|
|
Post by john on Dec 12, 2016 9:43:17 GMT
I enjoy rota life. Have had it easier trying to plan stuff in and organise my own affairs. Luckily enough, I'm enjoying the 287 itself. You get to learn the route on a more intimate basis (traffic conditions/times, traffic light timings and passengers/customers). Love it!!! It's easy to work out the traffic on conditions on 177. Very early in the morning and late at night - good. All other times - Bad  So pretty much the same as the 287!!! 😆😆😆😆 |
|
|
|
Post by nickfreckle on Dec 12, 2016 9:57:00 GMT
At least you don't have New Cross and Deptford |
|
|
|
Post by Alex on Dec 12, 2016 13:44:43 GMT
Yeah, all the routes are standalone now - although I think the 53's have a school bus chucked in for good measure. Thanks - well, the positive is that the 177 is a longer run (I could imagine the 472 getting a bit tedious and would even the 291 be on it's own too? The ultimate in repetitiveness) so not the end of the world (I'd imagine)....... |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2016 18:08:03 GMT
At the provincial operator I soon start training at, most rotas have regular work on at least 3 or 4 routes, with odd journeys thrown in on various other random ones. Drivers on spare learn every route in the depot. In ways it's a shame that many London drivers only do one route.
|
|
|
|
Post by nickfreckle on Dec 12, 2016 18:10:58 GMT
Yeah, all the routes are standalone now - although I think the 53's have a school bus chucked in for good measure. Thanks - well, the positive is that the 177 is a longer run (I could imagine the 472 getting a bit tedious and would even the 291 be on it's own too? The ultimate in repetitiveness) so not the end of the world (I'd imagine)....... I love the 472. hardly any stand time, zipping back and forwards. The duties fly by. Green Road takes a hammering mind. |
|
|
|
Post by jay38a on Dec 12, 2016 18:45:59 GMT
Kapow! On rota from X-Mas eve. 177. Not completely enamoured with it, but at least I know what I'm going to be doing weeks in advance now. i know Steve09 always said to me that the 177 is one route where normally there is enough running time no matter what time of day it is. |
|
|
|
Post by londonbusboy on Dec 12, 2016 20:05:01 GMT
At the provincial operator I soon start training at, most rotas have regular work on at least 3 or 4 routes, with odd journeys thrown in on various other random ones. Drivers on spare learn every route in the depot. In ways it's a shame that many London drivers only do one route. TUPE stopped common rotas a shame really as 1 route does get boring. I have heard that TUPE has changed slightly in that if an operator wins a route off another company they can refuse drivers from coming over with it. |
|
|
|
Post by Alex on Dec 13, 2016 0:39:52 GMT
I love the 472. hardly any stand time, zipping back and forwards. The duties fly by. Green Road takes a hammering mind. Interesting point about stand time, where I am they are always trying to get stands increased! The route I'm curious about is the 122, my favourite route in London. To hear from the drivers POV on this would be a real insight : ) |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2016 9:42:18 GMT
I have heard that TUPE has changed slightly in that if an operator wins a route off another company they can refuse drivers from coming over with it. Not unilaterally, no. From reading posts on here it seems a lot like bus operators don't really care about the responsibilities they have under TUPE. Ridiculously ineffective unions seems to create a lot of opportunity for sham consultations |
|
|
|
Post by snowman on Dec 13, 2016 10:06:39 GMT
I have heard that TUPE has changed slightly in that if an operator wins a route off another company they can refuse drivers from coming over with it. Not unilaterally, no. From reading posts on here it seems a lot like bus operators don't really care about the responsibilities they have under TUPE. Ridiculously ineffective unions seems to create a lot of opportunity for sham consultations The rule is subject to : only the employees who can be clearly identified as providing the service are protected. This means that someone allocated to a route being transferred is protected, but someone in a general pool that includes the route isn't. The new company is obliged to take those protected, but not the others. The employee doesn't have to go and is free to leave as long as notice is given to leave on transfer date. The old employer needs to give new employer at least 4 weeks notice of name, age, main details of employment. Also disiplinary action, any employee grieviences, and any legal action in last 2 years |
|
|
|
Post by SILENCED on Dec 13, 2016 10:18:26 GMT
