Bus, I want a Night Bus and I want it NOW!" Plenty of places that don't have such a service and that will remain true even after the Night Tube is running on more lines than the first phase in Sept 2015.
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Post by snoggle on May 21, 2015 20:22:51 GMT
Why is the 154 becoming 24hrs? When i use the 154, there are little passengers. Unless it was proposed this will connect to the Northern line when that becomes 24hr Southern croydon needs a 24hr or night bus service, as we only have two, the 119 and the N68. It would be good if they proposed to extend the N68 to Caterham-on-the-Hill or Caterham Station If I'm not mistaken this will be the third attempt LT/TfL will have made to run a night bus from Croydon to Sutton via Roundshaw (N54/N88 in the 80s, N213 in the noughties, now the 24-hr 154). There are either some vociferous local campaigners in the area or someone at LBL really, really wants Carshalton to be on the night bus map! Are there any other examples of 'third trys' on the night network? I think part of the problem is that there is some night time demand on the Croydon - Sutton - Kingston corridor between the main centres. I am rather doubtful as to how much there is for stops in between these places. Given that TfL happily killed off the N213 back in 2009 despite a growing level of patronage I don't think there are any "champions" at Palestra Towers. There has been an ongoing campaign by Tom Brake MP and others to get a night bus reinstated. I doubt it would have been credible for TfL not to put in a link from Morden to Sutton. Running the route on to Croydon offers the chance to quell local campaigners for a period of time. They'll be back demanding it runs every night - as I expect will happen with some of the other Night Tube weekend buses. Looking at the patronage numbers it was carrying 87k pass jnys pa in 2009 and subsequently the shorter route has settled around 60k pass jnys per year. It is the third lowest used Night Bus service in Greater London which could put it at risk if we ever got into a funding cuts scenario. I can see why TfL have put the weekend 154 on the list but if it isn't used very well then I don't see it lasting. Based on comments in another place it seems the weekend services will be reviewed after a few months of Night Tube operation as will the main Night Buses. I think we can probably expect to see further adjustments in the first half of next year.
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Post by vjaska on May 21, 2015 23:42:35 GMT
Norwood Junction has no night service at all yet historically has had at least one night bus route serving it since the 80's. The following have served the area over the years:
N69 from 1989 to 1994 N70 from 1996 to 1999 N75 from 2002 to 2004 24 hour 75 from 2004 to 2009
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