Not unilaterally, no. From reading posts on here it seems a lot like bus operators don't really care about the responsibilities they have under TUPE. Ridiculously ineffective unions seems to create a lot of opportunity for sham consultations The rule is subject to : only the employees who can be clearly identified as providing the service are protected. This means that someone allocated to a route being transferred is protected, but someone in a general pool that includes the route isn't. The new company is obliged to take those protected, but not the others. The employee doesn't have to go and is free to leave as long as notice is given to leave on transfer date. The old employer needs to give new employer at least 4 weeks notice of name, age, main details of employment. Also disiplinary action, any employee grieviences, and any legal action in last 2 years The accepted rule is if over 50% of your role is transferring you are within scope of TUPE. Now this should apply to other staff as well as drivers eg controllers. It is up to the company losing the contract to invoke TUPE and follow the correct processes and rules, otherwise the employees remain their responsibility. TUPE should not be either optional or voluntary. You are either within scope or not. I think if the losing company wanted to transfer say 5 out 35 drivers over on TUPE, this could be refused as TUPE can not be selective. |
|
|
|
Post by sid on Dec 13, 2016 10:56:00 GMT
Thanks - well, the positive is that the 177 is a longer run (I could imagine the 472 getting a bit tedious and would even the 291 be on it's own too? The ultimate in repetitiveness) so not the end of the world (I'd imagine)....... I love the 472. hardly any stand time, zipping back and forwards. The duties fly by. Green Road takes a hammering mind. The more stand time the better seems to be the popular view amongst drivers  ! |
|
|
|
Post by snowman on Dec 13, 2016 11:55:06 GMT
The rule is subject to : only the employees who can be clearly identified as providing the service are protected. This means that someone allocated to a route being transferred is protected, but someone in a general pool that includes the route isn't. The new company is obliged to take those protected, but not the others. The employee doesn't have to go and is free to leave as long as notice is given to leave on transfer date. The old employer needs to give new employer at least 4 weeks notice of name, age, main details of employment. Also disiplinary action, any employee grieviences, and any legal action in last 2 years The accepted rule is if over 50% of your role is transferring you are within scope of TUPE. Now this should apply to other staff as well as drivers eg controllers. It is up to the company losing the contract to invoke TUPE and follow the correct processes and rules, otherwise the employees remain their responsibility. TUPE should not be either optional or voluntary. You are either within scope or not. I think if the losing company wanted to transfer say 5 out 35 drivers over on TUPE, this could be refused as TUPE can not be selective. Correct. However the oddity with the London bus tenders is they are (supposed) to be announced about 8 months ahead (to allow purchase of vehicles and set up time). But the TUPE only needs to be declared few weeks ahead. Therefore it is easy to adjust Rotas in meantime to select who you want to leave (more strictly who will be covered). The grey area in the middle has resulted in plenty of case law following employment tribunals. TUPE cannot change conditions of employment so sometimes oddities have to be carried over (example if contract says you get national Arriva travel pass then new employer would have to continue it and buy it for you) |
|
|
|
Post by SILENCED on Dec 13, 2016 12:03:48 GMT
The accepted rule is if over 50% of your role is transferring you are within scope of TUPE. Now this should apply to other staff as well as drivers eg controllers. It is up to the company losing the contract to invoke TUPE and follow the correct processes and rules, otherwise the employees remain their responsibility. TUPE should not be either optional or voluntary. You are either within scope or not. I think if the losing company wanted to transfer say 5 out 35 drivers over on TUPE, this could be refused as TUPE can not be selective. Correct. However the oddity with the London bus tenders is they are (supposed) to be announced about 8 months ahead (to allow purchase of vehicles and set up time). But the TUPE only needs to be declared few weeks ahead. Therefore it is easy to adjust Rotas in meantime to select who you want to leave (more strictly who will be covered). The grey area in the middle has resulted in plenty of case law following employment tribunals. TUPE cannot change conditions of employment so sometimes oddities have to be carried over (example if contract says you get national Arriva travel pass then new employer would have to continue it and buy it for you) The losing company needs to be careful as if it fiddles too much has potential to invalidate the whole process. My experience has been with IT out-sourcing, so not sure how the rules are stretched and bent in the bus industry. Unless things have changed employees must be given a minimum 12 weeks notice of TUPE, except where the existing employer is unlikely to financially survive 12 weeks ... which should not apply to TfL contracts If your contract states that then yes, but most of those benefits are non-contractual |
|
|
|
Post by nickfreckle on Dec 13, 2016 23:56:14 GMT
I love the 472. hardly any stand time, zipping back and forwards. The duties fly by. Green Road takes a hammering mind. The more stand time the better seems to be the popular view amongst drivers ! Enough time for a slash and a quick ciggie, and I'm happy. |
|
!